Do Cessationists Miss Out on the Full Joys of Christianity?

00:00:00.000 | Well, we talk a lot about joy in God in this podcast.

00:00:07.000 | We love talking about joy in God.

00:00:08.800 | It's at the very core, at the very heart of what we do at Desiring God.

00:00:13.200 | So it raises the question, how closely connected is the full experience of our joy in God to

00:00:18.000 | the charisma, the gifts of the spirit outlined by Paul in the epistles of the New Testament?

00:00:23.800 | Like in 1 Corinthians 14, for example, where he talks about the gifts of tongues and of

00:00:28.040 | prophecy.

00:00:29.040 | It's a question from a listener named Matthew.

00:00:30.800 | Dear Pastor John, thank you for the podcast.

00:00:32.600 | I appreciate Tony's continued invitation for listeners to send in questions that get to

00:00:37.360 | the very foundations of what this podcast represents.

00:00:39.600 | Amen.

00:00:40.600 | Keep them coming.

00:00:41.600 | So here's mine.

00:00:42.600 | How essential is continuationist theology for experiencing the fullest expression of Christian

00:00:47.280 | hedonism?

00:00:48.520 | In other words, if I am a cessationist, will my joy be incomplete?

00:00:54.000 | Let's begin with three definitions so that we know what we're talking about.

00:00:58.760 | First, I assume that when Matthew asks about continuationist theology, he's referring to

00:01:08.360 | the view that the spiritual gifts mentioned in 1 Corinthians 12 to 14 are still available

00:01:16.520 | and operative in some measure today.

00:01:19.600 | Second, I assume he means by cessationism the view that the extraordinary supernatural

00:01:28.960 | gifts like speaking in tongues, prophecy, healing, discerning of spirits, and so on,

00:01:34.560 | are no longer given by the spirit and should not be pursued today.

00:01:41.080 | That's cessationism.

00:01:42.680 | And third, by Christian hedonism, I take him to mean my view that God is most glorified

00:01:48.440 | in us when we are most satisfied in him, and that therefore it is our duty to pursue maximum

00:01:56.920 | satisfaction in God so that he might be maximally glorified in us.

00:02:02.680 | Those are my three definitions.

00:02:05.960 | And the question that is being asked is whether the denial of the presence of spiritual gifts

00:02:15.000 | will limit the goal of Christian hedonism, namely the maximum joy in God for the sake

00:02:20.320 | of maximum glorification of God, and two, to put it positively, would the pursuit of

00:02:29.600 | spiritual gifts enlarge the outcome of our pursuit of joy in God for the sake of his

00:02:35.760 | glory?

00:02:38.400 | Now there are several things that I need to clarify here before I give a specific answer

00:02:43.200 | to that question.

00:02:44.680 | The first important clarification to give is that any given cessationist may have greater

00:02:54.400 | joy in God than any given continuationist, and vice versa.

00:03:01.480 | In other words, nothing in continuationism guarantees that the Christ-exalting joy of

00:03:09.940 | every continuationist will be greater than the Christ-exalting joy of every cessationist.

00:03:16.000 | That's not true.

00:03:18.000 | There are too many other factors involved to make that judgment.

00:03:22.760 | That's the first thing that really needs to be kept in mind.

00:03:26.120 | Here's the second one.

00:03:28.480 | Spiritual gifts are only spiritual in the fullest biblical sense—that is, made holy

00:03:34.320 | and beautiful and Christ-exalting by the shaping power of the Holy Spirit in them.

00:03:39.320 | They are only spiritual in that fullest biblical sense when the Holy Spirit makes them so,

00:03:46.880 | which means that in and of themselves they may not be a sign that a person is spiritual

00:03:55.280 | or even born again.

00:03:57.240 | Now I know that sounds strange to some people, that an unregenerate, unchristian person could

00:04:05.440 | speak in tongues or perform healing, but that's true.

00:04:09.480 | The devil himself is going to produce deceptive signs and wonders at the close of the age

00:04:14.840 | (2 Thessalonians 2:9), and Paul says amazingly in the first three verses of 1 Corinthians

00:04:21.520 | 13 that we can speak in tongues, we can have all knowledge of mysteries, we can move mountains.

00:04:29.320 | And yet if we don't have love, the premier grace of the Holy Spirit, if we don't have

00:04:36.000 | love, we're a noisy gong, a clanging cymbal, and we morally, spiritually amount to nothing,

00:04:45.800 | he says.

00:04:46.800 | That's damning for those who have spiritual gifts, but don't have love.

00:04:51.840 | In other words, speaking in tongues, prophesying, moving mountains may not be spiritual in that

00:04:58.620 | fullest sense.

00:05:00.560 | And what this means is that spiritual gifts are, in an important sense, like other natural

00:05:07.840 | gifts, like food, sunsets, friends, children, music.

00:05:16.360 | All of those things can become means by which we know God and taste God more fully and thus

00:05:26.400 | enjoy him more fully and glorify him more fully, or they can become replacements for

00:05:32.720 | God and actually detract us from the enjoyment of God himself.

00:05:38.400 | That's true for natural gifts in nature.

00:05:41.340 | It's true for spiritual gifts that are not infused by the Holy Spirit.

00:05:48.000 | So with those clarifications, my answer to the question is, all other things being equal,

00:05:57.520 | a person who pursues spiritual gifts can experience the goal of Christian hedonism more fully

00:06:06.400 | than a person who doesn't.

00:06:09.320 | All other things being equal.

00:06:12.920 | That's because God has given spiritual gifts as a means of ministry to his people, and

00:06:21.320 | these gifts are points of supernatural encounter with the living God in which he shows more

00:06:28.200 | of his power, more of his wisdom, more of his love to his people, and whenever God is

00:06:33.360 | showing more of himself, there is the possibility of our having more joy in him and seeing more

00:06:40.280 | of him and being more deeply satisfied in him and thus glorifying him more.

00:06:47.520 | So I think Paul's three commands to earnestly desire spiritual gifts in 1 Corinthians 12

00:06:57.680 | and 14 are in fact given both for the upbuilding of the body of Christ and for the increase

00:07:04.720 | of our joy in him.

00:07:06.280 | He says, "Earnestly desire the higher gifts," 1 Corinthians 12, 31.

00:07:12.720 | He says in 14.1, "Pursue love and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that

00:07:20.280 | you may prophesy."

00:07:21.960 | And in 14.39, "Earnestly desire that you may prophesy and do not forbid speaking in tongues."

00:07:29.960 | So Paul is not, when he says that, he's not seeking the diminishment of our delight in

00:07:38.200 | God when he makes these commands.

00:07:41.520 | He's seeking the increase of our joy in God as we see him show his power and show his

00:07:49.360 | love to his people through us.

00:07:53.520 | So yes, I think all other things being equal, a person who pursues spiritual gifts can experience

00:08:02.840 | the goal of Christian hedonism more fully than a person who doesn't.

00:08:08.280 | That's good, and worth thinking about very carefully.

00:08:10.720 | Pastor John, thank you for maintaining this priority on joy and the earnest pursuit of

00:08:15.880 | the Holy Spirit over the years.

00:08:17.040 | I really appreciate that.

00:08:18.480 | And thanks for listening to the podcast.

00:08:20.160 | Of course, you can stay current with our episodes on your phone or device by subscribing through

00:08:24.120 | your preferred podcast catcher app.

00:08:27.600 | And I know a lot of you join us at the gym or on your way to or from work, and so we're

00:08:33.200 | always grateful to be along with you in your day.

00:08:36.680 | If you want to search our past episodes in our archive, we have a bunch of them, about

00:08:40.160 | 1,200 episodes now.

00:08:41.760 | And if you want to send us an email of your own, even questions about the very foundations

00:08:44.920 | of what we talk about, things like God's sovereignty, his chief desire for his glory, and his appeal

00:08:51.040 | to us that our joy would be full in him, we love those kinds of questions.

00:08:55.960 | You can search the archive.

00:08:57.580 | You can send us an email.

00:08:58.580 | You can do that through desiringgod.org/askpastorjohn.

00:09:04.520 | Well what does the Apostle Paul mean when he says we are to judge angels in 1 Corinthians

00:09:09.880 | 6 verse 3?

00:09:10.960 | It's an incredible text.

00:09:12.640 | But what exactly does it mean?

00:09:14.720 | That is how we will begin the week together.

00:09:17.200 | I'm your host Tony Reinke.

00:09:18.880 | Have a great weekend.

00:09:19.880 | We'll see you on Monday.

00:09:20.400 | [END]

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Do Cessationists Miss Out on the Full Joys of Christianity?

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