Lecture 7: Marriage and Family Counseling

00:00:00.000 | [ Silence ]

00:00:06.020 | During our last class period together, we began talking

00:00:11.480 | about some of the questions that could be asked

00:00:16.200 | in gathering good information, gathering good data,

00:00:20.840 | asking appropriate questions, listening carefully.

00:00:24.960 | And we gave you some examples from a problem-centered approach

00:00:28.880 | and that is questions, the whole series of questions

00:00:31.840 | that are zeroed around particular problems

00:00:34.960 | that husbands and wives have and that they face.

00:00:40.440 | Now, we're transitioning to questions

00:00:43.200 | of more positive perspective.

00:00:46.220 | And let's take a look at a few of these.

00:00:48.320 | These are very helpful in counseling as well.

00:00:51.120 | What ways do you seek to show that you care or love

00:00:56.440 | or appreciate your spouse or that other member

00:01:01.520 | of the family, your parents,

00:01:03.240 | if you were addressing the children, or your children

00:01:05.760 | if you're addressing the parents.

00:01:07.560 | What ways do you seek to show that you care, you love,

00:01:13.280 | and you appreciate that particular person?

00:01:16.280 | This is also a good question if you have parents

00:01:18.320 | who are favoring one child over another.

00:01:20.280 | And that happens frequently.

00:01:22.720 | The child that's not being favored,

00:01:24.880 | and what ways do you seek to show that you really favor

00:01:28.920 | or at least love that person?

00:01:33.280 | Well, let's go back to the marriage.

00:01:36.360 | Then what attracted you to your spouse is another question.

00:01:39.880 | What were some of the things that attracted you?

00:01:41.360 | I mean, at this particular point in your marriage,

00:01:43.720 | maybe all you see is that which is negative.

00:01:45.680 | You see all the negative things that's going on in their life

00:01:49.320 | and that's repulsive to you.

00:01:51.160 | So you have a difficulty respecting them

00:01:52.960 | and you have a difficulty loving them.

00:01:55.160 | And I think we've talked about a little bit how respect

00:01:58.560 | in romantic love, this is only in romantic love,

00:02:02.040 | respect always precedes love.

00:02:04.680 | All right?

00:02:05.000 | Respect always precedes love in romantic love.

00:02:07.640 | Now, that isn't true in other types of love

00:02:09.240 | because the Bible says that we can, Jesus says there

00:02:12.640 | on the Sermon on the Mount in Matthew 5, 43 through 48,

00:02:15.920 | that we can even love our neighbors,

00:02:18.160 | not just love our neighbors, but love our enemies.

00:02:22.840 | And I don't know anybody that respects their enemies.

00:02:26.600 | So in that particular case, that kind of love,

00:02:32.120 | which is not a romantic type of love, doesn't necessarily assume

00:02:38.680 | or preclude, is precluded by respect.

00:02:42.160 | However, romantic love is.

00:02:43.480 | If there's going to be a romantic love,

00:02:46.280 | you always respect that person before you love them.

00:02:49.160 | There are some marriages, however, who a husband

00:02:52.120 | or a wife or possibly both

00:02:53.800 | of them have lost respect for one another.

00:02:58.520 | And so it's very difficult for them to think

00:03:00.960 | about anything positive about their spouse.

00:03:03.720 | Now, that hasn't always been true.

00:03:08.840 | They wouldn't have married that person

00:03:09.920 | if there wasn't something positive about them.

00:03:11.960 | So way back, what was it that you saw

00:03:14.120 | in your spouse that was positive?

00:03:16.080 | What did you like?

00:03:19.080 | What attracted you to that particular individual?

00:03:23.440 | That's a good question.

00:03:28.080 | Number three, tell us some fun times that you've had

00:03:32.360 | or fun things that you've done.

00:03:36.040 | What have you done that has been fun in the past?

00:03:40.840 | Sometimes in my undergraduate classes,

00:03:44.920 | I try to encourage inter-gender relationships there

00:03:50.840 | at the college.

00:03:52.200 | And so I tell them I give extra credit for girls and guys

00:03:56.520 | who date master's college students, all right?

00:03:59.800 | And they always want to know how much that credit is and,

00:04:02.720 | you know, and how many points do I get if I do this?

00:04:07.520 | What's it?

00:04:08.200 | >> I'm dating one.

00:04:10.640 | >> You are.

00:04:12.600 | Yeah, you're dating one also, see?

00:04:14.680 | See, they get extra credit.

00:04:16.720 | But usually what I'm referring to is life credit, not points.

00:04:23.040 | They get life credit.

00:04:23.920 | They get a lot of credit.

00:04:24.960 | That's pretty serious credit for doing that.

00:04:27.560 | Now, don't tell them that.

00:04:30.920 | Yes, you both are dating one of them, okay?

00:04:33.000 | See, there you go.

00:04:34.800 | And they'll get a lot of life credit for that.

00:04:36.840 | So when they look back upon their relationship,

00:04:42.680 | every couple at one particular point

00:04:44.600 | or another had some really fun times.

00:04:47.080 | Well, what happened during those fun times?

00:04:49.240 | What did you do?

00:04:50.280 | What -- and there are some people that are just

00:04:54.040 | in this mindset of thinking so negatively about their spouse,

00:04:57.320 | it's very difficult for them to remember those times.

00:05:00.520 | But once you get them thinking back through those times

00:05:04.560 | and remembering some of those good times,

00:05:06.480 | that doesn't solve all the problems.

00:05:08.960 | But that does help them to begin to think that, yes,

00:05:13.080 | there is a possibility where this relationship is

00:05:15.600 | worth saving.

00:05:17.760 | It certainly would be a God-honoring thing for me

00:05:19.800 | to save this relationship and to work hard

00:05:22.520 | at making sure it was saved.

00:05:24.840 | And then, again, while we still have our mind thinking

00:05:30.600 | about what has happened in the past, looking back,

00:05:35.640 | what have you appreciated about your marriage or your spouse?

00:05:40.800 | What have you appreciated about them?

00:05:43.680 | Well, they've always told me the truth.

00:05:48.040 | That's good.

00:05:49.480 | Always told me the truth.

00:05:51.800 | Even though I haven't liked it, I'm good.

00:05:55.480 | I don't think they've ever lied to me.

00:05:57.480 | That's good.

00:05:58.600 | That's a good thing.

00:06:02.160 | They've always been faithful to our marriage,

00:06:04.360 | at least physically.

00:06:08.400 | I'll say to you, well, that's good.

00:06:09.880 | That's a positive thing.

00:06:12.760 | What have you really appreciated about them?

00:06:14.360 | Well, he or she has a good head for figures.

00:06:20.960 | They keep the books.

00:06:21.920 | They keep the finances of the home.

00:06:23.720 | And I appreciate that because I'm not so good at that.

00:06:27.160 | Or he or she is a mechanic.

00:06:28.960 | Or they love to fix things.

00:06:31.920 | And I really appreciate that because I'm not really

00:06:35.160 | good at fixing things, like the automobile or the car.

00:06:40.640 | Or he or she has a good sense of style.

00:06:42.840 | I never know what to wear, and they always

00:06:44.600 | help me what I need to wear out in public.

00:06:50.640 | So they have a good sense of style.

00:06:53.800 | Do you help Andrew out with his style?

00:06:55.760 | Oh, yeah.

00:06:56.260 | [LAUGHTER]

00:06:58.760 | You do.

00:07:01.880 | That's a good seminary wife.

00:07:04.760 | You'll be doing that a lot in ministry.

00:07:07.280 | You say, you're not going to wear that to that conference.

00:07:09.680 | No, no, no, not that tie and coat combination.

00:07:12.040 | There's got to be something in it.

00:07:15.320 | You made him change his tie today?

00:07:18.360 | That's good.

00:07:19.120 | That's good.

00:07:19.680 | That's really good.

00:07:20.760 | And that almost borders on a sin thing, doesn't it?

00:07:24.160 | I know, when it clashes.

00:07:25.160 | But it's not sin, but it borders on it.

00:07:28.880 | That's right.

00:07:29.840 | So let them look back.

00:07:31.800 | Let them point out those areas of their spouse

00:07:35.000 | that they really like, some things

00:07:37.720 | that they really appreciate.

00:07:39.040 | Let them think those things through.

00:07:41.560 | That sometimes is really helpful in getting

00:07:46.000 | them to think good thoughts instead

00:07:48.880 | of the negative, pessimistic, God-dishonoring thoughts

00:07:53.940 | about their spouse that they seem to get stuck in.

00:07:57.000 | Or here's another one.

00:08:02.960 | What's the nicest thing that your spouse ever did for you?

00:08:07.680 | What's the nicest thing they ever said to you?

00:08:12.160 | If they have a problem, then I start talking about,

00:08:14.960 | what about birthdays?

00:08:16.960 | What about Christmas holidays?

00:08:21.080 | What about early on during your anniversary?

00:08:29.260 | They ever do nice things for you?

00:08:31.340 | They ever do special things for you?

00:08:32.840 | What were they?

00:08:33.420 | We're zeroing in and taking a look

00:08:38.620 | at some of these positive things.

00:08:40.260 | Or number six, in what ways have you

00:08:47.340 | seen your marriage relationship grown since you were married?

00:08:52.780 | Now, hopefully, they're going to point to something that's good.

00:08:58.260 | Well, I've seen it grow in this area.

00:09:03.140 | We're stronger off financially than we used to be,

00:09:06.460 | they may say.

00:09:08.380 | We have more kids.

00:09:10.620 | That's certainly true.

00:09:13.420 | I've seen our family grow.

00:09:14.940 | So in what ways?

00:09:21.860 | Or I have a better understanding of sin because of my spouse.

00:09:27.980 | They may say that.

00:09:33.160 | I've had people say that.

00:09:36.660 | Or number seven, in years that you've been married,

00:09:39.460 | what have you done to make marriage successful?

00:09:43.020 | Now we, in a sense, put the shoe on the other foot.

00:09:45.300 | It's not what their spouse has done for them.

00:09:48.240 | Now we're sort of asking them, what

00:09:49.780 | have you done in order to make your marriage successful?

00:09:54.260 | Well, I've tried to do the right thing, you'll hear.

00:10:02.140 | I've prayed an awful lot about the marriage.

00:10:04.300 | Well, that's good.

00:10:05.060 | I've tried to remain faithful at church.

00:10:10.460 | Well, that's good, too.

00:10:11.540 | What other things have you done in order

00:10:16.260 | to make your marriage a success?

00:10:17.620 | I've tried not to return evil for evil.

00:10:26.700 | That's good.

00:10:27.260 | What is successful?

00:10:34.740 | And what's successful in your eyes,

00:10:37.540 | but then what's successful in God's eyes?

00:10:39.580 | What would God say would be successful?

00:10:42.580 | What would he say, wow, this was really

00:10:45.620 | something positive that you contributed to this marriage?

00:10:48.220 | Number eight, tell me about some of your first time experiences.

00:10:56.380 | Maybe it's when the two of you began to see each other,

00:11:04.460 | or you began dating, or you began courting.

00:11:08.180 | Tell me about some of those first time experiences.

00:11:09.900 | What happened?

00:11:10.500 | Earlier, I was teaching a class over at the college today,

00:11:18.940 | and it's actually a classroom full of girls.

00:11:23.740 | We've got mostly girls in the class.

00:11:25.300 | And they were really curious on how my wife and I

00:11:32.300 | met each other.

00:11:35.300 | And so I told the story of how we met each other.

00:11:39.980 | Actually, my wife knew my sister in college.

00:11:45.380 | And she needed a ride to a nearby town, Springfield, Ohio,

00:11:51.020 | actually, not far from where we went to school,

00:11:55.260 | in order to catch a bus to go home for the weekend.

00:11:58.740 | Now effectively, she was going home

00:12:00.380 | to break up with her high school sweetheart.

00:12:04.140 | But at that particular time, I didn't know that.

00:12:07.940 | So she said to my sister, you know,

00:12:12.780 | I need a ride to this town.

00:12:15.060 | My sister said, well, you know, I think my brother has a car.

00:12:19.740 | And I had a really fancy 1963 Ford Fairlane with big fins.

00:12:25.900 | It was robin's egg blue, and it leaked oil like a sieve.

00:12:31.580 | I had some kind of semblance of a vehicle.

00:12:35.780 | It was a glorified go-kart, is what it was.

00:12:38.740 | So one day when I was walking through the cafeteria line,

00:12:45.740 | Janie, who is now my wife, was standing

00:12:48.420 | behind the cafeteria line.

00:12:50.540 | And she says to me, I need to go to Springfield to catch a bus

00:12:55.780 | to go home for the weekend.

00:12:57.620 | Would you be willing to take me there at this particular time

00:13:01.940 | so I can catch this bus?

00:13:04.300 | Now, I was faced with a horrible dilemma at that point,

00:13:08.060 | because part of my major was pastoral studies at the time.

00:13:12.020 | So I was taking a Greek class.

00:13:15.100 | And the very time that she wanted to go

00:13:17.100 | was during that Greek class.

00:13:19.060 | And the professor was a guy by the name of Dr. George Lawler.

00:13:24.340 | And Dr. George Lawler was one of those old-fashioned professors.

00:13:27.660 | He always wore a three-piece suit and cuff links

00:13:32.700 | and always had a really nice tie on.

00:13:36.820 | And he'd never stand up and teach.

00:13:38.540 | He always sat down and teach.

00:13:41.340 | And when we translated Greek, it was a Greek exegesis class,

00:13:46.900 | he would always require the student--

00:13:48.980 | and he never referred to the student as by their first name.

00:13:51.900 | He always referred to them by their last name.

00:13:54.460 | Mr. Street, would you please stand and translate

00:13:56.700 | the next 10 verses for us?

00:13:58.420 | Parse all the verbs and participles.

00:14:01.180 | And you're going, oh.

00:14:03.820 | So you'd stand up with your Greek text.

00:14:06.500 | And your Greek text would be shaking like this.

00:14:09.220 | And you'd go through and start translating and parsing

00:14:11.860 | all the verbs and the participles.

00:14:14.140 | And he would always let you know when you messed up.

00:14:19.940 | So you never, you never skipped Dr. Lawler's Greek class.

00:14:26.940 | So I had this huge dilemma.

00:14:29.580 | Pretty girl, Greek class.

00:14:32.260 | Pretty girl, Greek class.

00:14:33.540 | Which do I choose?

00:14:34.420 | This is horrible.

00:14:35.660 | This is very, very difficult to make a choice.

00:14:40.020 | Well, pretty girl won out.

00:14:43.540 | There you go.

00:14:45.180 | Pretty girl ran out.

00:14:47.380 | Yes.

00:14:48.380 | Won out.

00:14:49.340 | And when she won out, I ended up taking her to Springfield.

00:14:53.420 | And on the way up there, we had such a great conversation.

00:14:55.800 | I'm thinking to myself, wow, I really need to ask her out.

00:14:58.180 | I don't know how to do this.

00:15:00.060 | And so we went to the bus station.

00:15:02.460 | And there were some kind of unseemly guys there.

00:15:04.820 | And so I just sat with her until the bus showed up

00:15:07.180 | and made sure she got on the bus.

00:15:08.860 | And as she's getting on the bus, I somewhat

00:15:11.340 | said in a clumsy way, oh, by the way,

00:15:13.700 | I'll send you a bill for this.

00:15:15.860 | And she kind of looked really surprised.

00:15:17.540 | She says, OK.

00:15:18.580 | So she went ahead and got on the bus

00:15:20.040 | and headed home for the weekend.

00:15:22.400 | So I drove back to the dorm, and I thought,

00:15:24.180 | what am I going to do?

00:15:24.740 | What am I going to do?

00:15:25.660 | So I got a piece of paper and made out in hand calligraphy,

00:15:29.540 | do one date for John Street's taxi service.

00:15:33.300 | All right.

00:15:34.100 | Put it in a little envelope and sent it

00:15:35.720 | to her in inter-campus mail.

00:15:36.960 | And after I sent it to her, I thought,

00:15:38.540 | oh, this is really corny.

00:15:40.460 | Oh, this is really corny.

00:15:41.500 | She's going to think this is really crazy.

00:15:43.660 | So I went back to the inter-campus mail.

00:15:46.180 | I said to the guy, listen, I need that thing back.

00:15:49.260 | All right.

00:15:49.780 | You need to give it back to me.

00:15:51.700 | And the guy says, I'm sorry, sir.

00:15:53.300 | I can't do that.

00:15:54.020 | I said, this is not the US mail system.

00:15:56.220 | This is just a little inter-campus mail system.

00:15:58.820 | Give me my envelope back.

00:16:00.020 | No, I'm sorry, sir.

00:16:00.900 | It's got to go through.

00:16:01.640 | Once you put it in there, it's got-- oh, I'm going.

00:16:03.720 | Oh, man.

00:16:04.780 | OK.

00:16:05.500 | Well, that's the last time I'll ever hear from her.

00:16:08.740 | So the weekend went by, two or three days into the next week.

00:16:14.020 | And all of a sudden, I get this thing in the mail.

00:16:16.300 | And it's an envelope.

00:16:17.180 | And I open it up.

00:16:18.060 | And there's a check for a million dollars worth of fund

00:16:21.220 | at the next basketball game.

00:16:23.660 | And that was our first date.

00:16:25.500 | And we still have those two pieces of paper.

00:16:28.300 | All right.

00:16:29.180 | I'm still cashing that check.

00:16:30.540 | So that was our first date.

00:16:34.940 | And then our second date, we doubled

00:16:38.420 | with my roommate in college.

00:16:42.140 | My roommate was engaged to be married.

00:16:45.260 | And we went out to get pizza.

00:16:48.340 | And on the way there, back in those days--

00:16:50.940 | this was early 1970s.

00:16:53.040 | That really dates me now, doesn't it?

00:16:55.420 | And you thought I was only 25.

00:16:56.900 | I know.

00:16:58.740 | Well, early 1970s, and we were on our way to get pizza.

00:17:03.220 | And back in those days, you didn't

00:17:04.780 | even have to wear your seat belt.

00:17:06.100 | And they had bench seats in the car.

00:17:08.180 | And so his fiance is sitting real close to him

00:17:11.660 | in the front of the car.

00:17:13.580 | And he's driving.

00:17:15.300 | And Janie and I are in back seat at either ends

00:17:18.460 | of the back seat, OK?

00:17:21.460 | So we're on the way.

00:17:22.820 | And his fiance leans over to him and says to him, I love you.

00:17:30.780 | Just loud enough where we could hear it in the back seat.

00:17:34.100 | And so I kind of looked over to Janie and I said,

00:17:36.100 | what did she say?

00:17:38.620 | And Janie looked at me and said, I love you.

00:17:41.980 | No, no, no, what did she say?

00:17:45.940 | So on the second date, she told me she loved me.

00:17:49.740 | I figure I had to marry her after that.

00:17:53.420 | So that's our first two dates.

00:17:58.420 | That's what happened.

00:18:00.020 | Now, every-- don't cry.

00:18:07.700 | Every couple has stories like that.

00:18:10.780 | They have stories like that.

00:18:13.180 | And I'm sure if we went around, you guys

00:18:14.860 | could share your own stories with your wives on stuff

00:18:19.540 | that you remember and how you guys got together,

00:18:23.260 | and some of the fond things that you remember

00:18:25.380 | and some things you remember for the rest of your life.

00:18:27.980 | Those are really great stories.

00:18:29.900 | Well, when you're counseling a couple,

00:18:32.220 | they usually have stories like that.

00:18:34.940 | And it's really good to get to know their history.

00:18:38.740 | So ask them, tell me about some of your first time experiences.

00:18:46.060 | Describe them for me.

00:18:47.060 | What were you thinking at that particular time?

00:18:51.020 | Well, I thought that she was really, really

00:18:53.660 | a gorgeous gal.

00:18:54.500 | I believed that he was really, really handsome guy.

00:18:58.500 | Now look what's happened to him.

00:19:00.260 | [LAUGHS]

00:19:01.740 | But what was going on?

00:19:07.100 | What happened in your relationship

00:19:09.300 | that helps you to get to know where they're coming from?

00:19:11.980 | That's not bad.

00:19:12.620 | That's a good thing.

00:19:13.500 | Then once you're able to establish

00:19:18.380 | some of those things that are more positive,

00:19:20.780 | then you can move slowly in the history of their relationship

00:19:25.100 | to where things began to go wrong.

00:19:28.180 | Where did this relationship start to get derailed?

00:19:31.820 | There are probably signs way early in the relationship,

00:19:34.580 | maybe even back before they were married,

00:19:36.900 | and how they were dealing with their problems that

00:19:39.340 | were signs or indicators of how they

00:19:41.540 | were going to derail a relationship later on.

00:19:45.700 | Well, what was going on?

00:19:47.580 | Help them to identify those patterns.

00:19:49.500 | Because if they're able to identify those patterns,

00:19:51.760 | then that will help to ensure the fact

00:19:53.380 | that they won't fall into that in the future

00:19:55.260 | if they're aware of them.

00:19:58.420 | This is the way we would wrongly deal with these patterns.

00:20:01.300 | Here's the right way to deal with these patterns.

00:20:05.700 | So number four.

00:20:07.580 | Then respond to your counselees in such a way

00:20:11.940 | that fuller disclosure and understanding really

00:20:14.260 | is facilitated.

00:20:16.780 | And this is what we call sometimes

00:20:18.340 | facilitated responses.

00:20:21.260 | There's nothing technically or biblical about that term.

00:20:25.300 | It's just a descriptive way of saying those kind of ways

00:20:31.460 | that you deal with your counselees

00:20:34.260 | to cause them to open up, to be more genuine with you,

00:20:39.220 | to share more of their lives with you.

00:20:45.060 | To the degree that they trust you

00:20:48.420 | is the degree that they'll share their lives with you.

00:20:51.900 | To the degree that they believe that you

00:20:55.180 | have their long-term welfare in mind

00:20:58.500 | is the degree that they will share their life with you.

00:21:00.740 | That's when you know that they are really seeking help

00:21:16.140 | is when they're being genuinely open.

00:21:18.260 | Let me describe for you the general description

00:21:24.380 | of facilitated responses.

00:21:26.700 | What we're talking about here is they

00:21:29.380 | are responses which the counselor communicates verbally

00:21:32.260 | and non-verbally, that he's heard

00:21:34.620 | what the counselee has said, he's

00:21:37.900 | heard what the counselee means, and he's

00:21:42.540 | heard what the counselee feels, how they're

00:21:47.260 | experiencing their problems.

00:21:50.980 | He's heard what they've said.

00:21:53.500 | He's heard what they've meant.

00:21:56.100 | And he hears what they feel.

00:21:57.660 | Facilitated responses are really characterized

00:22:09.060 | by three basic things.

00:22:11.500 | One is empathy, reflecting accurately and fully

00:22:18.260 | the counselee's surface feelings.

00:22:20.140 | That's really empathy.

00:22:23.540 | This person is discouraged, or this person is hopeless.

00:22:28.260 | There's a sense of hopelessness that abides.

00:22:31.260 | This person is deeply regretful, or maybe even full of guilt

00:22:42.220 | over what has happened in their marriage

00:22:44.340 | or happened in their home.

00:22:45.420 | Another aspect of it has to do with the issue of respect.

00:22:52.020 | We come back to that issue again.

00:22:53.380 | It communicates the acceptance of the counselee as a person,

00:22:58.580 | as a person created in the image of God.

00:23:00.820 | So we're not going to demean anyone.

00:23:04.820 | We're not going to run them down.

00:23:06.620 | We're not going to let other people run them

00:23:12.060 | down during this counseling.

00:23:14.740 | And that's easy to do, because you get a very verbal husband

00:23:20.980 | or get a very verbal wife.

00:23:23.140 | And sometimes they'll want to spend--

00:23:25.260 | they use counseling as a means to vent

00:23:28.380 | all of their hard feelings.

00:23:31.380 | And you cannot let that happen in counseling.

00:23:34.180 | You're not going to get your counselees back

00:23:36.060 | if you let that happen.

00:23:38.940 | Counseling is not to be turned into something

00:23:40.820 | that's destructive.

00:23:42.020 | Counseling is always to be aimed in that which

00:23:44.700 | is godly or constructive, not destructive.

00:23:50.460 | And you're demonstrating respect for both that husband

00:23:57.020 | and wife or the people that are members

00:23:59.340 | of that particular family when you accept them

00:24:05.860 | as a real person and that they have every right

00:24:11.900 | to contribute to what's going on here in this counseling

00:24:14.980 | process.

00:24:17.700 | I remember not long after I had finished training,

00:24:21.220 | my first training course on biblical counseling,

00:24:23.820 | I was a very young associate pastor.

00:24:26.180 | And I had a man and his wife come in

00:24:30.460 | with their 25-year-old daughter.

00:24:34.420 | And there was a major division between that daughter

00:24:37.580 | and her parents.

00:24:40.540 | And during that counseling session--

00:24:42.020 | in fact, you can research this in the Journal

00:24:43.860 | of Biblical Counseling.

00:24:44.820 | It's all written up there for posterity's sake.

00:24:48.580 | It was written up back in the mid-1990s.

00:24:53.260 | That counseling session was an absolute total failure

00:24:56.940 | from God's perspective and from my perspective

00:25:00.660 | because I let that father totally and totally,

00:25:04.820 | verbally destroy that daughter in that counseling session.

00:25:10.180 | And I shouldn't have let that happen

00:25:13.180 | because I didn't communicate any kind of respect for her

00:25:17.100 | by letting that happen.

00:25:19.700 | He used the counseling session as a way

00:25:21.460 | to vent all this bad feelings.

00:25:23.140 | And she had enough faults.

00:25:24.620 | There's no doubt about that.

00:25:26.220 | But she wasn't the only one.

00:25:27.380 | The parents had plenty of problems themselves.

00:25:30.540 | They had contributed to what had gone on here.

00:25:33.140 | But if you would have listened to that particular session

00:25:35.500 | and walked out, you probably would

00:25:37.580 | have concluded that she's the only one that's at fault here.

00:25:40.580 | And the parents have not contributed anything to this.

00:25:43.380 | Yes?

00:25:43.880 | [INAUDIBLE]

00:25:46.380 | How would have I changed, you mean, my response to them?

00:25:50.140 | I would have-- the greatest word in counseling, by the way,

00:25:53.140 | at least in English, is whoa.

00:25:55.780 | All right?

00:25:56.420 | You may have a similar expression in Italian.

00:26:00.580 | What?

00:26:03.340 | All right.

00:26:04.020 | Well, in English, it's whoa.

00:26:05.740 | I love that.

00:26:06.260 | It's the greatest word in counseling

00:26:07.980 | because I would have said, whoa, stop, halt. All right?

00:26:12.700 | We're not going to do that to one another in counseling.

00:26:15.740 | In fact, from that point on, I don't think I've ever--

00:26:18.740 | after that first counseling point,

00:26:20.200 | I've ever allowed that to happen again.

00:26:22.780 | Because I lost that gal.

00:26:24.100 | I lost her when that happened.

00:26:27.620 | Now, was the father saying things that were true about her?

00:26:31.220 | Yes, majority of things that he was saying was true.

00:26:34.020 | But the way that he was saying them was all wrong.

00:26:37.580 | He was using this to beat her into the ground with it.

00:26:40.220 | And it shouldn't have happened.

00:26:41.180 | And I shouldn't have allowed it to happen.

00:26:44.900 | So you say, stop.

00:26:47.580 | We're not going to do that.

00:26:48.900 | This is a violation of Ephesians 4:29 that

00:26:52.740 | says we're only supposed to say things that build up

00:26:55.420 | one another, not tear one another down.

00:27:00.060 | And I don't care whether you believe what you're

00:27:02.540 | saying is true or not.

00:27:03.740 | That's not the issue at this point.

00:27:05.540 | It's the way that you're saying things

00:27:07.740 | that makes this so wicked.

00:27:11.540 | So you stop right now.

00:27:12.980 | Now, if I would have done that in that counseling session,

00:27:15.740 | I think that I probably would have won that gal's heart.

00:27:20.580 | And I would have been able to work through a reconciliation

00:27:23.080 | with her parents.

00:27:24.140 | But I didn't do that.

00:27:26.460 | I let that father intimidate me.

00:27:29.020 | I let him command the session.

00:27:32.360 | And that shouldn't have happened.

00:27:35.220 | Because he had major problems himself.

00:27:39.660 | So this is why you've got to respect your counselees.

00:27:45.780 | And that means sometimes you have to stand up for them.

00:27:48.140 | If you have someone who is being ganged up on or piled up

00:27:51.980 | on in a counseling session, you've

00:27:54.780 | got to go after the members who are doing this.

00:27:58.420 | Say, whoa, whoa, whoa.

00:27:59.460 | We're not going to accomplish anything

00:28:00.700 | by piling up on this person.

00:28:06.180 | And I think there's plenty of biblical evidence for this.

00:28:12.460 | God cares for the helpless.

00:28:14.220 | And in this particular case, this

00:28:18.340 | is a person who is helpless.

00:28:20.700 | And you're letting someone gang up on them.

00:28:25.180 | The last area of facilitated response

00:28:28.340 | is the concept of warmth, showing attentiveness

00:28:31.900 | and caring through nonverbal means.

00:28:35.260 | You've got to be willing to do that.

00:28:36.760 | Showing them that you care.

00:28:41.660 | If you're constantly reading your Bible

00:28:44.140 | or taking notes or distracted by other things,

00:28:47.300 | and you're not involved with what's going on,

00:28:50.420 | you're not making eye contact with your counselee,

00:28:53.900 | and letting them know that you empathize with what

00:28:57.420 | is happening in their life, you'll lose them as a counselee.

00:29:01.220 | There has to be a certain nonverbal means of showing them

00:29:05.300 | that you really care.

00:29:06.780 | I think this is expressed in the little phraseology that's

00:29:13.260 | used in Ephesians 4.32, when he talks

00:29:16.540 | about being tender-hearted.

00:29:18.900 | Be kind to one another, tender-hearted.

00:29:20.780 | The word tender-hearted there is literally

00:29:22.780 | the Greek word tender-bowled, but it has to do with emotions.

00:29:27.780 | Good Christians are tender emotionally.

00:29:31.420 | That's good.

00:29:32.260 | I think good pastors have a tender emotion.

00:29:38.140 | That's a good thing.

00:29:39.140 | They're not the CEO types who aren't unaffected

00:29:42.720 | by anything around them.

00:29:43.900 | No, no, no.

00:29:45.140 | The CEO types do not make good shepherds.

00:29:48.400 | Where they're hard, cold, factual.

00:29:55.580 | No, no, no, we have to be tender-hearted, tender-bowled.

00:30:00.580 | Sometimes some translations translate it compassionate,

00:30:04.680 | and that speaks to the issue of emotions.

00:30:08.820 | We have to be warm with people.

00:30:11.160 | Some people have a problem with that.

00:30:16.140 | They have a problem with being warm with other people.

00:30:19.840 | Sometimes this is true of all of us.

00:30:24.840 | We want to communicate a biblical concept

00:30:33.800 | or some kind of teaching from Scripture so bad

00:30:39.480 | that we push aside all the emotional elements

00:30:43.000 | of the counseling and drive right after the opportunity

00:30:47.880 | to teach this truth.

00:30:50.180 | And we're basically in the process,

00:30:52.360 | I don't care how good that truth is,

00:30:54.600 | you're basically communicating to your counseling,

00:30:56.540 | I don't really care about you.

00:30:57.700 | I just want to care about dumping my truckload

00:31:01.180 | of truth on you.

00:31:02.820 | I don't care about you.

00:31:03.980 | That does not create facilitated responses.

00:31:10.540 | In fact, you'll see your counselees close up.

00:31:13.540 | They'll withdraw.

00:31:14.500 | You can almost physically see the barriers going up

00:31:19.040 | when that happens.

00:31:19.940 | One of the things I do when we're supervising counselors,

00:31:25.700 | especially for certification,

00:31:28.820 | is we require them to turn in DVDs of their counseling.

00:31:31.840 | They have to at least produce four DVDs

00:31:34.900 | where I have an opportunity to watch them counsel

00:31:37.780 | and watch how they interact with counselees,

00:31:41.040 | which gives me more than just a written statement.

00:31:43.140 | It helps me to see how they are dealing with people

00:31:47.700 | and whether or not people believe

00:31:50.280 | that the counselee is really there for their welfare

00:31:54.580 | and all of those nonverbal issues show up.

00:31:57.540 | How warm are they?

00:32:00.400 | How caring are they?

00:32:02.020 | How respectful are they?

00:32:03.480 | How empathetic are they?

00:32:06.200 | All of that encourages facilitated responses.

00:32:09.720 | Now generally, that's what we're talking about.

00:32:13.240 | Let's talk about this specifically.

00:32:14.720 | Specific descriptions of facilitated responses.

00:32:17.420 | They are responses that include instances

00:32:20.420 | in which the counselor's reflection

00:32:22.400 | of the counselee's statements are so similar

00:32:24.780 | to the counselee's statements

00:32:26.420 | that the two could be interchanged.

00:32:28.580 | They're not identical, you understand,

00:32:31.940 | but they are similar.

00:32:33.060 | And I'll do this frequently in counseling where

00:32:43.980 | if a counselee

00:32:45.140 | shares something that's going on in their life

00:32:53.100 | and I've labored fairly hard

00:32:55.220 | to try to understand what's happening,

00:32:57.120 | then I may say to them, okay, pause for a minute.

00:33:02.280 | Whoa, again.

00:33:05.140 | Let me share with you what I hear you saying

00:33:10.140 | and you tell me whether I'm right or wrong.

00:33:13.480 | Here's what I hear you saying.

00:33:15.880 | And I'll put it in my own words.

00:33:18.580 | I won't try to repeat verbally,

00:33:22.040 | word for word what they say

00:33:23.800 | so that they know that I'm kind of, in a sense,

00:33:26.220 | pouring this through my own grid.

00:33:28.300 | I'm thinking through it myself.

00:33:31.560 | And they may say to me, oh, yeah, that's right on.

00:33:35.600 | That's exactly it.

00:33:37.240 | In fact, sometimes a counselee will say to me,

00:33:39.400 | you said it better than I did.

00:33:41.120 | That's it.

00:33:42.800 | Well, it's because I've had an opportunity

00:33:44.280 | to listen to them and I've synthesized what they're saying

00:33:47.040 | down, make it more succinct and concise.

00:33:49.760 | Or sometimes a counselee will say to me,

00:33:53.800 | no, no, no, that's not it.

00:33:54.880 | That's not it.

00:33:55.720 | You missed it.

00:33:56.720 | This is what I'm saying.

00:33:58.680 | And that's very helpful to me.

00:34:00.440 | I'm very open to that.

00:34:02.180 | I want them to give me that feedback.

00:34:04.400 | Because I may be totally thinking in a different direction

00:34:11.760 | based upon their words,

00:34:14.080 | which is an entirely different meaning that they have.

00:34:17.120 | Their meaning is this direction

00:34:18.600 | and I'm going this direction.

00:34:20.140 | And all of a sudden now I realize I've got to turn around

00:34:24.560 | and head this direction.

00:34:25.760 | All right, now tell me how that is.

00:34:29.280 | And then the counselee corrects me.

00:34:32.360 | And then I repeat back to them what I hear them saying.

00:34:35.080 | Oh, yeah, now you got it, they'll say.

00:34:37.400 | That's a facilitated response.

00:34:41.740 | Now you say, now I'm beginning to see that counseling

00:34:46.500 | is much more than just sitting down with somebody,

00:34:49.300 | praying with them and sharing the Bible.

00:34:51.900 | Oh, yeah.

00:34:52.740 | It has to, real good counseling.

00:35:00.340 | It actually takes place within the context

00:35:03.600 | of a broader established relationship

00:35:06.660 | that we have shared together in Christ.

00:35:10.980 | That's where good counseling takes place.

00:35:14.000 | Furthermore, facilitated responses

00:35:18.700 | begin with listening and observing,

00:35:21.060 | responding to verbal and nonverbal clues.

00:35:25.180 | Listening and observing and responding

00:35:31.060 | to verbal and nonverbal clues.

00:35:37.580 | At some particular point when I begin to talk

00:35:40.660 | and share with the counselee what's going on

00:35:45.500 | and I see them grimace,

00:35:47.860 | they kind of get this look on their face like,

00:35:50.120 | I'll say to them, okay, what did I just say

00:35:54.040 | that made you do that?

00:35:55.700 | Which shows that I'm immediately responsive

00:35:57.500 | to what's going on.

00:35:58.600 | Or they kind of look at me like, huh?

00:36:04.380 | What's going?

00:36:07.620 | Then I'm immediately saying to them,

00:36:11.300 | did I say something you don't understand?

00:36:12.780 | Oh, yeah.

00:36:14.220 | Well, let me correct that.

00:36:15.520 | So I'm right there.

00:36:19.700 | There's immediate feedback that they receive

00:36:22.540 | that I understand that they're lost.

00:36:25.140 | I've totally lost them.

00:36:26.460 | I'm not being clear.

00:36:34.060 | Also, facilitated responses provide

00:36:36.220 | nonthreatening atmosphere for the counselee

00:36:38.140 | to express himself.

00:36:39.320 | They know that they can say just about anything they want

00:36:46.060 | and I'm not gonna come down on 'em.

00:36:47.820 | Or I'm not gonna start pointing at 'em and say,

00:36:50.980 | you're a sinner.

00:36:52.020 | No, no, they can share whatever they want

00:36:55.940 | and then we're gonna patiently and carefully

00:36:59.340 | and lovingly go to the word of God

00:37:01.660 | and see what the word of God says about this.

00:37:04.120 | Furthermore, facilitated responses avoid the use

00:37:10.180 | of certain verbal behaviors such as sarcasm,

00:37:12.860 | ridicule, or mockery.

00:37:14.760 | You know, there are some people who have developed

00:37:20.340 | sarcasm as an art form in communication.

00:37:24.360 | You can almost see them, oh, really?

00:37:32.100 | I just thought you were the most intelligent person

00:37:34.940 | on the earth.

00:37:36.060 | Well, they mean that sarcastically.

00:37:38.100 | They've developed it in an art form.

00:37:39.680 | It's hard for them to talk without sarcasm.

00:37:42.660 | Other people have done that also with ridicule.

00:37:47.660 | They know how to politely ridicule another person

00:37:51.380 | or mock another person and they blame it

00:37:54.580 | on trying to be funny.

00:37:58.380 | Well, that's an area that you as a pastoral counselor

00:38:03.340 | must avoid.

00:38:05.060 | Don't do that.

00:38:06.800 | Sarcasm, ridicule, mockery is something that will drive

00:38:15.460 | your counselees off.

00:38:21.740 | In every case, a counselor who does that

00:38:28.120 | is really coming from a high, exalted, lifted up position.

00:38:33.120 | It's a very condescending way to deal with people.

00:38:37.580 | That's not the way that people who are good counselors

00:38:46.860 | should respond to their counselees.

00:38:50.380 | Fifth, facilitated responses also encourage

00:38:54.860 | self-exploration, discovery, and understanding.

00:38:58.000 | And this is such an important point

00:39:00.280 | because on this particular point,

00:39:02.240 | this essentially says that your counselees

00:39:08.360 | don't always know everything that's going on in their lives.

00:39:11.580 | But through the process of counseling

00:39:13.240 | and being very open with you, they actually stumble on

00:39:17.400 | and discover things about themselves

00:39:21.640 | that they never knew before.

00:39:25.640 | They actually discover that on their own.

00:39:27.740 | That's one of the things that makes Rogerian therapy work.

00:39:38.740 | Carl Rogers' premise is that the counselor

00:39:44.060 | doesn't give any directive counsel at all,

00:39:46.460 | but just allows the counselee to sort of express

00:39:49.680 | his or her own internal thoughts.

00:39:55.120 | And eventually, they'll discover the answer

00:39:57.160 | to their problem within themselves.

00:39:58.920 | They don't know what it is, but the counselor helps them

00:40:01.200 | to get in touch with that kind of thing.

00:40:03.640 | Now, we believe that the answer is in Scripture, in God,

00:40:07.640 | so I'm not advocating the ends of that therapy.

00:40:10.440 | But part of the, truth is always parasitic,

00:40:15.440 | or error is always parasitic on the truth,

00:40:17.560 | I should say it like that.

00:40:18.680 | Error is always parasitic on the truth.

00:40:20.640 | There's a little bit of truth to the system,

00:40:24.280 | and a little bit of the truth of the Rogerian system

00:40:26.360 | is the fact that people, through their own talking

00:40:29.960 | and expressing themselves and feeling free

00:40:31.840 | to express themselves, do learn things about themselves

00:40:34.800 | that they never knew before.

00:40:36.200 | And sometimes that's the case.

00:40:40.260 | Facilitated responses, feeling free to express themselves

00:40:43.860 | without being condemned, without being judged,

00:40:46.340 | without being ridiculed, without being mocked,

00:40:53.420 | enables a person to discover certain things

00:40:55.300 | about themselves that they never thought would be true.

00:41:00.300 | So,

00:41:05.860 | so make sure that these facilitated responses

00:41:14.860 | sort of encourage self-exploration.

00:41:17.960 | Number six, not only that, but facilitated responses

00:41:21.260 | give people the rare experience of being understood

00:41:24.340 | by another person.

00:41:25.300 | Some people never had that type of relationship before,

00:41:32.440 | especially in the church with someone else

00:41:35.220 | who's a Christian or who comes along

00:41:37.160 | and wants to biblically counsel them, or even a pastor.

00:41:40.080 | The rare experience of being understood by another person.

00:41:45.140 | Some people have been raised in households

00:41:50.080 | where their opinion counted for absolutely nothing.

00:41:52.900 | Their mother didn't appreciate their opinions,

00:41:56.460 | their father didn't appreciate their opinions,

00:41:58.420 | their siblings didn't appreciate their opinions,

00:42:01.300 | or maybe they're in a marriage where their spouse

00:42:03.860 | or other people in the family

00:42:05.340 | don't appreciate their opinion.

00:42:06.940 | Whatever the case may be, nobody takes time

00:42:11.380 | to really understand them.

00:42:15.700 | And so this is their first opportunity

00:42:19.460 | to really be understood by somebody else.

00:42:24.460 | It's a loving and caring response.

00:42:28.420 | Number seven, facilitated responses also largely avoid

00:42:33.740 | the use of closed questions,

00:42:36.280 | in that closed questions tend to,

00:42:39.600 | and then we have several responses to that.

00:42:44.600 | Let's pick up here about these facilitated responses

00:42:49.600 | that largely avoid the use of closed questions,

00:42:52.720 | in that closed questions tend to be, first of all,

00:42:55.460 | they tend to create a dependency relationship.

00:42:58.980 | Closed questions artificially guide your counselee

00:43:06.820 | to answers, because they demand a yes or no answer.

00:43:13.960 | And so they become, your counselee that is,

00:43:17.360 | becomes dependent on those particular questions.

00:43:20.700 | Oh, you're gonna guide me at this particular point.

00:43:24.160 | You're gonna show me what I need to do here,

00:43:28.200 | rather than them revealing what they are doing

00:43:33.200 | so that they can change and come in line

00:43:39.080 | with what the word of God says.

00:43:40.540 | We don't wanna create dependency relationships.

00:43:44.180 | That's not what we wanna do.

00:43:45.820 | If anything, rather than teaching them

00:43:49.180 | to be dependent upon you, what you're trying to do

00:43:51.740 | is you're trying to teach them

00:43:52.900 | to be dependent upon the word.

00:43:54.460 | Now, I realize that early in counseling,

00:43:57.940 | when a person first comes in

00:43:58.780 | and they're having major marital problems,

00:44:01.660 | they'll cling to you as their hope, okay?

00:44:05.420 | And that's okay, that's not bad at the beginning,

00:44:08.300 | for them to cling to you, all right?

00:44:10.540 | They've gotta cling to something,

00:44:11.760 | because they may be absolutely hopeless,

00:44:15.040 | and you are the one in the counseling room,

00:44:20.820 | you're the only one that has any hope.

00:44:22.300 | So they'll cling to your hope, that's okay.

00:44:24.540 | But if they continue to remain clinging to your hope,

00:44:28.060 | then we've got problems.

00:44:29.360 | You gotta, in a sense, peel their fingers off of you

00:44:32.100 | and help them cling to the hope of the word of God.

00:44:37.220 | That's where they need to find their answers.

00:44:39.420 | Not from you, but from the word of God on their own.

00:44:42.260 | So we're in, the counseling process

00:44:45.940 | is removing their clinging hands from you

00:44:49.500 | to placing it upon the word.

00:44:53.180 | So closed questions tend to undermine that.

00:44:58.180 | They tend to create a dependency relationship.

00:45:01.140 | That's not what we want.

00:45:02.340 | Furthermore, B, they also tend to produce

00:45:06.540 | unrealistic expectations on the part of the projects,

00:45:09.580 | or on the part of the counselee.

00:45:12.680 | It projects the counselor as an expert and an answer giver.

00:45:17.440 | We're the expert, and we're gonna tell you what to do.

00:45:24.020 | Wow.

00:45:24.860 | I don't want my counselee to think of me as an expert.

00:45:29.660 | I want them to think of me as a fellow believer in Christ

00:45:35.180 | who has struggles, too, but hopefully knows

00:45:38.300 | a little bit more about the word of God

00:45:39.820 | and will help them to find the answers in the word of God.

00:45:42.980 | I would far prefer that kind of a view.

00:45:45.260 | Now we've got something.

00:45:48.260 | But you're not the answer.

00:45:50.460 | You're not going to be the priest or the final authority

00:45:54.320 | that's going to give them their answers

00:45:57.420 | to all their problems.

00:45:58.520 | That's not what we're after.

00:46:01.540 | Furthermore, closed questions place responsibility

00:46:05.540 | for problem solving on the counselor

00:46:07.580 | instead of where it should be, that is on the counselee.

00:46:14.420 | That's really where it should be.

00:46:18.300 | Responsibility for problem solving

00:46:25.380 | has to be on the counselee.

00:46:27.140 | You're not there to solve all their problems.

00:46:30.740 | In fact, you can't solve all their problems.

00:46:33.320 | They've got to learn to solve their problems

00:46:39.420 | using the word of God.

00:46:40.780 | So you're constantly having to shift

00:46:44.020 | that responsibility for problem solving

00:46:45.920 | where they're looking to you to solve all their problems

00:46:48.500 | back upon them, teaching them how to use the word of God

00:46:53.220 | the right way, hermeneutically, to solve their problems

00:46:57.580 | using the right scriptures, to think the right things,

00:47:02.300 | desire the right things, crave the right things,

00:47:07.020 | do the right things, as counselees.

00:47:11.700 | Furthermore, closed questions tend to reduce

00:47:16.300 | active involvement of the counselee

00:47:17.780 | in the solution of his or her problems.

00:47:27.300 | They tend to reduce any kind of active involvement.

00:47:32.100 | It really, the bottom line is,

00:47:35.540 | when you have closed questions,

00:47:36.940 | it produces the type of a counselee who is really lazy

00:47:40.900 | and really leans on or relies upon you

00:47:49.440 | for all the answers.

00:47:53.980 | We don't want that.

00:47:55.520 | Closed questions also reduce the counselee's acceptance

00:48:00.400 | of responsibility for his or her behavior.

00:48:02.680 | And when you do that,

00:48:11.680 | then that's what they carry back into life.

00:48:13.880 | Now, really, hope begins to return to a marriage

00:48:21.320 | that's willing, when you've got a husband and wife

00:48:23.540 | that's willing to accept responsibility

00:48:25.480 | for their own feelings and actions.

00:48:27.560 | When that happens, a brand new freedom opens up to them

00:48:30.600 | to be able to respond to their spouse in the right way.

00:48:34.400 | But as long as they define their spouse or their home

00:48:38.480 | or their family or their children

00:48:40.640 | as creating an environment that forces them

00:48:45.640 | to act the way they do,

00:48:47.960 | as long as they keep defining the responsibility

00:48:53.080 | being upon my environment, my spouse, my kids,

00:48:57.540 | as long as that's the case,

00:48:58.920 | they will never ever really change.

00:49:01.160 | And they will continue to lose hope

00:49:05.680 | because if everybody around me

00:49:08.420 | and what they're doing to me defines me,

00:49:11.000 | then I have no really hope for change

00:49:12.840 | because I'm totally at the mercy of what they do.

00:49:15.300 | But people don't define me.

00:49:20.920 | What really defines me is my choices,

00:49:23.360 | how I respond to what people do.

00:49:25.600 | People can say unloving, hateful, mean things to me,

00:49:30.420 | and that can hurt, but how do I respond to that?

00:49:36.540 | I have a choice at that particular point.

00:49:38.660 | I don't have to respond to it in like manner,

00:49:42.500 | hatefully, mean, unloving, I don't have to do that.

00:49:49.960 | I can respond to them in a caring, loving way.

00:49:54.180 | So when you have closed questions in a counseling context,

00:50:01.720 | it reduces the counselee's acceptance

00:50:04.640 | of responsibility for his or her behavior.

00:50:07.440 | Furthermore, closed questions

00:50:09.360 | reduce counselee self-exploration too,

00:50:11.600 | which is the opposite of what we talked about

00:50:16.560 | a little bit earlier, where the more open questions

00:50:20.120 | help them to explore,

00:50:23.500 | it encourages more facilitated responses,

00:50:29.080 | and it encourages more self-exploration.

00:50:32.860 | Are there attitudes in my life that are harmful

00:50:41.600 | to our marital relationship

00:50:43.480 | that I don't even realize that I have?

00:50:46.380 | Ways that I respond to my wife,

00:50:49.100 | ways that I respond to my husband,

00:50:51.120 | they can become so habitual,

00:50:54.380 | I don't even realize that I'm doing that.

00:50:56.420 | What are those, and how can I see those?

00:51:03.380 | How can I learn those things?

00:51:04.980 | So closed questions tend to inhibit

00:51:09.720 | that kind of exploration.

00:51:12.780 | Furthermore, closed questions create a lazy,

00:51:15.660 | inattentive counselee because the counselee

00:51:17.820 | doesn't have to think as hard.

00:51:19.320 | Now, I've already suggested that just a little bit earlier,

00:51:23.940 | but it sort of puts their mind in neutral.

00:51:27.620 | Lazy counselees don't grow very much,

00:51:32.960 | and they don't grow very quickly,

00:51:41.020 | and it is a lazy counselee that will be a counselee

00:51:44.020 | for a long, long time.

00:51:45.580 | So make sure that you're going to use questions

00:52:00.540 | that facilitate good responses.

00:52:04.260 | They don't inhibit good responses.

00:52:09.020 | Furthermore, have couples or families then

00:52:12.660 | discuss controversial topics in the counseling room.

00:52:15.640 | Boy, you'll really begin to see,

00:52:20.180 | once this family trusts you as a counselor,

00:52:25.180 | you'll begin to see what's really going on

00:52:28.500 | in that marriage or in that home

00:52:30.980 | when finally you throw out a controversial topic

00:52:33.980 | and you begin to see how all the biblical guidelines

00:52:38.260 | and all the rules of communication

00:52:41.620 | are thrown out the window.

00:52:42.940 | We'll talk a little bit later on

00:52:48.380 | about four rules of communication

00:52:50.020 | that I think are real effective

00:52:52.060 | in just helping people that have fallen into habit,

00:52:55.360 | terrible habit patterns,

00:52:57.340 | helping them institute those things in the home.

00:53:00.340 | But bring up a controversial issue,

00:53:06.520 | a thing that they haven't settled

00:53:08.660 | that you know is hard for them

00:53:12.340 | and let them begin to discuss it in front of you.

00:53:14.800 | You'll learn a lot about what's going on there.

00:53:18.700 | Then give data gathering homework

00:53:22.340 | that can be completed between sessions.

00:53:24.400 | You'll learn a lot from this homework.

00:53:29.020 | You'll learn a lot just by virtue of the fact

00:53:31.580 | that sometimes it's incomplete

00:53:33.820 | or they don't see the homework as important

00:53:35.900 | to their change.

00:53:37.120 | Sometimes there's published materials.

00:53:43.380 | Wayne Max has his homework volumes.

00:53:45.500 | Volumes, materials like preparing marriage for God's way.

00:53:49.460 | There's a lot of data gathering there,

00:53:51.140 | strengthening your marriage, your family God's way.

00:53:55.820 | Data gathering inventory forms.

00:54:01.720 | You can get this in the back of a lot of J. Adams books

00:54:05.680 | as well.

00:54:06.520 | Yes.

00:54:07.360 | >> What kind of homework do you give them

00:54:08.700 | when you're pre-counseling?

00:54:10.380 | >> When you what?

00:54:11.220 | >> When you're pre-counseling.

00:54:12.540 | >> Pre-counseling?

00:54:13.640 | >> Yeah, when you know that the counselee is not saved

00:54:17.020 | and they come to you for counsel.

00:54:18.900 | >> Oh, oh, what kind of homeworks do we give

00:54:22.120 | during pre-counseling if the counselee's not saved?

00:54:24.900 | All we send it around the gospel.

00:54:29.500 | We send them home studying passages about the gospel.

00:54:32.780 | Sometimes even the Roman's Road.

00:54:34.380 | We'll take them through the Roman's Road.

00:54:35.580 | Help them to understand it.

00:54:37.140 | We'll list a bunch of passages of scripture.

00:54:38.820 | In fact, many times I'll take a Bible.

00:54:41.660 | If they don't have one, I'll give it to them.

00:54:43.660 | And then I'll take little sticky notes

00:54:45.380 | and I'll stick them in different places in the Bible

00:54:47.820 | and write references down.

00:54:49.060 | And I want them to read them this week

00:54:51.180 | and interact with them.

00:54:53.420 | And I'll give them good tracks like John Blanchard's material

00:54:58.420 | that's translated in several different languages.

00:55:01.340 | His tracks on ultimate questions.

00:55:04.760 | So I'll give them material like that to go home and read.

00:55:08.340 | And I'll say to them, listen,

00:55:09.660 | I want you to read this through

00:55:10.500 | and I want you to take a highlighter and highlight

00:55:12.880 | maybe four or five of the most important statements

00:55:15.580 | in this particular booklet.

00:55:18.700 | And we'll come back together and discuss them.

00:55:22.200 | So that's the kind of homework that we'll do with them.

00:55:26.240 | All right.

00:55:28.420 | Then we've got data gathering inventory forms as well,

00:55:34.420 | like there are common ways that husbands and wives

00:55:37.220 | sin against each other.

00:55:38.940 | You can actually develop some of these on your own

00:55:41.340 | or fail or offend.

00:55:43.720 | Deep friendship inventory.

00:55:48.080 | Understanding marriage biblically.

00:55:51.040 | How to be your wife's lover.

00:55:55.680 | How to be your husband's lover.

00:55:59.800 | 50 questions for husbands and wives to ask themselves.

00:56:04.300 | 50 questions for husbands to ask.

00:56:06.860 | I think that repeats itself there twice.

00:56:13.700 | It shouldn't be there.

00:56:14.660 | Role concepts, how they view roles.

00:56:18.280 | Sometimes some of that homework you can also find

00:56:23.300 | in Wayne Mack's Preparing for Marriage God's Way,

00:56:26.780 | which is a really good book.

00:56:28.300 | And I use that frequently in premarital counseling.

00:56:33.940 | So there's a host of different materials

00:56:38.060 | that you can use in order to gather good data.

00:56:41.300 | And you can customize a lot of material as well.

00:56:45.140 | Like you can send them home with lists, like thank lists.

00:56:50.100 | What are they thankful for?

00:56:51.260 | Prayer lists or confession lists.

00:56:54.020 | Or there can be journals, like a heart journal

00:56:57.100 | or a thought journal or a fear journal.

00:57:00.300 | Or sometimes I refer to them as a hate journal.

00:57:05.300 | Grab your Bible just for a moment.

00:57:06.980 | Let's go over to Romans chapter 12.

00:57:09.180 | And verse nine.

00:57:24.180 | There Paul says, let love be without hypocrisy.

00:57:28.380 | Abhor what is evil and cling to what is good.

00:57:31.680 | The word abhor is the word hate.

00:57:36.580 | It's the same word.

00:57:37.540 | It can be just as legitimately translated hate.

00:57:40.620 | And I like to use that as an acrostic.

00:57:42.940 | Let me see if I can show this to you on the board here.

00:57:46.680 | H-A-T-E.

00:57:56.560 | Christians need to hate more, all right?

00:58:01.560 | That'd be a good sermon for you guys to preach.

00:58:06.000 | Christians need to hate more.

00:58:08.480 | Because everybody's preaching about

00:58:11.220 | Christians need to love more.

00:58:12.200 | We need to hate sin more.

00:58:13.620 | Now, when they get angry at their spouse,

00:58:18.220 | or they get irritated with their spouse,

00:58:20.920 | or frustrated with their spouse,

00:58:23.500 | or upset because of something their spouse has done,

00:58:26.620 | and they know that they respond to that

00:58:28.700 | in a very sinful way,

00:58:31.260 | then you need to help them to journal.

00:58:33.460 | Number one, here.

00:58:35.740 | They need to answer the question in their journal.

00:58:41.020 | What happened?

00:58:46.580 | It's the first question they need to answer.

00:58:52.720 | What happened?

00:58:53.560 | Just tell us the circumstances.

00:58:55.340 | What went on?

00:58:56.180 | Number two.

00:59:01.460 | In their journal, you want them to also list

00:59:09.620 | how did you act?

00:59:19.760 | In their journal, you want them to also list

00:59:21.720 | how did you act?

00:59:22.540 | How did you act?

00:59:30.720 | How did you respond to what happened to you

00:59:36.680 | when your spouse yelled at you?

00:59:39.100 | When you had that argument over finances?

00:59:45.580 | How did you act?

00:59:49.080 | Or, number three, get them to journal

00:59:54.080 | and answer this question.

00:59:55.820 | What?

01:00:00.540 | Well, it would be better to say here.

01:00:06.500 | What were you doing?

01:00:17.020 | What were you thinking at the time?

01:00:22.020 | Or, kind of as a subset to that, what did you want?

01:00:35.740 | What did you crave?

01:00:41.020 | What do you desire more than anything else?

01:00:46.240 | That helps them to reflect upon their own mind,

01:00:51.060 | their own thought life.

01:00:52.400 | And then, last of all, you want them to answer

01:01:01.340 | what is excellent or praiseworthy.

01:01:14.440 | [birds chirping]

01:01:17.180 | This is based upon Philippians chapter four and verse eight.

01:01:26.820 | What is excellent or praiseworthy?

01:01:34.340 | In other words, you want them to answer the question,

01:01:39.540 | this is what happened, how should I have acted?

01:01:42.620 | What should have I been thinking?

01:01:44.500 | What should I have wanted in this situation?

01:01:49.300 | What should I have desired in this situation?

01:01:54.300 | And then, what is excellent?

01:01:56.180 | That tells us what is excellent in this case.

01:02:02.100 | So, that's why we call it the hate journal.

01:02:07.100 | They learn to hate areas of their life

01:02:12.100 | that are evil and then cling to that which is good.

01:02:17.100 | Help them to do that.

01:02:19.980 | Hate what is evil and cling to that which is good.

01:02:24.380 | So, help them do a heart journal.

01:02:26.660 | Help them do a thought journal or a fear journal

01:02:29.180 | or a journal of upsets.

01:02:31.140 | Or, you can call it a hate journal.

01:02:33.440 | But, get them answering questions like that,

01:02:36.740 | which gives you a lot of feedback

01:02:38.460 | about what's going on in their home.

01:02:41.060 | Thirdly, study scripture passages.

01:02:43.700 | Where are they failing?

01:02:45.620 | In obeying the truth of the word of God.

01:02:50.160 | Or, record expenses.

01:02:55.860 | Maybe sometimes home software budgeting can help you here

01:02:59.840 | to keep track of expenses,

01:03:02.180 | especially if they have problems with finances

01:03:04.540 | or they have fights or disagreements about finances

01:03:07.700 | in the home.

01:03:09.380 | Recording expenses.

01:03:10.900 | It can be as simple as just a series of envelopes

01:03:14.240 | where they have food expenses, transportation expenses,

01:03:17.820 | home expenses, and they just put their little receipts

01:03:20.540 | inside those little envelopes.

01:03:22.860 | So, it doesn't have to be anything complicated,

01:03:24.600 | even if they don't have a computer.

01:03:25.860 | But, if they have a computer,

01:03:27.000 | sometimes there's wonderful software

01:03:28.540 | and if they know enough,

01:03:30.220 | they can just take an Excel sheet

01:03:35.220 | and make their own track of expenses.

01:03:39.300 | They don't even have to buy special software to do that.

01:03:42.100 | Or, 1 Corinthians 13, four through eight,

01:03:46.420 | help them to study, define, and create a plan

01:03:48.860 | to implement godly love for one another.

01:03:52.660 | Sometimes I have them divide a piece of paper

01:03:54.980 | into three columns lengthwise.

01:03:57.340 | In one column, I want them to define each term

01:04:00.500 | in 1 Corinthians 13, four through six,

01:04:03.580 | love is patient, love is kind.

01:04:05.700 | I want them to define that in one column.

01:04:08.500 | In the second column, I want them to think about

01:04:12.180 | all the areas where they need to change.

01:04:16.780 | That is, all the areas where they fail.

01:04:19.580 | I want them to list as many examples of that as possible.

01:04:22.420 | Will I fail to be kind when I, whatever.

01:04:26.020 | And then, in the third column,

01:04:27.860 | then I want them to list what do they need to do

01:04:31.980 | in order to change.

01:04:34.100 | If they're going to implement kindness,

01:04:37.400 | if they're going to implement patience,

01:04:40.100 | if they're going to implement gentleness

01:04:44.600 | as an aspect of love, then what do they need to do

01:04:52.100 | in order to change and be that way?

01:04:55.840 | That's the third column.

01:04:57.060 | Yes.

01:04:57.900 | [student speaks off microphone]

01:05:00.900 | Yeah.

01:05:01.740 | The first column is the definition of all the terms

01:05:03.960 | there in the Bible in 1 Corinthians 13.

01:05:06.100 | That's the first column.

01:05:07.220 | Definition.

01:05:08.060 | So, they're defining it as best as they can.

01:05:11.100 | The second column is all the areas where they're failing.

01:05:13.900 | And the third column is all the areas

01:05:16.700 | where they need to change and how they intend to change.

01:05:20.520 | That's the third column.

01:05:23.100 | Then, number six.

01:05:26.860 | There's high points and low points record.

01:05:29.260 | What are the high points of their relationship

01:05:31.260 | this past week?

01:05:32.160 | What are some of the things that they look back on

01:05:35.480 | and say, "Wow, that was, you know, we had a good time.

01:05:37.920 | "That was good."

01:05:38.760 | And then, what were the bad times as well?

01:05:42.660 | High and low points.

01:05:44.780 | Or, tapes of communication conferences.

01:05:47.820 | Audio, CD, DVDs.

01:05:50.460 | There's so much material available,

01:05:52.380 | so much more than when I first started in

01:05:54.700 | as a biblical counselor.

01:05:55.700 | You can get online, MP3 downloads.

01:05:59.100 | There's just so much material

01:06:01.680 | that you can get them to listen to.

01:06:04.140 | Say, "I want you to go to a website like soundword.com.

01:06:08.500 | "And when you go to soundword.com,

01:06:09.980 | "I want you to look up underneath

01:06:11.820 | "the National Association of Euthetic Counselors

01:06:14.400 | "the following seminars or workshops

01:06:17.400 | "that have been done on marital communication

01:06:23.800 | "or marital strife.

01:06:25.100 | "I want you to listen to those.

01:06:26.620 | "I want you to keep notes.

01:06:27.620 | "And in our next counseling session,

01:06:28.840 | "I want you to bring those in."

01:06:31.600 | So, there's a host of other places

01:06:36.600 | that you can get materials.

01:06:40.560 | For example, the counseling department

01:06:45.380 | here at Master College and Seminary

01:06:47.680 | on a yearly basis has a women discipling women's conference

01:06:50.480 | and a men discipling men's conference.

01:06:52.400 | And all the sessions, all the main sessions

01:06:55.000 | are not only audio recorded, but also recorded on DVDs.

01:06:59.480 | And then every one of the workshops

01:07:02.320 | are at least audio recorded.

01:07:04.320 | And so, you can get a hold of those kind of things

01:07:06.300 | and use them for homework as well.

01:07:08.720 | The only thing I caution you on

01:07:11.640 | is not everything out there in the Christian bookstore

01:07:14.520 | or everything out there that purports to be Christian

01:07:17.320 | in terms of helping marriages is really biblical.

01:07:19.700 | So, you've gotta be really careful.

01:07:21.740 | Be very, very careful that your source is a good source.

01:07:25.100 | All of this helps you to gather data,

01:07:29.160 | to get to know this particular couple a little bit better.

01:07:32.520 | Now, as you gather this data,

01:07:34.800 | this couple doesn't look like a happy couple here,

01:07:37.320 | look for evidence that would either confirm the presence

01:07:41.640 | or the absence of some of the most common marital problems.

01:07:45.420 | You say, what are those?

01:07:48.240 | Well, let me give you a list of some of the more common ones.

01:07:51.260 | Look for stuff like this.

01:07:53.280 | Disagreements on concepts of marriage.

01:07:56.260 | What is his concept of marriage

01:07:58.740 | and what is her concept of marriage?

01:08:00.540 | Or, differing expectations.

01:08:04.580 | I expected him to be this way in marriage

01:08:08.080 | or I expected her to be this way in marriage.

01:08:11.180 | How are those expectations different?

01:08:13.200 | Or, maybe either of them or maybe both of them

01:08:19.880 | come out of churches that were not taught well

01:08:23.600 | and so, they really don't have a biblical understanding

01:08:26.160 | of roles and responsibilities of the husband.

01:08:28.640 | Or, role and responsibility of a wife.

01:08:30.820 | So, how is their training,

01:08:37.180 | their biblical training in their background,

01:08:39.380 | contributing to their problems in their marriage

01:08:42.260 | or lack of biblical training?

01:08:43.760 | How did they go about making decisions?

01:08:49.240 | Is it based upon rationalism?

01:08:57.820 | Is it based upon emotionalism?

01:09:00.000 | Is it based upon biblical criteria?

01:09:04.300 | Or, maybe a falsely understood biblical criteria,

01:09:10.340 | falsely interpreted Bible.

01:09:12.100 | How did they make decisions?

01:09:13.500 | How do they go about resolving conflicts

01:09:18.900 | when there is a conflict?

01:09:20.380 | Do they have the right kind of attitudes?

01:09:26.580 | Do they see the goal

01:09:29.580 | at the end of this conflict resolution winning?

01:09:33.400 | Or, do they see the goal glorifying God?

01:09:37.740 | What is it?

01:09:38.920 | Do I have to win this conflict?

01:09:40.820 | Do I have to win this argument?

01:09:43.220 | Or, is my real goal here to glorify God?

01:09:46.100 | What is it?

01:09:46.940 | What kind of communication difficulties do they have?

01:09:51.860 | Maybe you get one spouse that's very, very verbal

01:09:54.660 | and another spouse that is a person

01:09:56.940 | who clams up all the time.

01:09:58.340 | They're quiet.

01:09:59.180 | They hardly ever say anything.

01:10:00.580 | Or, what are their growth objectives?

01:10:06.520 | What do they really wanna do?

01:10:08.860 | We wanna work real hard so we can have a lot of money.

01:10:15.700 | One of you came up to me during our break time

01:10:17.700 | and talked a little bit about a couple that was that way.

01:10:22.100 | And, it seems like their goal

01:10:25.180 | in their marital relationship

01:10:28.540 | is get as much money as they can.

01:10:30.560 | That's their goal.

01:10:33.080 | And so, they're sacrificing their relationship

01:10:35.460 | and they're sacrificing their kids on that altar.

01:10:37.900 | They're really materialists,

01:10:41.580 | even though they profess to be Christians.

01:10:43.680 | They have the rich young ruler syndrome

01:10:49.420 | where they're interested in what they possess

01:10:53.420 | more than they are interested in following Christ.

01:10:55.920 | Then, there's occupational objectives.

01:11:00.580 | He has an idea of what he wants his occupation to be

01:11:04.900 | and how he's going to fulfill the responsibilities.

01:11:07.780 | Maybe she has a desire to have an occupation

01:11:11.140 | outside of the home.

01:11:12.500 | That can cause a considerable amount of conflict

01:11:14.780 | in a Christian marriage.

01:11:17.120 | Maybe he wants her to have a job outside the home,

01:11:20.960 | or maybe he doesn't want her to have a job outside the home,

01:11:24.760 | or maybe she wants her husband to have a different job

01:11:27.840 | where it makes more money,

01:11:29.160 | but he's not really happy in the job

01:11:31.640 | that really makes more money.

01:11:32.920 | He doesn't think he's gifted in that particular job.

01:11:36.340 | That can cause some difficulties.

01:11:39.520 | Then, there could also be intramarital marriage boundaries.

01:11:47.840 | Now, this has to do with what boundaries do we have

01:11:52.020 | with other couples that are close friends?

01:11:54.160 | How many boundaries do we have?

01:11:59.560 | What are they allowed to do in our home

01:12:02.000 | and not allowed to do in our home?

01:12:03.700 | Where do they stay when they come

01:12:06.800 | to stay overnight in our home?

01:12:08.540 | How many boundaries are there with friends?

01:12:15.640 | He maybe grew up in a household

01:12:20.240 | where his parents allowed their friends

01:12:23.360 | to walk in any time, any day, any time, day or night.

01:12:26.960 | They didn't even have to knock.

01:12:28.120 | Door's always open.

01:12:29.000 | Come on in.

01:12:29.840 | She grew up in a home where the door was always locked

01:12:33.400 | and people had to come (knocking)

01:12:35.640 | and knock on the door before they come in,

01:12:37.940 | or maybe a more Jewish or Mediterranean culture

01:12:44.480 | where you clap before you come in.

01:12:46.880 | Well, how are you gonna deal with that?

01:12:52.920 | She thinks it's incredibly rude

01:12:58.080 | for people to just walk in on you.

01:13:00.120 | So, where are the boundaries there?

01:13:05.740 | What do you talk about?

01:13:09.920 | Maybe they're having problems

01:13:11.240 | in their physical relationship with one another,

01:13:13.880 | and she goes and talks to her girlfriends

01:13:16.080 | about those problems,

01:13:17.960 | and he's greatly offended about that.

01:13:20.120 | Don't go sharing all of that,

01:13:23.220 | or maybe she's very private about those issues,

01:13:27.160 | and he goes and talks with his boyfriends

01:13:28.880 | about the problems that he's having,

01:13:30.480 | and she's greatly offended by that.

01:13:33.880 | What are the boundaries?

01:13:36.720 | Where are they?

01:13:39.240 | Or there are extended family boundaries as well.

01:13:43.320 | How much do we let mom and dad, aunts and uncles,

01:13:47.180 | other siblings, brothers and sisters,

01:13:49.240 | know about what's going on in our marriage?

01:13:51.700 | He or she may think that there's no problem with that.

01:13:56.600 | So, I let my mom and dad know

01:13:58.200 | everything that's going on in our marriage.

01:13:59.440 | I let my siblings know everything

01:14:01.400 | that's going on in our marriage,

01:14:02.400 | and their spouse gets really offended at that.

01:14:06.040 | No, that's for us.

01:14:06.920 | That's private information.

01:14:08.580 | You don't share that.

01:14:09.880 | That can cause a lot of problems.

01:14:14.000 | Or there could be religious spiritual issues.

01:14:18.880 | She likes this church over here,

01:14:22.560 | and he likes this church over here,

01:14:24.200 | and they're both Bible-teaching,

01:14:26.360 | conservative, Bible-believing, expository churches.

01:14:31.360 | She likes this one, and he likes this one.

01:14:34.840 | Could be a problem.

01:14:41.300 | Or there's ethical standards.

01:14:43.140 | Maybe she was reared in a culture of situational ethics,

01:14:50.100 | where it's okay on very rare occasions to tell lies

01:14:56.460 | if you believe that's going to be for the good

01:14:59.740 | in the long run.

01:15:01.380 | And she uses examples of that.

01:15:02.900 | I mean, Rahab did that.

01:15:04.740 | She told lies about the spy, right?

01:15:08.100 | About the spy, right?

01:15:09.300 | Sarah did that for Abraham.

01:15:15.020 | He told, she told lies.

01:15:17.180 | She said that she was his sister

01:15:20.140 | in order to save his skin.

01:15:21.660 | And the Bible doesn't say anything negative about Sarah

01:15:26.180 | for doing that, does it?

01:15:27.380 | And so, she came out of a situation where,

01:15:31.540 | or an environment where it was okay to tell a lie sometimes.

01:15:35.580 | And he comes out of an environment where,

01:15:37.220 | no, it's not okay to tell a lie, ever to tell a lie.

01:15:41.920 | You shouldn't do that.

01:15:47.140 | So there's differences in ethical standards.

01:15:49.900 | There's differences in family life, in family life.

01:15:54.800 | I grew up in a home where my mother every Sunday,

01:16:04.140 | every Sunday had a big meal, Sunday afternoon.

01:16:09.140 | I mean, she would kill the fatted calf.

01:16:12.700 | She would have mashed potatoes, gravy, roast beef,

01:16:19.000 | green beans, corn, you know, she would just lay it out.

01:16:24.620 | Sunday afternoon was always the big meal of the week.

01:16:27.320 | My wife grew up in the type of a family

01:16:31.780 | where her mother would set out loaf of bread,

01:16:34.380 | bologna, ketchup, mustard.

01:16:40.620 | You were free to go by and get anything

01:16:42.260 | if you were hungry or you wanted.

01:16:43.900 | So, you get married.

01:16:49.160 | The first Sunday we're married,

01:16:51.700 | what is this bologna sitting on the table?

01:16:53.780 | Where's my roast beef?

01:16:57.680 | What is this?

01:17:01.840 | [laughs]

01:17:03.920 | So there can be differences when people get married

01:17:09.800 | in family life and expectations.

01:17:12.520 | Sometimes I talk with this when I'm doing

01:17:14.200 | premarital couple, counseling with couples,

01:17:17.240 | and what's gonna happen the first holiday that comes up?

01:17:22.240 | Like Christmas.

01:17:26.760 | Well, she automatically thinks we're gonna go

01:17:28.480 | to my parents' house for Christmas,

01:17:30.040 | and he automatically thinks we're gonna go

01:17:31.740 | to my parents' house for Christmas.

01:17:33.800 | And then sometimes the parents throw different incentives

01:17:38.080 | to come to their various houses in there, all right?

01:17:41.440 | If you come to our house, then whatever.

01:17:45.260 | Well, that can cause problems in terms of family life.

01:17:50.980 | Then there's social involvement and friendships.

01:17:57.800 | How involved should he get with his golfing buddies

01:18:00.880 | and his friends or his friends where he goes fishing,

01:18:03.520 | and how involved should she get with the girls

01:18:06.500 | that she goes out to movies with,

01:18:08.460 | and how involved is all of this?

01:18:12.180 | They're married now, this is different.

01:18:20.960 | Their primary relationship is to each other.

01:18:26.960 | Or there's also different ideas about finances, too.

01:18:30.080 | She grows up in a home where, boy,

01:18:41.160 | mom and dad pinched every penny, pinched every penny.

01:18:46.160 | And you never buy anything, anything,

01:18:54.520 | unless you can find the absolute cheapest thing to buy.

01:18:58.560 | And so you look for the cheapest thing.

01:19:04.480 | And he goes out and takes the money,

01:19:07.760 | and he buys something kind of frivolously,

01:19:11.200 | and gets home, and she just erupts.

01:19:14.440 | What have you done?

01:19:15.820 | You can't do this with our money.

01:19:19.180 | You're gonna bankrupt us.

01:19:20.760 | What did I do?

01:19:21.940 | I didn't do it, I just, you know.

01:19:24.600 | I saw it, it was on a pretty good price,

01:19:27.200 | and I thought it would be good for us.

01:19:28.760 | He thought he was doing something good.

01:19:30.720 | Could be a pretty big problem.

01:19:35.120 | Different view of finances.

01:19:36.640 | Different view of sexual relationships.

01:19:41.320 | When you teach them, and later on we'll talk about this

01:19:45.760 | from 1 Corinthians chapter seven,

01:19:47.160 | but when you teach them that their role

01:19:49.300 | in a sexual relationship is the fulfillment of their spouse,

01:19:52.520 | even with that biblical understanding

01:19:55.680 | tucked under their belt that they take

01:19:57.360 | into the physical relationship,

01:19:59.520 | still a Christian couple will have a tendency

01:20:01.600 | to pass each other in the,

01:20:03.040 | they're like ships passing in the night.

01:20:05.280 | Why?

01:20:06.120 | Because she will try to fulfill him sexually

01:20:09.520 | the way that a girl would be fulfilled,

01:20:11.840 | and she, or he, would try to fulfill her

01:20:15.140 | the way a guy would be fulfilled,

01:20:17.080 | and they're like two ships totally missing each other.

01:20:21.640 | Different views of the physical relationship in marriage.

01:20:25.380 | That can become a problem.

01:20:27.980 | Or there's different views, especially in terms of priority,

01:20:37.600 | of finances and material things.

01:20:39.800 | How important are finances?

01:20:44.240 | For him, it may be vitally important.

01:20:47.440 | For her, it's not as important.

01:20:50.600 | Material things are really important.

01:20:53.120 | I've got to keep up the Joneses.

01:20:54.320 | I've got to keep up this lifestyle.

01:20:55.920 | This isn't, but for her, that's not important,

01:20:58.440 | or vice versa.

01:20:59.380 | Or sometimes there is even recreational concerns.

01:21:08.160 | What are we gonna get involved with recreationally?

01:21:13.520 | The things that he enjoys is different

01:21:15.160 | than the things that she enjoys.

01:21:16.760 | What can they enjoy together?

01:21:19.740 | - She's not gonna sit on the couch and watch football.

01:21:24.740 | - She's not gonna sit on the couch and watch football.

01:21:29.880 | No, I don't think that's gonna happen.

01:21:31.780 | Unless she really likes football.

01:21:35.700 | Maybe she had a father and brothers

01:21:37.260 | who were really into football,

01:21:38.340 | and so she grew up learning to like football,

01:21:40.600 | or she really likes baseball,

01:21:42.020 | or she really likes soccer, whatever.

01:21:44.380 | What's that?

01:21:48.780 | - She's gonna like soccer.

01:21:50.820 | - She's gonna like soccer.

01:21:52.220 | You want me to quiz her and see if that's true, or?

01:21:59.700 | All right, or there's also just lifestyle

01:22:08.220 | nitty gritty issues, like for example, this.

01:22:16.380 | Let's say that she grew up in a home

01:22:20.340 | where everybody in the household

01:22:22.340 | ran around the household in their underwear.

01:22:24.740 | Everybody in the household ran around like that.

01:22:29.500 | That's the way everybody did.

01:22:30.940 | The girls and the guys all ran around in their underwear.

01:22:34.540 | It was no big deal.

01:22:36.180 | He did not grow up in that kind of a household.

01:22:39.060 | He grew up in a household where once you leave the room,

01:22:45.620 | that wherever you sleep at night, you're fully dressed.

01:22:49.420 | None of this running around in underwear, right?

01:22:52.700 | So, her parents come to visit,

01:22:56.880 | and she shows up outside her room in her underwear,

01:23:03.100 | and so do her parents, and he's horrified.

01:23:06.780 | What is this?

01:23:10.040 | This is in my house.

01:23:12.420 | This is not gonna go on in my house.

01:23:15.020 | This is terrible, right?

01:23:17.780 | Well, to her, it's nothing.

01:23:22.140 | That's what?

01:23:22.980 | What is the big problem?

01:23:25.180 | Wow, are you uptight, she says.

01:23:29.060 | I'm not uptight.

01:23:29.900 | This is the way I was raised.

01:23:32.020 | You don't walk out of your room unless you have clothes on.

01:23:34.940 | That's the way it goes,

01:23:37.340 | but that can cause quite a bit of conflict, you see.

01:23:41.580 | Difficult issues.

01:23:44.440 | She maybe was raised in a household where you could talk

01:23:49.440 | about kind of girly things right out in the open

01:23:56.600 | in front of the brothers and everybody.

01:23:58.720 | He was not raised in that kind of a house,

01:24:00.800 | and so one day, she's there sitting

01:24:06.240 | with extended family members and talking

01:24:08.000 | about all these things in public,

01:24:10.080 | and he's horrified at what his wife is saying.

01:24:14.000 | Or maybe it's vice versa.

01:24:17.200 | Maybe he's the one that's talking about all the kinds

01:24:20.000 | of womanly things out in public

01:24:21.560 | in front of the extended relatives,

01:24:24.040 | and she's the one that was raised in a household.

01:24:26.400 | You don't talk about that.

01:24:27.760 | Why, only the women talked about this among themselves.

01:24:30.760 | She's the one that's horrified at what he's saying,

01:24:35.280 | and she can't wait to get him behind closed doors

01:24:40.140 | and say, what are you doing?

01:24:42.320 | All those little nitty gritty things that come up

01:24:47.120 | in marriage that bring out our sinful nature,

01:24:52.040 | our depravity, what we really want,

01:24:54.040 | what we're really craving for.

01:24:55.240 | We have a conception of the way

01:24:56.800 | that we want our marriage to be,

01:24:58.560 | and somehow that person is not fitting our expectations

01:25:01.840 | or our conception.

01:25:02.800 | That can cause a lot of difficulty,

01:25:07.720 | and you need to find that out in your counselees.

01:25:12.720 | What's going on there?

01:25:13.960 | What's happening there?

01:25:16.680 | Because this is where the word of God

01:25:19.400 | tremendously changes people in the nitty gritty,

01:25:23.440 | in the little details of life.

01:25:26.600 | This is what makes marriages really, really improve

01:25:30.200 | to God's honor and glory,

01:25:32.480 | but you've got to get down on that level

01:25:34.320 | and know how to address the specifics of that level

01:25:37.640 | if you're gonna see any success

01:25:42.000 | in ministering the word of God.

01:25:43.640 | Now, if all you're interested in is dispensing the Bible,

01:25:47.200 | then you're not gonna get into the nitty gritty,

01:25:49.680 | but if you really wanna minister the word of God,

01:25:53.800 | that means minister it in such a way

01:25:55.380 | that it gets down to the fine details of their life,

01:25:58.320 | then you're gonna need to know some of those things,

01:26:00.680 | not because you're curious.

01:26:02.660 | I tell people, boy, God got rid of my curiosity years ago.

01:26:07.380 | I know way too much about way too many people.

01:26:11.100 | I don't have one bit of curiosity left in my entire body.

01:26:15.720 | It's nothing.

01:26:16.560 | I don't wanna know anything about anybody,

01:26:19.460 | but I will if I'm gonna help them.

01:26:22.460 | I don't have any curiosity left.

01:26:25.660 | I really don't,

01:26:29.060 | but I want to hear because for one reason,

01:26:34.060 | I can't help you if I'm operating in the dark.

01:26:37.860 | I gotta know what's going on in your home.

01:26:39.740 | I gotta know what's going on in your marriage.

01:26:42.300 | I've gotta know what's going on on a day-to-day basis,

01:26:45.700 | and that helps me to put all the pieces

01:26:47.700 | of the puzzle together

01:26:48.900 | and then diagnose the problem from the word of God

01:26:55.380 | and find God's answers to those problems.

01:26:57.680 | (pensive music)

01:27:00.340 | (pensive music)

01:27:03.000 | [BLANK_AUDIO]

Lecture 7: Marriage and Family Counseling - Dr. John D. Street

Chapters