Shaun_final_-_12623_8.08_AM
00:00:00.000 | Hello, everybody.
00:00:09.880 | It's Sam from the Financial Samurai Podcast.
00:00:12.640 | And in this episode, I have a very special guest with me, Sean Livingston, four-time
00:00:20.040 | NBA champion with the Warriors, three as a player and one as an executive.
00:00:26.600 | Welcome to the Financial Samurai Podcast.
00:00:28.080 | Thanks for having me on.
00:00:30.640 | I appreciate it.
00:00:32.120 | It's great to have you on.
00:00:33.960 | You're definitely one of my favorite players of all time.
00:00:37.280 | And we've gotten to know each other pretty well over the years.
00:00:40.460 | And I really appreciate you reaching out.
00:00:42.440 | I remember you first reached out, this was like your last two years of your playing career.
00:00:49.080 | What was the impetus to reach out back then?
00:00:51.480 | Yeah.
00:00:52.480 | So I had been playing for about 13 years at that point.
00:00:56.400 | I think it was around 2018.
00:00:59.080 | And it was kind of handwriting on the wall.
00:01:01.680 | You know, I went through some injuries.
00:01:04.160 | We were going through our run with Golden State, but it was coming towards the end of
00:01:08.080 | my career.
00:01:09.080 | I feel it physically, mentally, emotionally.
00:01:12.080 | And I was looking at the next chapter and came across this website, Financial Samurai.
00:01:18.480 | I said, "What the hell is this?
00:01:21.440 | What is this?"
00:01:23.680 | And I remember just diving in and just talking about goals and not just retirement and planning,
00:01:33.760 | but also life.
00:01:34.760 | And I had just started a family.
00:01:37.760 | I just had my first daughter in 2017, got married.
00:01:42.680 | So just a whole new experience and really related to the website and been a fan member
00:01:48.200 | ever since.
00:01:49.200 | No, that's really great to hear.
00:01:51.680 | I mean, it's so funny that who would have thought you write a website and an NBA player
00:01:57.320 | would come and look and he's thinking about his future.
00:01:59.920 | And I think that's great that you were thinking ahead.
00:02:02.760 | And when you talked about the end was near and you talked about the mental and then the
00:02:08.560 | physical, what do you think goes first, at least for you, the mental exhaustion or the
00:02:13.760 | physical exhaustion of playing in the NBA for so many years?
00:02:17.360 | Yeah, that's a great question.
00:02:19.320 | I think it varies player by player.
00:02:22.320 | Some guys have to retire real early.
00:02:23.880 | You look at different sports like football, right?
00:02:26.640 | It's different.
00:02:27.640 | Oh, yeah.
00:02:28.640 | For me, I think it was mentally and emotionally just exhausting from taking care of all the
00:02:33.920 | rehab, all of the training, all the whole process.
00:02:37.760 | The process to be a professional athlete for some, some guys are super athletic, super
00:02:43.000 | talented, God gifted, wake out of bed and throw a ball 100 yards or run a 4-4-4.
00:02:49.280 | But, you know, at that point in my career, just the, you know, the everyday minutiae
00:02:57.120 | of really taking care of your body.
00:02:59.320 | Also the travel, you know, getting up, traveling on the planes, getting in at 4am.
00:03:05.480 | This is, you know, an incredible lifestyle.
00:03:07.480 | You know, I was grateful for it, but definitely hit different in your 20s as opposed to, you
00:03:13.360 | know, your later career in your 30s.
00:03:15.500 | So for me, just that mental and emotional exhaustion was starting to take place.
00:03:21.120 | And also by then, how many championships did you win?
00:03:25.080 | Yeah, we, we had, we were 2-1 at that point.
00:03:30.320 | We were just going into 2018.
00:03:32.200 | So we had won our third championship that year.
00:03:36.880 | So when you got three, it's kind of like, it's almost kind of like house's money.
00:03:40.400 | You're like, yeah, I got it all.
00:03:42.360 | So, I mean, the difference between three and four, it's kind of, is that a big of deal
00:03:47.480 | as going from zero to one?
00:03:49.760 | Yeah, I mean, it may not feel different.
00:03:54.800 | It does feel different actually, because the first one, you know, it's nothing like the
00:03:58.840 | first.
00:03:59.840 | Nothing like the first, right.
00:04:00.840 | It's just like, it's just getting up there.
00:04:02.320 | All, you know, the journey, it's like your life story, right?
00:04:05.360 | And you're up there and it's, you know, it's just this huge culmination of, you know, everything
00:04:11.400 | you worked for.
00:04:12.400 | But then, you know, I think going into the third one and then seeing the fourth one being
00:04:17.560 | won as an executive, you know, I think the appreciation, you know, and then the craftsmanship
00:04:23.840 | that goes into those because of, you know, you're relying on your experience, you're
00:04:28.520 | relying on kind of workforce knowledge, if you will, right.
00:04:32.320 | Yeah.
00:04:33.320 | You know, getting there, how to win, how to do it, as opposed to, you know, maybe some
00:04:37.400 | of that, you know, athleticism or just excitement, you know, wanting to really do it in the beginning.
00:04:44.080 | But I'll take all the rings.
00:04:48.600 | I mean, four rings.
00:04:50.000 | Well, how many players in the NBA have four rings?
00:04:54.440 | Do you know?
00:04:55.440 | Yeah, no, man.
00:04:56.440 | Not a lot.
00:04:57.440 | It's got to be less than a percent, one percent.
00:05:01.000 | Yeah, yeah.
00:05:02.000 | It's not a lot.
00:05:03.000 | I mean, it's, I'm grateful, you know, who would have thought, you know.
00:05:07.360 | If I had signed up 2014, you know, I would have been on that journey.
00:05:10.160 | So right, right.
00:05:11.160 | You know, best decision, best decision they ever made.
00:05:15.160 | Hey, you had to accept it, right?
00:05:18.040 | You got to say no, go and stay.
00:05:19.400 | I don't want the millions or whatever your contract.
00:05:22.920 | I want to stay.
00:05:23.920 | Where were you before Golden State?
00:05:24.920 | Yeah.
00:05:25.920 | So I was in Brooklyn.
00:05:26.920 | Right, right.
00:05:27.920 | I was in Brooklyn playing for the Nets.
00:05:28.920 | That year, we had Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Darren Williams.
00:05:34.280 | So they had some greats.
00:05:35.560 | But it was, you know, it was a gamble because I had a chance to play, you know, it was the
00:05:40.840 | year of 2014, 2015.
00:05:41.840 | I had an opportunity to play for a couple other teams that offered me around the same
00:05:48.360 | contract, the same money.
00:05:51.040 | But the opportunity was too great to play at Golden State.
00:05:54.600 | And, you know, it worked out.
00:05:56.520 | It worked out.
00:05:57.520 | No, it definitely worked out.
00:05:58.760 | I mean, back in 2014, I mean, clearly you had to look at the roster composition and
00:06:04.360 | the coach.
00:06:05.360 | It wasn't Mark Jackson at the time.
00:06:06.920 | I forgot.
00:06:07.920 | That's right.
00:06:08.920 | Jackson.
00:06:09.920 | But did you see that team and say, "Ah, this is a team where it has potential"?
00:06:15.840 | How did you go about assessing that, the team aspect before making that decision to join?
00:06:22.040 | It's interesting.
00:06:23.040 | The year I was in Brooklyn, we played Golden State.
00:06:25.560 | They were on an East Coast road trip.
00:06:27.120 | And I want to say this was like the last or second to last game before they were going
00:06:32.200 | home.
00:06:33.200 | And they were on a back-to-back, just played Miami, who at the time were the defending
00:06:36.840 | champions, just beat Miami.
00:06:38.480 | And they were really rolling.
00:06:40.760 | You know, they had a really good year that year.
00:06:42.760 | Lost to the Clippers in the playoffs.
00:06:45.020 | This was a night in January.
00:06:47.360 | And I remember going to Chapel.
00:06:49.080 | We go to the Chapels before games.
00:06:50.800 | You know, just regular routine.
00:06:53.640 | And who walks in?
00:06:55.200 | Mark Jackson.
00:06:56.200 | You know, Mark Jackson walks in.
00:06:59.720 | You know, I see him.
00:07:00.720 | I nod.
00:07:01.720 | I say, "What's up?"
00:07:02.720 | We go through Chapel.
00:07:04.600 | And then afterwards, he stops me.
00:07:07.000 | And he's like, "Hey, man.
00:07:09.160 | Really proud of your journey.
00:07:10.160 | We're watching you.
00:07:11.160 | Keep going."
00:07:12.160 | And I just remember, you know, just him giving me that affirmation.
00:07:18.160 | And, you know, somebody that I really respected, Mark Jackson, one of the all-time great point
00:07:23.520 | guards out of New York City.
00:07:26.280 | Great coach at the time.
00:07:27.280 | Golden State's really rolling, having a lot of success.
00:07:30.120 | And so, in the back of my mind, Golden State is like an option.
00:07:34.760 | You know, it's like, "Oh, Mark Jackson kind of likes my game."
00:07:38.360 | You know, I'm looking at Golden State.
00:07:40.120 | They're a team on the rise.
00:07:42.080 | And at this point in my career, I just want to be on a playoff team.
00:07:44.800 | And I want to be in the playoffs.
00:07:46.720 | Shooting for a chance for a championship.
00:07:48.520 | That's all I can ask for.
00:07:50.840 | And so, it's just funny how it came full circle.
00:07:54.920 | Now, when I signed with Golden State, Mark Jackson had just got fired and Steve Kerr
00:08:00.240 | was the new coach.
00:08:02.640 | And so, it's just, you know, ironic how things work out.
00:08:06.600 | But I truly do believe, even if Mark Jackson would have been head coach, I might have been
00:08:10.720 | playing for Golden State.
00:08:12.320 | Yeah.
00:08:13.320 | Now, that's interesting.
00:08:15.520 | It certainly seems that the coach has a lot of sway in how the roster is built.
00:08:21.520 | And you spent several years as an executive after you played.
00:08:24.280 | So, how much power does the coach have?
00:08:27.320 | So, if Steve Kerr says, "I want some kid from this college or from this team on the East
00:08:33.160 | Coast in the NBA," how much sway do they have to bring them on board?
00:08:37.240 | Yeah.
00:08:38.240 | Well, I mean, when you win multiple championships, I think that usually factors in.
00:08:43.200 | Right?
00:08:44.200 | So, it's really relative to your experience.
00:08:46.640 | Similar to probably most corporate jobs, I'd imagine.
00:08:50.960 | The more experience, the bigger your resume and your track record, I think the more autonomy
00:08:56.320 | that you may have from upper management or your board.
00:09:00.280 | And in that case, Steve Kerr, he had earned his right to really sit at the table.
00:09:05.720 | Yeah.
00:09:06.720 | And he's the one that's making the coaching decisions at the end of the day.
00:09:11.160 | And so, for someone like him to not have a voice, I think it really hinders the development
00:09:16.560 | of the team and the direction you're going.
00:09:19.040 | Right.
00:09:20.040 | So, it's a case-by-case basis based on the coach and their relationship with the organization.
00:09:25.360 | Right.
00:09:26.360 | It does seem interesting because some coaches, like Doc Rivers was coach and president or
00:09:31.600 | something.
00:09:32.600 | So, it seems like he had more say.
00:09:34.520 | And I guess some newer coaches have less say.
00:09:37.440 | That's right.
00:09:38.440 | And you're seeing more of the hybrid roles, I believe, Greg Popovich, Doc Rivers, and
00:09:44.880 | Phil Jackson.
00:09:45.880 | But these are household names.
00:09:47.800 | Right.
00:09:48.800 | I mean, these are names that, you know, guys that won multiple championships.
00:09:52.520 | They're honored coaches.
00:09:54.480 | But I will say it's very hard to do dual responsibilities.
00:09:58.960 | Just like with anything.
00:09:59.960 | You usually outsource maybe the CFO or CMO, right?
00:10:03.360 | I mean, it's all different jobs.
00:10:06.480 | So, I think with the structure of having a general manager in place and a head coach,
00:10:12.120 | and then for those guys to really work together in tangent, that's found to have the most
00:10:17.200 | success, I believe.
00:10:18.200 | Right.
00:10:19.200 | Let's talk a little bit about your background because I know you grew up in Peoria, Illinois.
00:10:24.760 | You're 6'7" and you went straight to the NBA.
00:10:28.600 | So, to me and I think to many listeners, you've been one of the trailblazers.
00:10:33.040 | You're like a prototype point guard, different type of point guard, like Magic Johnson who
00:10:38.600 | was 6'8", 6'9", and you went straight to the NBA.
00:10:41.760 | So, can you talk about that journey from high school to almost going to college and then
00:10:49.000 | going to the NBA first and then how you were, I guess, viewed upon back in that day when
00:10:54.400 | you were in high school?
00:10:55.400 | Yeah.
00:10:56.400 | Oh, that was, man, that was a whirlwind of a time.
00:10:59.680 | So, I graduated high school in 2004, it was class of 2004.
00:11:05.480 | And at that time, LeBron James had just come out of high school and went into the NBA draft.
00:11:10.360 | He was the first pick out of 2003.
00:11:13.320 | And that was the famous class of LeBron James, Dwayne Wade, Chris Bosh, Carmelo Anthony.
00:11:19.240 | I mean, hall of famers, right?
00:11:21.400 | Yeah, for sure.
00:11:22.400 | But LeBron James was the only one out of high school.
00:11:25.120 | Kendrick Perkins as well.
00:11:26.520 | He's a funny as can be personality.
00:11:29.520 | Perks, yeah.
00:11:30.520 | Yeah.
00:11:31.520 | So, it was a trend.
00:11:32.520 | You saw a trend of high school players.
00:11:34.120 | Obviously, the Kobe Bryants and the Kevin Garnetts, guys that have gone way before my
00:11:38.800 | time.
00:11:39.800 | So, coming into my senior year, I had a lot of whatever you want to call it, hype, you
00:11:45.360 | know, around my basketball future.
00:11:48.000 | While I go to college, while I go to the NBA.
00:11:51.080 | And before my senior year, I signed on to go to Duke University.
00:11:54.800 | Right.
00:11:55.800 | I was going to play for Coach K.
00:11:57.200 | Coach K.
00:11:58.200 | Legendary.
00:11:59.200 | Legend.
00:12:00.200 | Drank the Kool-Aid.
00:12:01.200 | Free tuition, right?
00:12:02.200 | That's right.
00:12:03.200 | That's right.
00:12:04.200 | That's right.
00:12:05.200 | Great university, great players.
00:12:06.200 | And after my senior year, I played in a couple of All-American games in front of some Pro
00:12:11.980 | Scouts.
00:12:12.980 | And I did some workouts.
00:12:13.980 | And towards the end of my senior year, I was traveling on the weekends, getting out of
00:12:18.920 | school early Friday, going up to work out in Chicago with Tim Grover.
00:12:24.760 | Tim Grover at the time had worked with Michael Jordan.
00:12:27.800 | So, that was his personal career.
00:12:28.800 | Oh, okay.
00:12:29.800 | Oh, wow.
00:12:30.800 | And, you know, so at that time, MJ had just retired.
00:12:33.800 | Tim Grover had just retired.
00:12:34.800 | Tim Grover was doing his thing.
00:12:38.440 | And he had all the best talent competition coming, you know, and playing pickup, you
00:12:44.640 | know, during the summer.
00:12:45.640 | So, guys would come back and play.
00:12:47.640 | And so, this was kind of my foray into the NBA world.
00:12:53.000 | And so, I remember doing a workout that Steve Kerr actually was at at the time.
00:12:57.760 | Oh, really?
00:12:58.760 | And he was the general manager of the Phoenix Suns.
00:13:01.080 | Oh, yeah.
00:13:02.080 | That's right.
00:13:03.080 | And so, he was at this workout.
00:13:04.640 | It was 30 NBA scouts.
00:13:07.080 | And there was nobody else that I was playing with.
00:13:08.800 | It was just one on one workout.
00:13:10.800 | Really?
00:13:11.800 | Just 30 scouts, you and…
00:13:12.800 | 30 scouts.
00:13:13.800 | And me and Tim Grover.
00:13:14.800 | Me, Tim Grover, and a rebound guy.
00:13:16.800 | And he put me through this workout for an hour.
00:13:19.080 | You know, I'm running, running full court, three dribbles, going, "Ah!"
00:13:22.600 | Running right down three quarters, going, "Ah!"
00:13:25.000 | You know, like showing my handles, dribbling, you know, doing all these different drills.
00:13:28.720 | So, after the workout, you know, I'm still deciding, "Do I want to go to the NBA?
00:13:32.720 | Am I going to college?"
00:13:34.400 | And this was kind of my test.
00:13:37.280 | And I remember Tim Grover, you know, he was kind of, you know, talking with the scouts
00:13:41.560 | afterwards.
00:13:42.560 | I'm going, getting dressed in the hockey room, kind of finish my second workout for
00:13:45.720 | the day.
00:13:46.880 | And he comes in.
00:13:47.880 | He's like, "You're not going lower than seven.
00:13:49.560 | You're not."
00:13:50.560 | Oh, nice.
00:13:51.560 | He says, "Atlanta Hawks, they got the seventh pick."
00:13:52.840 | He's like, "I know them."
00:13:54.400 | He's like, "We're not letting them get lower than seven."
00:13:57.840 | So at that point, I'm like, "Okay."
00:13:59.840 | Huh.
00:14:00.840 | All right.
00:14:01.840 | I could be top seven.
00:14:02.840 | Like, that's realistic.
00:14:05.600 | It's not just draft board.
00:14:07.480 | It's not just a mock draft, right?
00:14:09.280 | All right.
00:14:10.280 | So, I'm like, "Okay.
00:14:11.280 | I can go to college, right, and try to move up to top five, maybe top three."
00:14:17.840 | Right.
00:14:18.840 | Because, you know, backtracking, my goal, my dream was always to make it to the NBA.
00:14:22.280 | I grew up in Peoria, Illinois, Chicago right up the street, the Bulls, MJ, championships,
00:14:28.400 | '90s.
00:14:29.400 | That was my dream.
00:14:30.400 | Amazing.
00:14:31.400 | Exactly.
00:14:32.400 | So now, to be going through this, working out with this trainer, the whole nine, this
00:14:36.600 | was my dream to make it to the NBA.
00:14:38.680 | So the probability and the chances of me going higher than top five, top seven were really
00:14:46.040 | low by going to college.
00:14:48.640 | You know, because I could get injured as well.
00:14:50.680 | Sure.
00:14:51.680 | I could get a heart attack and my stock could fall.
00:14:52.680 | You know, there's different things.
00:14:54.360 | So I went for it.
00:14:57.080 | And so I entered my name in the draft.
00:14:59.360 | I hired an agent.
00:15:00.360 | I ended up getting picked number four.
00:15:01.800 | Nice.
00:15:02.800 | Number four pick out of high school, going to the Los Angeles Clippers.
00:15:06.120 | And then it was just, I was like a deer in headlights.
00:15:09.160 | I was like, "I made it."
00:15:10.160 | You know?
00:15:11.160 | You made it.
00:15:12.160 | But then I get there and it's like newsflash.
00:15:13.640 | It's like the journey starts all over again.
00:15:15.680 | Yeah.
00:15:16.680 | You're at the bottom of the totem pole.
00:15:17.680 | You know?
00:15:18.680 | It's like, "Get the towels, Rook."
00:15:19.680 | You know?
00:15:20.680 | Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:15:21.680 | "Get the bags."
00:15:22.680 | Is it one year of hazing or in general?
00:15:23.680 | Is that how it goes?
00:15:24.680 | They do it differently.
00:15:25.680 | It's one year or 82 games, depending on, you know, you got to go through your whole 82.
00:15:26.680 | So if you're injured that first year, you might have to make it up.
00:15:27.680 | But usually it's that first year.
00:15:28.680 | And you know, so even back then you were going through this cost benefit analysis.
00:15:29.680 | You know, in high school you're like, "What is the percentage chance I'm going to make
00:15:30.680 | it?"
00:15:31.680 | And you're like, "I'm going to make it."
00:15:32.680 | And you're like, "I'm going to make it."
00:15:33.680 | And you're like, "I'm going to make it."
00:15:34.680 | And you're like, "I'm going to make it."
00:15:35.680 | And you're like, "I'm going to make it."
00:15:36.680 | And you're like, "I'm going to make it."
00:16:01.400 | How does the money work in terms of the cliffs?
00:16:04.200 | Like, is it, you know, how does that work?
00:16:07.120 | First round money, second round money, guarantees.
00:16:11.360 | What does that look like?
00:16:12.360 | Yeah, yeah.
00:16:13.360 | So usually first round is guaranteed.
00:16:16.920 | And then it's a tiered system based on the salary cap.
00:16:20.080 | Obviously the salary cap has gone up over the years.
00:16:22.560 | So those tiers have been getting bigger.
00:16:25.440 | And you see, I believe the number one pick, maybe, you know, my year was making $4 million.
00:16:32.080 | Now the number one pick may be making $12 million.
00:16:34.840 | And that's for how many years?
00:16:37.280 | For three years, guaranteed.
00:16:39.280 | Got it.
00:16:40.280 | With a fourth year option.
00:16:43.000 | And so, you know, but if you're drafted in the second round based on the economics, some
00:16:48.160 | of those guys are signing longer term guarantee deals.
00:16:51.900 | Some of them are signing non-guaranteed deals.
00:16:54.240 | But the chance of you playing yourself into a higher deal, you can do that a lot faster
00:17:00.880 | than a first round guy.
00:17:02.200 | If, you know, so you see guys like Austin Reeves.
00:17:06.120 | You see guys like Gilbert Arenas.
00:17:08.560 | Max Struess.
00:17:09.560 | Max Struess, exactly.
00:17:10.560 | You see these second rounders who, if they crack the rotation and they start to play
00:17:16.320 | really well and their stock goes up, I mean, they could sign a long term deal, you know,
00:17:22.560 | $50, $60 million plus deal for their second, third year in the league.
00:17:28.560 | Whereas as a first rounder, if they extend you and they continue qualifying options and
00:17:33.600 | different things like that, you might have to wait four or five years before you see
00:17:39.120 | a second contract.
00:17:40.120 | Oh, that's fascinating because, I mean, another guy, obviously, is Draymond Green.
00:17:45.360 | Was he first round or second round?
00:17:46.360 | Second round.
00:17:47.360 | He was picked second round, right?
00:17:48.400 | And so he, nobody really kind of was thinking, "Wow, Draymond."
00:17:51.840 | But then, obviously, he went into the rotation when David Lee got injured and, obviously,
00:17:56.760 | he's a great player now.
00:17:59.080 | That's a perfect example.
00:18:00.400 | That's a perfect example.
00:18:01.400 | And he signed his long term contract after his third year, right?
00:18:06.200 | Right.
00:18:07.200 | I mean, so just, you know, all it took was one year for him to crack the rotation and
00:18:11.720 | move his way and then we win a championship and now he's, right?
00:18:15.560 | So it's market timing sometimes as well.
00:18:18.000 | Yeah.
00:18:19.000 | So, I mean, in that sense, in that sense, would it strategically be better maybe to
00:18:24.800 | go in a later first round or early second round so the expectations aren't as high so
00:18:30.000 | that you have less pressure and you can work your way in versus being a top 10 pick?
00:18:35.600 | Then it's like, "Oh, man, so much expectations."
00:18:38.360 | And then you could be a bust and then all that pressure is on you.
00:18:41.080 | What do you think about that?
00:18:42.080 | Yeah, that's a good question.
00:18:43.080 | You know, I think, again, it's one of those where it comes down to the individual.
00:18:48.800 | I'm a guy where you have to go for it.
00:18:51.840 | You got to go, you know, don't leave anything on the table.
00:18:55.000 | Like if you get a chance to go as high as you can go.
00:18:58.000 | But I do, what I will say is I do believe it matters where certain players go, right?
00:19:07.080 | For instance, you can look at an organization like the Miami Heat, you know, and the way
00:19:11.600 | that they approach things and you look at second rounders able to maximize their talents.
00:19:18.360 | And I believe they get the most out of guys, right?
00:19:23.200 | And so, you know, that matters for certain players who, you know, they may need a certain
00:19:27.800 | level of coaching or a certain level.
00:19:30.680 | Who are their teammates?
00:19:31.680 | Who are guys they've been playing with?
00:19:33.720 | Does it complement their skill set?
00:19:35.920 | Does it complement their personality, right?
00:19:38.440 | So those factors, I think, weigh in on a player's value and a player, you know, how well he's
00:19:43.680 | able to perform on the court.
00:19:45.680 | Right, right.
00:19:46.680 | Let's say you have two variables, your work ethic as a player and your God-given talents
00:19:53.040 | with your physical abilities, IQ and all that.
00:19:57.000 | What do you think differentiates or what do you think is more important to getting to
00:20:04.080 | the top?
00:20:05.080 | Because you got to the top, right?
00:20:06.080 | Like nobody gets the NBA, literally 0.01% of people get in the NBA.
00:20:11.000 | You have so many ballers all across America, all across the world.
00:20:14.520 | Nobody gets in.
00:20:15.520 | How many people are on the team?
00:20:16.520 | Like less than, whatever, 15, 16.
00:20:18.360 | It's so hard to do.
00:20:20.560 | So what would you say was more important for you to get to where you got to go?
00:20:27.080 | Your talent, your God-given talent or your work ethic?
00:20:29.680 | Like what does that ratio look like?
00:20:31.360 | Yeah, yeah, it's a good question.
00:20:33.800 | I'm a believer that your work ethic, I mean, some guys are really gifted.
00:20:40.600 | Some people just have God-given talents, God-given IQ, athletic ability, whatever it is.
00:20:47.640 | But I'm a firm believer to get to that 0.0001.
00:20:50.960 | I talked earlier about it starting over and when you get somewhere you feel like you made
00:20:56.840 | it but even when you get there, there's a pecking order.
00:21:01.840 | You're in the sport of competition.
00:21:03.720 | So in life, yes, comparison isn't healthy.
00:21:07.360 | But in competition, that's exactly like you're looking across, you're constantly weighing
00:21:12.680 | yourself against others, trying to outperform the other guy.
00:21:16.640 | So in that course, you have to have a work ethic and there has to be some level of, I
00:21:21.920 | don't want to say insanity with that work ethic, but it has to be consistent over time.
00:21:27.960 | I think that's where you get a level of professionalism.
00:21:31.760 | That's where guys learn how to be professionals.
00:21:34.680 | It's when you do something over and over and over again on the days especially that you
00:21:40.720 | don't feel like doing it, especially when you're sick, you don't feel well because guess
00:21:45.840 | what?
00:21:46.840 | Life is continuing to happen.
00:21:49.280 | We have things happen, our spouses, girlfriends, kids, families, financial difficulties, the
00:21:58.160 | community, whatever it is that's coming your way.
00:22:01.520 | And so are you going to let those things be distracted from you focusing on the main thing?
00:22:09.520 | That's the main thing that got you there.
00:22:10.920 | And so I think that ratio has to be tilted towards work ethic because the talent is what
00:22:16.880 | it is.
00:22:20.000 | Some of that is, you're already there, especially if you made it to that level, which is already
00:22:27.840 | really hard.
00:22:29.240 | It's already really impossible.
00:22:30.240 | There's 450 jobs in the NBA.
00:22:32.520 | And that's one of the top leagues in the world.
00:22:36.640 | And so I just think that work ethic and that consistency has to be there or else your shelf
00:22:43.040 | life is only going to be so long.
00:22:44.520 | Darrell Bock Yeah, because if you're not doing it, someone
00:22:46.640 | else is doing it.
00:22:48.200 | And I didn't really realize it, but every single year you play, I just kind of take
00:22:54.560 | it for granted as a viewer and as a fan.
00:22:56.640 | Oh, Shawn Livingston is great.
00:22:58.680 | Steph Curry is great.
00:22:59.680 | MJ is great.
00:23:01.120 | But every single year someone's coming into the league trying to take your lunch, eat
00:23:04.520 | your lunch, and they're going to be your teammates.
00:23:07.080 | So you got to be cordial, but also they're trying to take your lunch too and get that
00:23:10.440 | big contract.
00:23:12.320 | So you got to really work.
00:23:13.880 | You got to keep on going.
00:23:15.120 | Jullien Gordon Every year.
00:23:16.720 | Every year there's 60 guys, probably 30 to 45 of them are going to be on your roster.
00:23:22.960 | So you're adding one, two guys, maybe more.
00:23:26.160 | And so again, you might strike gold once, you might get lucky, you might get an opportunity
00:23:33.120 | based on your talents, but how can you sustain that level of performance?
00:23:38.280 | How can you continue to have value to a team?
00:23:42.120 | And so to me, that's why looking at the household names you see, LeBron James, Stephen Curry,
00:23:48.440 | the sustained greatness, their peaks were really super high.
00:23:52.840 | And obviously they'll be in those conversations, but where you start really separating yourself
00:23:58.960 | is the consistency, the sustained greatness of what they're doing.
00:24:03.520 | 20 years, I mean, that's pretty incredible to play at that level, like a Tom Brady or
00:24:09.520 | what LeBron's doing.
00:24:10.520 | Right?
00:24:11.520 | MJ LeBron James Right.
00:24:12.520 | And I also have to imagine that a lot of luck is involved as well.
00:24:16.840 | Because here in, let's say, the corporate world, the CEO of a company, or not even CEO,
00:24:22.120 | let's say just a boss in a division, I truly believe a lot of people can take over the
00:24:28.160 | role as the boss or the CEO, but they're just not given the opportunity.
00:24:33.720 | And I'm sure there's a lot of ballers out there who will probably be great or good enough
00:24:38.220 | to play, maybe not a lot, but they're just not given the opportunity.
00:24:43.160 | And so when I look at, for example, coaches, when I saw Steve Nash get the job as a head
00:24:50.440 | coach at Brooklyn Nets, I was like, "What?
00:24:52.800 | The guy's never coached in his life.
00:24:54.320 | Yeah, he's a Hall of Famer, he's a point guard, but how did he get the job?
00:24:58.960 | Why did he get the job?"
00:24:59.960 | I mean, I'm sure there's a lot of assistant coaches out there grinding it out, thinking,
00:25:04.480 | "What's wrong with me?"
00:25:06.520 | And so it seems like the opportunity is really important to be able to showcase your skills
00:25:11.520 | and succeed.
00:25:12.520 | What are your thoughts on that?
00:25:13.520 | MJ LeBron James Yeah, it is.
00:25:15.240 | You have to, definitely have to have a chance.
00:25:17.440 | But I think what Steve was able to accomplish in his pro career, there's a lot of knowledge
00:25:22.640 | and there's a lot of value in that, especially with sports being different in the fact that
00:25:27.760 | he was a former player.
00:25:29.760 | And I think players, there's something about that correlation there to where we understand
00:25:36.680 | the grind, right?
00:25:37.680 | We understand what it takes.
00:25:39.160 | We understand the dog days, and the ups and downs and the roller coaster.
00:25:45.440 | So I think an example like that, yeah, he didn't have any experience.
00:25:51.160 | Neither did Steve Kerr, right?
00:25:54.480 | And so you look at those guys, but what they were able to accomplish in the game as players,
00:26:01.360 | their respect from former players and players, I think some of those things and dynamics
00:26:08.700 | can outweigh the tenure, right?
00:26:12.800 | Just being there and having the experience.
00:26:16.040 | Not that it should, you still have to perform.
00:26:18.200 | I mean, he's not the coach there yet, because obviously, right?
00:26:21.640 | It's a quick turnover.
00:26:23.400 | And what have you done for me lately?
00:26:25.400 | I mean, that's the nature of pro sports.
00:26:28.520 | But yeah, opportunity is important too, I would agree.
00:26:31.640 | Ramon Maldonado And I think one of the reasons why I'm, one
00:26:34.680 | of the things I'm getting at is when I see the majority of the NBA consists of black
00:26:40.000 | players and there aren't more black coaches, that to me, seems like there's a problem.
00:26:48.120 | To me as a fan, I'm like, why aren't there more black coaches?
00:26:51.920 | Because a lot of them have played in the NBA, they have the pedigree, they have the experience.
00:26:56.640 | I look at your resume, Sean, four championships, three as a player, one as an executive.
00:27:02.920 | You've got authority, you've got respect, you're calm, you have experience.
00:27:09.200 | Why not Sean?
00:27:11.280 | And so that's the thing that I'm thinking about.
00:27:14.120 | Do you think there's an issue with that in the NBA, where there aren't more black coaches?
00:27:20.320 | Sean Larkin I don't personally think that there's an issue
00:27:24.240 | with that.
00:27:25.240 | I think the NBA has done a great job in the diversity field, to be honest with you.
00:27:30.160 | When I look at the landscape of professional sports in general, now, yes, football and
00:27:36.880 | basketball, there are a majority of African Americans that play that sport.
00:27:40.520 | So that's true.
00:27:43.960 | I don't have the statistics in front of me, so I don't want to shoot myself in the foot.
00:27:50.560 | I do know that the NBA has been trending towards more African Americans in the coaching spot.
00:27:58.320 | Now in the executive suite and management, I think that's something that the NBA is looking
00:28:06.400 | to grow as well.
00:28:08.480 | I think that's something that's important for the leagues to grow as well.
00:28:13.920 | Because again, you looked at the players and the relationships with the players.
00:28:18.440 | It's just important to have synergy all the way across.
00:28:21.080 | That's not to say that different races can't get along.
00:28:24.760 | That's not the point.
00:28:25.760 | It's more just about the opportunity.
00:28:26.960 | It's more just about the communication and the respect.
00:28:32.240 | Giving that opportunity to guys that have played as well is important.
00:28:37.880 | They know what it takes.
00:28:38.880 | They've walked in those shoes.
00:28:39.880 | So I just think it's building those other skills.
00:28:43.040 | Can you build those other skills, the soft skills, the day-to-day management skills,
00:28:50.360 | some of those corporate skills?
00:28:52.040 | Can you build some of those for some of these employees?
00:28:54.880 | I think the NBA is doing a good job of trying to move in that direction.
00:28:58.840 | All right.
00:28:59.840 | All right.
00:29:00.840 | I'm just an outsider looking in.
00:29:02.240 | I'm going to name names and not to bag on them.
00:29:08.520 | Coach Popovich, obviously a legend, right?
00:29:10.480 | I think anybody would be honored to play for him.
00:29:13.680 | He's a legend.
00:29:15.280 | But let's say there's another coach who's never played in the NBA before.
00:29:20.140 | You don't share the same cultural background.
00:29:22.560 | And let's say they've never won a championship.
00:29:24.280 | Does it take, as a player, a little bit of time getting used to it and buying into that?
00:29:29.160 | Is it harder?
00:29:30.160 | Absolutely.
00:29:31.160 | I mean, definitely.
00:29:32.160 | I think any new coach, it's going to take time to buy in, depending on the player, depending
00:29:36.960 | on if you have a veteran team, you have a young team.
00:29:40.360 | What kind of players do you have?
00:29:41.360 | What kind of team do you have?
00:29:42.920 | That matters.
00:29:43.920 | And then from there, how equipped is the coach as far as his knowledge?
00:29:47.320 | I mean, he doesn't have experience, but does he know what he's talking about?
00:29:54.080 | As far as when it comes time, right?
00:29:56.240 | I mean, when you get up here, we can talk X's and O's.
00:29:58.760 | But when you actually get in the game and you have to start making some of these decisions
00:30:01.880 | in real time, that's when you start to really know, you start to cut through the weeds.
00:30:07.520 | So yes, it does take time for any new coach.
00:30:10.880 | You look at Steve, like I mentioned, Steve Kerr.
00:30:12.400 | That's a great example.
00:30:13.760 | We won a championship our first year and we had the best record in the league, but there
00:30:17.800 | were still hiccups.
00:30:18.800 | There were still adjustments.
00:30:21.520 | You mentioned Draymond Green, right?
00:30:23.160 | David Lee was an all-star.
00:30:26.440 | When he came back from his injury, he was an all-star the two years before.
00:30:32.080 | So he didn't want to go back to the bench.
00:30:35.400 | So how do you navigate that?
00:30:39.400 | And so those are some of the things that are hard to really teach.
00:30:46.120 | Those are people skills.
00:30:48.000 | So that's where you really see coaches start to separate themselves.
00:30:52.800 | Not everybody has them and not everybody, I don't think, has to have them, but I think
00:30:56.280 | you have to have a basic level of that in professional sports.
00:31:00.280 | What are your thoughts about being a coach or an executive in the future?
00:31:05.440 | Yeah, well, obviously, dove in the last three years with the Warriors and that was great.
00:31:11.000 | Gave me a chance to kind of learn as much as possible, get a peek behind the curtain,
00:31:15.720 | if you will.
00:31:16.720 | But coaching, not right now.
00:31:20.920 | Coaching is more about, I think coaching is about the schedule and right now I'm looking
00:31:27.920 | for more flexibility.
00:31:28.920 | Yeah.
00:31:29.920 | Personally, just after playing for 15 years and just the whole process and the grind.
00:31:36.760 | It is a grind and I loved it during that time as a player.
00:31:41.840 | But I think it's more of a timing thing.
00:31:45.040 | But for me, I think my skill set, I think I would like coaching.
00:31:51.120 | I would enjoy being in the gym, being around players and also having the temperament for
00:31:56.840 | coaching.
00:31:57.840 | So, we'll see.
00:31:58.840 | Maybe down the road.
00:32:00.840 | Yeah.
00:32:01.840 | How about when LeBron brings the NBA team to Vegas in two or three years and the kids
00:32:07.400 | are a little bit older and you're itching to get back.
00:32:10.840 | Does that sound perfect?
00:32:11.840 | Sounds like a forecast right there.
00:32:14.840 | That's my job.
00:32:15.840 | Forecast the future.
00:32:16.840 | Sometimes it doesn't come true, but I mean that sounds to me like a no-brainer.
00:32:20.320 | What do you say?
00:32:21.320 | That's right.
00:32:22.320 | That's right.
00:32:23.320 | You never know.
00:32:24.320 | Endless possibilities.
00:32:25.320 | Yeah.
00:32:26.320 | You got to keep your options open.
00:32:29.320 | You know, I'd love to talk about the money part of the NBA because as a fan, as obviously
00:32:37.360 | players, there's big money involved in the NBA.
00:32:41.240 | And I would just love to hear from you.
00:32:43.360 | You go from high schooler directly to the NBA and so you got this multi-million dollar
00:32:48.720 | contract and then obviously over time you were able to sign more contracts.
00:32:55.260 | How was it like suddenly coming into so much money and is there kind of a money management
00:33:00.440 | program in the NBA to help players keep their money?
00:33:03.760 | There are programs for players.
00:33:07.320 | There is a rookie transition program usually for guys, but it's more of a crash course
00:33:16.520 | where guys get together for three or four days and the NBA Players Union puts on kind
00:33:23.520 | of like a crash course of what life is going to be like.
00:33:27.160 | Right?
00:33:28.160 | Kind of a simulation if you will.
00:33:29.160 | And they bring in different professionals, experts, former players, panelists, but there's
00:33:34.640 | nothing like the real thing.
00:33:36.040 | Right?
00:33:37.040 | And so I think the most important thing is obviously your team.
00:33:42.560 | Who is on your team of people that you trust?
00:33:46.560 | And when these athletes are coming in, we're so young that we just don't have any experience.
00:33:55.560 | How could you?
00:33:56.560 | Right?
00:33:57.560 | I mean for me coming out of high school, I was just coming out of my parents' house,
00:34:01.080 | my grandfather's house.
00:34:02.080 | Right.
00:34:03.080 | And you're in LA.
00:34:04.080 | You've got millions in LA.
00:34:07.800 | That's right.
00:34:08.800 | That's right.
00:34:09.800 | And so, you know, and that itself is kind of a myth.
00:34:12.720 | Having millions right away.
00:34:14.040 | Right?
00:34:15.040 | It's like, you kind of have to work your way into it.
00:34:17.880 | Right?
00:34:18.880 | I mean, you know, like I remember getting, you know, for me I signed a shoe endorsement
00:34:23.160 | deal with Reebok, which was a really big deal at the time.
00:34:27.240 | And you know, I remember one of my first checks, you know, being a quarter of a million, almost
00:34:32.600 | half a million dollars and it was like, yeah, oh my God, this is the most money I've ever
00:34:36.520 | seen before.
00:34:37.520 | Right?
00:34:38.520 | Yeah.
00:34:39.520 | Sweet.
00:34:40.520 | Let's go buy a Bentley.
00:34:41.520 | I mean, and so to, you know, to experience that at such a young age, it's like, all right,
00:34:46.320 | let's go to the mall.
00:34:47.320 | Let's go here.
00:34:48.320 | Let's go there.
00:34:49.320 | Fortunately for me personally, I was a very frugal and still am a very frugal human being.
00:34:55.920 | So you know, so that was kind of my nature was always just to kind of like put it away.
00:35:01.320 | Don't look at it.
00:35:02.320 | You know, and I just kind of continued with my same tendencies.
00:35:05.360 | So I remember, you know, you don't really have any money when you, you know, you're
00:35:09.840 | going into an MBA.
00:35:11.080 | So when you hire an agent, you're getting a lot of credit and then this is money that's
00:35:18.280 | in advance that you really usually have to pay back, you know, once you sign your deal,
00:35:24.520 | once you sign, you know, and so, so that was the situation for me.
00:35:28.560 | Right.
00:35:29.560 | So even that, you know, I'm kind of like, wait a minute, I got to pay all this money
00:35:32.960 | back.
00:35:33.960 | I bought a car, you know, I took care of some family issues and things.
00:35:38.000 | And I remember flying all my, all of my family out to the NBA draft.
00:35:41.680 | And so, you know, again, we're doing all this on, on, on borrowed credit.
00:35:47.240 | And so again, when you're coming into, you know, a lot of money, it's easy to just blow
00:35:53.520 | it at that young age.
00:35:55.360 | It's easy to just, you know, and take care of people and, you know, especially, you know,
00:36:00.520 | family and friends and needs and different things.
00:36:03.480 | And so, you know, for me coming in at 18, I bought a house, bought a car, you know,
00:36:09.920 | I took care of some family things and that was it.
00:36:13.560 | And I remember being that way.
00:36:16.800 | You know, I had two cars probably for maybe about the first four years of my career.
00:36:21.280 | One house I did.
00:36:22.280 | I bought, I take that back.
00:36:23.920 | I bought a condo in Chicago, you know, when I went back to train in the summer.
00:36:28.200 | But that was it.
00:36:29.360 | And I continued to kind of remain frugal.
00:36:32.160 | But as far as the structure goes, most players trust their agents.
00:36:37.760 | Most players rely on their agents for that, you know, information as far as who's going
00:36:43.360 | to be your financial advisor.
00:36:45.480 | What bank are you going to be going to?
00:36:46.920 | I need to get a chef, you know, I need to get, you know, some of these different day
00:36:50.720 | to day chores.
00:36:52.440 | And so the agent is usually the kind of the center of the universe and on the business
00:36:57.000 | side and making those connections.
00:37:00.800 | And so it's really important to have diverse people on your team.
00:37:05.200 | And when I say diverse people, I mean people from different backgrounds, people, you know,
00:37:10.400 | with different experiences.
00:37:11.400 | Nine times out of 10, those are just usually our friends.
00:37:15.040 | Might not be a good idea though.
00:37:18.240 | Yeah.
00:37:19.240 | Well, I mean, it's like, who do you trust?
00:37:21.440 | You trust the people you've known the longest.
00:37:23.440 | Exactly.
00:37:24.440 | Exactly.
00:37:25.440 | It's like, I know you, like, you know, but nine times out of 10, again, they don't necessarily
00:37:31.240 | have, they're not experts in business, right?
00:37:34.000 | No.
00:37:35.000 | We're experts in playing our sports, you know, but not necessarily in finances or how to
00:37:41.000 | negotiate, you know, getting a car or, you know, different things or, you know, taxes
00:37:47.200 | or so.
00:37:48.920 | So it's really important who you trust.
00:37:51.560 | It's really important who's on your team.
00:37:53.400 | And I think it's really important, even if you are trusting your agent to get a second
00:37:58.200 | opinion.
00:37:59.200 | Yes.
00:38:00.200 | Right.
00:38:01.200 | Yes.
00:38:02.200 | You know, my grandfather always said three, three opinions by people that you don't even
00:38:05.520 | know.
00:38:06.520 | All right.
00:38:07.520 | Because then you take out the biases as well, you know, all right now, hopefully they should
00:38:11.720 | have some knowledge, you know, some market knowledge.
00:38:14.920 | Sure.
00:38:15.920 | Yeah.
00:38:16.920 | But, you know, it's just important to kind of get different opinions.
00:38:22.320 | And for me and all my decision making, like I haven't made always the best decisions,
00:38:27.040 | but I tried to get advice from multiple points.
00:38:32.000 | Right.
00:38:33.000 | Yeah.
00:38:34.000 | No, that's really great advice.
00:38:35.320 | Get three opinions, get those biases out and then really analyze where you want to put
00:38:41.480 | your money.
00:38:42.480 | And, you know, as a as an outsider, I always think to myself, man, if I had NBA money,
00:38:47.440 | I would just put 80 percent of it in the S&P 500 index ETF and like, I don't know, 20 percent,
00:38:54.040 | maybe some bonds, especially now that rates are over 5 percent and then just kick back
00:38:58.240 | because in 10 years I'll have like so much more money.
00:39:00.760 | I mean, that is like the easiest advice like one could have.
00:39:05.320 | And the reality is over a 15 year period, I think your money would have tripled.
00:39:11.400 | Except one thing you leave it on one thing.
00:39:13.800 | We are human beings.
00:39:14.800 | We are rational.
00:39:15.800 | I mean, come on, what you just said probably makes the most sense.
00:39:23.080 | But I mean, you know, if you probably tell 90 percent of guys, it sounds boring as hell.
00:39:29.240 | Come on.
00:39:30.240 | I'm 19 years old.
00:39:31.240 | What is that?
00:39:32.240 | Right, right, right.
00:39:33.240 | So so, you know, I say that to say, you know, again, the biases, the excitement, the uncertainty
00:39:41.240 | at the human emotion, like, you know, we're excited over things in the human.
00:39:45.800 | Yeah, sounds that sounds amazing.
00:39:48.320 | You know, right.
00:39:49.520 | And then it's like, oh, actually, that could go to zero, you know?
00:39:52.920 | Yeah.
00:39:53.920 | And I mean, maybe not even zero.
00:39:54.920 | You might be liable for something.
00:39:56.920 | Right.
00:39:57.920 | You know, right.
00:39:58.920 | You hear all these bad stories.
00:39:59.920 | Exactly.
00:40:00.920 | So, you know, the older and more mature that I've gotten and also just experience from
00:40:05.960 | the losses that I have taken.
00:40:08.080 | It's like, you start to realize, like, oh, wait, the boring things are the things that
00:40:12.520 | are actually making a lot of money.
00:40:14.320 | Right.
00:40:15.320 | Really profitable.
00:40:16.320 | Right.
00:40:17.320 | Right.
00:40:18.320 | Right.
00:40:19.320 | You know, not always, but usually that that's what you see when you come in to, you know,
00:40:22.640 | to a lot of money is you get pitched by a lot of these exciting ideas.
00:40:26.360 | Right.
00:40:27.360 | Right.
00:40:28.360 | You know, and temptation is a temptation.
00:40:30.960 | And then it's also, you know, the emotion of wanting to maybe help people.
00:40:34.320 | And, you know, they're relying on your friendship and the trust and, you know, all those things
00:40:39.360 | get thrown into the pot.
00:40:41.080 | And it's just about the actual idea and, you know, dynamics that go into making this thing
00:40:47.280 | successful.
00:40:48.280 | Right.
00:40:49.280 | Yes.
00:40:50.280 | I mean, what's what's the average NBA career nowadays?
00:40:52.400 | Do you know?
00:40:53.400 | Well, it was five years when I was playing.
00:40:55.600 | And maybe shorter or longer.
00:40:57.720 | I mean, let's say it's five years plus or minus one year.
00:41:00.800 | I mean, that's not a long career.
00:41:02.280 | You're still 27 years old on average if you if you went to college, maybe you're 25 to
00:41:07.400 | 20.
00:41:08.400 | And then you got your whole life ahead of you to figure it out.
00:41:10.360 | So here's another point, you know, listeners should realize you played for 15 years.
00:41:16.040 | So think about that, Sean.
00:41:17.120 | I mean, that 15 years has to be like a top 5 percent career in the NBA.
00:41:24.020 | And then not only that, you were able to win four championships, was like a top 1 percent.
00:41:29.320 | So I mean, if you ever feel down or bored, you just got to remind yourself about those
00:41:34.800 | two things.
00:41:35.800 | It's like, I mean, holy blessing.
00:41:37.720 | That's amazing.
00:41:38.720 | I'm blessed.
00:41:39.720 | I definitely it's a blessing.
00:41:42.080 | And that time might even be shorter, you know, three to five years.
00:41:46.400 | But, you know, I played 13 years, two years I was out, you know, with injuries and right
00:41:52.480 | calling my way back into the NBA.
00:41:54.400 | You know, yes.
00:41:55.560 | Different leagues and, you know, rehab.
00:41:57.360 | So I mean, it's, you know, I mean, it's everybody has their own journey, but you got to you
00:42:03.080 | got to focus on yours for sure.
00:42:05.480 | Now, I hear you.
00:42:08.040 | Well, Sean, it's been great talking to you.
00:42:11.240 | We could talk for hours and hours and hours.
00:42:13.520 | Maybe we talk again.
00:42:15.720 | I'd love to know, you know, keep in touch and hear about your journey post retirement
00:42:20.480 | life.
00:42:21.480 | I mean, I guess in conclusion, can you just talk about what's life like?
00:42:25.840 | You're technically an early retiree.
00:42:27.760 | You know, it's funny, you retired from the NBA, basically about my age, 34, 35.
00:42:33.520 | And then you took a break, right?
00:42:35.640 | And then you went back in and then you kind of are retiring again.
00:42:39.280 | So we're very similar in terms of like our career paths.
00:42:44.480 | And so what's life like now as a second time around retiree?
00:42:49.920 | What are you up to?
00:42:50.920 | What do you like to do?
00:42:51.920 | Yeah.
00:42:52.920 | Yeah, no, it's it's been great, man.
00:42:56.400 | I mean, honestly, it's it's you know, it's one of those things to where you just you
00:43:01.840 | know, for me, it's like I go with the flow with what's best for my life for the next
00:43:06.360 | kind of for that year or, you know, for the next five years.
00:43:10.520 | And for me, it's just when I retired from the NBA, it was it was a shock, you know,
00:43:15.480 | because it's something that I did my whole life.
00:43:17.400 | You know, what am I going to do now?
00:43:20.800 | Right.
00:43:21.800 | So this time around, you know, after leaving kind of the executive position with the Warriors,
00:43:27.920 | you know, I'm just looking forward to, you know, trying things, trying new things, you
00:43:32.480 | know, during this period, I could always I feel like have an opportunity if I'm lucky
00:43:37.760 | enough or fortunate enough, you know, to go back and try to work in the NBA.
00:43:42.360 | Yeah, I'm sure you can.
00:43:44.080 | No doubt.
00:43:45.400 | So, you know, I feel like while I'm young, you know, my kids are young.
00:43:50.760 | You know, we just you know, we just transitioned to a new state.
00:43:54.960 | Yeah.
00:43:55.960 | Why not try it?
00:43:56.960 | Try things while I can.
00:43:57.960 | So, yeah, I mean, going doing different things, going back to school, doing different investments,
00:44:03.400 | doing community work back home.
00:44:05.120 | Yeah.
00:44:06.120 | Just focusing on different initiatives and things that, you know, I enjoy doing with
00:44:09.760 | my time.
00:44:11.320 | But I can't be a busybody.
00:44:13.720 | So, you know, it's like trying to keep that anxiety off you of like constantly, you know,
00:44:17.760 | work or do something.
00:44:18.760 | Right.
00:44:19.760 | Yeah.
00:44:20.760 | It's like an entrepreneur life.
00:44:21.760 | Like, yeah, you've got to figure out a healthy balance of balance, schedule look like.
00:44:26.600 | So that's right.
00:44:27.760 | That's where it's at.
00:44:28.760 | That's where it's at.
00:44:29.760 | Yeah.
00:44:30.760 | I mean, it's it's tough because obviously, the NBA career is a grind during the season,
00:44:34.960 | traveling, working out and everything and then to just suddenly shut it off.
00:44:38.640 | I know you and I, we went for a walk down in the marina that during COVID and it's just
00:44:44.000 | trying to figure it out.
00:44:45.320 | It's just and I'm really glad you went back into the executive world because you saw the
00:44:50.960 | other side.
00:44:51.960 | Right.
00:44:52.960 | And now if you never go back for some reason, you will at least never wonder what was it
00:44:58.160 | like.
00:45:00.000 | And that that is actually really powerful to have a regret minimization where you won't
00:45:05.160 | wonder because you tried it.
00:45:07.640 | And so I really enjoy your journey and I hope you do a lot more great things.
00:45:14.120 | And what's next?
00:45:15.840 | I mean, I hope I hope to see headlines one day, you know, within three years, you know,
00:45:20.560 | Sean Livingston joins X team as the GM or whatever.
00:45:25.640 | I think that'd be great.
00:45:27.040 | And I think by then you'll have enough downtime to sow your own and do other things.
00:45:32.160 | Hopefully, you'll invite me back on the podcast.
00:45:35.160 | I hope you come back.
00:45:38.160 | All right, Sean.
00:45:39.160 | All right.
00:45:40.160 | Catch you later.
00:45:41.160 | I appreciate it.
00:45:42.160 | Thank you.
00:45:43.160 | All right.
00:45:44.160 | Thanks for having me.
00:45:45.160 | Hey, everybody.
00:45:46.160 | I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Sean.
00:45:47.160 | It was truly an honor and a pleasure to speak to him and listen to his journey.
00:45:50.440 | He went from the highest of highs as number four pick in the draft to the lowest low.
00:45:57.000 | It was after a devastating knee injury and then how he battled back through multiple
00:46:01.040 | teams to land with the Warriors to win not three but four NBA championships.
00:46:06.200 | What an amazing story.
00:46:07.680 | What a blessing.
00:46:08.760 | What a journey.
00:46:09.760 | I am absolutely sure he will be an incredible coach or an incredible general manager if
00:46:16.200 | he is given the opportunity if he decides to pursue that path.
00:46:20.440 | One of the things that really stood out to me from this conversation was how important
00:46:25.120 | work ethic was and is to sustain an NBA career.
00:46:29.640 | We're talking an average career lifespan of four to five years, but Sean lasted for 15
00:46:34.720 | years.
00:46:35.720 | So it's not good enough to be talented.
00:46:38.480 | You have to work on your talent and keep on going.
00:46:41.400 | All right, everyone.
00:46:43.040 | If you enjoyed this podcast, I'd love a share, subscribe and a positive review.
00:46:46.640 | It helps keep me going.
00:46:48.760 | Every single episode takes hours and hours to produce.
00:46:51.640 | And if you want to keep in touch, check out the Financial Samurai newsletter at FinancialSamurai.com/news.
00:46:56.240 | Talk to you all later.
00:47:00.320 | [Music]
00:47:06.320 | you