What's the difference between Public Relations (PR), Corporate Comms and Global Comms?

00:00:00.000 | [MUSIC]

00:00:07.080 | >> You're listening to Let's Talk Jobs,

00:00:08.920 | where we give you practical insights into jobs and careers.

00:00:12.160 | I'm Tim Chen, and today we're talking about

00:00:14.520 | public relations and corporate communications.

00:00:17.160 | Back in 1982, Johnson & Johnson's Tylenol brand took a major hit.

00:00:22.440 | There was a product tampering incident where

00:00:24.520 | cyanide was introduced into their extra strength Tylenol capsules,

00:00:28.120 | that resulted in the deaths of seven people.

00:00:30.880 | Their response to this set the bar for

00:00:34.520 | corporate crisis management and corporate responsibility.

00:00:37.960 | In addition to the recall of 31 million bottles of Tylenol,

00:00:41.760 | they chose to be very open in their corporate communications.

00:00:45.760 | Throughout the crisis, CEO James Burke held press conferences

00:00:49.760 | expressing concern for the victims while providing regular updates.

00:00:54.040 | They collaborated closely with law enforcement agencies,

00:00:57.320 | and the Food and Drug Administration during the investigation.

00:01:00.720 | Then they launched advertising and PR campaigns

00:01:03.760 | to rebuild public trust in the Tylenol brand.

00:01:07.120 | Now, all of that activity took a lot of intentional planning,

00:01:11.200 | coordination, and execution.

00:01:13.720 | This is an example of crisis comms,

00:01:16.040 | and it's just one aspect of

00:01:17.840 | the broad field that is public relations and corporate communications.

00:01:22.720 | Today, we're going to have a conversation with Alex Lynn Goldsmith.

00:01:26.640 | He's currently the Senior Director of

00:01:28.320 | External Communications at Turnitin.

00:01:30.400 | Prior to that, he has led and driven

00:01:32.480 | major global comms initiatives across consumer and B2B.

00:01:36.920 | At 21st Century Fox,

00:01:38.520 | he launched shows like Family Guy and Bones,

00:01:40.840 | and he's led PR and comms teams at Oracle, VMware, and Cisco.

00:01:45.640 | In this video, Alex will talk about topics such

00:01:48.880 | as breaking down those various functions within global communications.

00:01:53.080 | How do you determine what a company should be communicating?

00:01:56.680 | Lastly, career options and growth opportunities in PR and comms.

00:02:02.640 | All right, let's get started.

00:02:04.080 | Today, we're talking about public relations and corporate communications.

00:02:07.720 | Joining us is Alex Goldsmith. Alex, how are you doing?

00:02:10.200 | >> I'm wonderful. How are you, Tim?

00:02:11.880 | >> I'm doing fantastic. Now, Alex,

00:02:13.280 | you and I have worked together before,

00:02:14.560 | and I've always admired how you do everything corporate comms and PR.

00:02:19.880 | Can you tell us just a little bit about what you're doing

00:02:21.840 | recently and how long you've been in the space?

00:02:24.680 | >> I've been working in communications for over a decade,

00:02:27.280 | and I've been doing them for celebrities,

00:02:28.960 | for politicians in the public sector,

00:02:30.840 | and most recently within tech and working for companies.

00:02:33.760 | Started off at 20th Century Fox,

00:02:35.600 | worked through the tech stack,

00:02:36.760 | and most recently with Oracle.

00:02:39.040 | What I really enjoy is the psychology of communications,

00:02:42.240 | and why do people care about something,

00:02:44.480 | and how do you get people to do the action that the organization wants?

00:02:48.320 | >> That's awesome. It's so critical,

00:02:50.600 | because you're at the forefront where you can control

00:02:53.880 | the dialogue of how people even perceive the company.

00:02:56.640 | I think that's the area.

00:02:58.160 | Actually, quite frankly, if I were to consider a career in corporate comms,

00:03:01.680 | it would intimidate the heck out of me.

00:03:03.500 | I was like, "That's a lot of responsibility to bear."

00:03:06.000 | Alex, I had an interesting conversation with someone recently,

00:03:09.400 | and I think this might be a good segue into our conversations.

00:03:12.520 | They're freshly out of college,

00:03:15.000 | into the job market, and they said,

00:03:17.360 | "Hey, Tim, I'm interested in public relations."

00:03:20.080 | I was like, "Okay, cool. What do you care about?"

00:03:21.840 | They're like, "Well, when I look at job postings,

00:03:24.680 | I see corporate communications as one sector of a job title,

00:03:29.400 | and then I see public relations,

00:03:31.880 | but they seem to describe similar things."

00:03:34.360 | In your point of view, are they different,

00:03:36.800 | or is one maybe a subset of the other?

00:03:38.560 | How do you look at that?

00:03:40.240 | >> There's many different perspectives on this,

00:03:42.800 | and that might be a frustrating way to start.

00:03:45.160 | Many industries look at it different ways.

00:03:47.640 | I would start as global comms as the overarching term,

00:03:50.720 | and there's external and internal,

00:03:52.280 | and it's framed by your audience.

00:03:54.680 | Specifically, you asked about public relations

00:03:56.240 | and corporate communications.

00:03:57.520 | Public relations is the discipline

00:03:59.480 | that you're reaching your general public,

00:04:01.720 | and I think the transformation that's going on right now

00:04:03.840 | is it's a world beyond the press release.

00:04:05.440 | It's basically what's the form factor.

00:04:07.800 | Corporate communications is often defined

00:04:10.400 | as your corporate affairs,

00:04:12.760 | how are you doing your earnings,

00:04:15.000 | your M&A, diversity, equity, inclusion.

00:04:17.360 | It's a lot related to the brand,

00:04:18.840 | and often it lives under the discipline of public relations.

00:04:22.160 | >> Got it.

00:04:22.480 | >> You may have something like your product

00:04:24.840 | or your technology communications

00:04:26.680 | or public relations under public relations.

00:04:30.200 | You may have your partner and customers.

00:04:32.120 | Corporate comms often is one of

00:04:33.880 | those disciplines under public relations.

00:04:36.200 | >> Got it. That's really helpful.

00:04:38.160 | For me, the hierarchy makes sense

00:04:40.960 | because then I think when you look at an organization,

00:04:42.920 | you look at the job roles available,

00:04:44.720 | and you can see how it's grouped together like that.

00:04:47.600 | Can you help us maybe just quickly cover,

00:04:50.720 | when it comes to the career or industry

00:04:54.280 | that is public relations or corporate comms,

00:04:56.440 | if someone's trying to consider a career and they're looking

00:04:58.840 | for maybe job roles or job types,

00:05:01.960 | what titles would they be looking for?

00:05:04.560 | Because I've heard a lot of things around like there's

00:05:06.640 | media relations and I hear social media,

00:05:09.080 | but there's also corporate comms manager

00:05:11.080 | or even events sometimes falls into this.

00:05:13.280 | Can you just help us understand maybe the roles

00:05:15.320 | that people typically would look for?

00:05:17.440 | >> I would use a caveat if I'm applying

00:05:19.560 | a media and entertainment and technology

00:05:21.280 | then to how we define this.

00:05:23.040 | Let's think about the purpose of

00:05:24.760 | this role and then we can get to the title.

00:05:26.680 | >> Great.

00:05:27.120 | >> The purpose is to look at the mission,

00:05:29.400 | the vision, and the values of

00:05:31.000 | the organization and communicate that for the reputation,

00:05:34.040 | whether that be an external audience or an internal audience.

00:05:37.200 | Essentially, that means that what you're

00:05:39.840 | driving towards is how do you balance the stock price?

00:05:42.920 | How do you look at perception?

00:05:44.120 | How do you look at brand?

00:05:45.400 | When you're looking at titles,

00:05:46.840 | it can be everything from under global comms,

00:05:49.760 | I'm working with industry analysts within public relations.

00:05:53.120 | It might be a director of analyst relations,

00:05:55.040 | it might be a VP or director of public relations,

00:05:58.000 | helping to drive message resonance.

00:05:59.840 | Employee communications would be,

00:06:01.760 | how's your internal employee sentiment?

00:06:03.680 | It's someone who's a director or

00:06:05.160 | a senior manager of employee comms.

00:06:07.520 | Executive communications is often touching

00:06:09.880 | your informed general public about how are

00:06:12.120 | your executives showing up?

00:06:13.480 | What is their stump speech, their platform?

00:06:16.960 | That would be manager,

00:06:18.800 | senior manager, director of executive communications.

00:06:21.920 | Then there's other disciplines as well,

00:06:23.880 | integrated storytelling, social media.

00:06:26.920 | Communications can live within marketing,

00:06:29.520 | it can be aligned with marketing.

00:06:31.440 | There's some organizations where global comms

00:06:33.920 | lives in the chief people officer in finance.

00:06:36.360 | I think the key thing is,

00:06:38.480 | I often think of communications and

00:06:40.040 | those roles you talked about as

00:06:41.840 | the conscious to the organization.

00:06:43.680 | Often, you have to tell truth to

00:06:45.480 | power and figure out what is the message to land.

00:06:49.360 | >> For you personally, of all of those areas,

00:06:53.320 | what drives you the most?

00:06:55.120 | What are you most passionate about?

00:06:57.400 | >> I've always been driven by the psychology of communications.

00:07:02.000 | I'm a nerd and I love reading.

00:07:04.840 | I love the idea.

00:07:06.120 | There's this Roman orator named Cicero,

00:07:09.040 | who used to make speeches so

00:07:10.880 | well that people would be driven to action.

00:07:13.240 | He inspired me and so I really love the writing,

00:07:16.920 | thinking about new ways of working with influencers,

00:07:19.720 | and getting to the why,

00:07:22.280 | and then driving it through action through

00:07:24.080 | brand awareness to demand activity.

00:07:27.520 | That's why it's been more that driving it,

00:07:30.600 | and then working on within the public sector.

00:07:33.040 | I'm the board of San Francisco Animal Care and Control.

00:07:35.600 | With celebrities, I worked on

00:07:37.200 | the launching of Family Guy internationally,

00:07:39.040 | and helping to elevate.

00:07:40.320 | How do we push Seth MacFarlane out there?

00:07:42.600 | Then finally, within tech, it's like,

00:07:44.480 | how do you make a technology story that's

00:07:46.760 | interesting enough that people want to hear about it?

00:07:49.880 | >> Yeah, I think the last part is fascinating to me as well,

00:07:53.880 | because when you think about Family Guy,

00:07:56.720 | it's very consumer-driven,

00:07:59.960 | and it's easy to relate to,

00:08:01.240 | to create a story around that.

00:08:02.520 | It's maybe more intuitive than working with high-tech,

00:08:05.760 | and you're talking about B2B,

00:08:07.440 | and it could be more dry,

00:08:09.400 | let's say, of a topic.

00:08:10.880 | How do you find those stories to tell that you

00:08:13.960 | feel captivates your audience's attention?

00:08:17.320 | >> I think that there's a couple of different ways.

00:08:21.120 | One is understanding

00:08:22.720 | what are your organizational goals first.

00:08:24.640 | What do you want to get out of it?

00:08:25.760 | Is it broader awareness?

00:08:27.240 | Is it working with your existing base

00:08:29.120 | of people that are consuming?

00:08:30.400 | Are you trying to reach a new base?

00:08:32.920 | Often, I'm looking at market research,

00:08:35.720 | customer data, partner data,

00:08:38.200 | unaided awareness, aided awareness,

00:08:42.160 | meaning if we're looking at

00:08:43.920 | a general sector and we ask the audience,

00:08:45.760 | would you even be aware of what we're

00:08:47.200 | offering versus a set of companies?

00:08:50.240 | Also, in addition to market research,

00:08:52.920 | there's something to be said about your gut.

00:08:54.920 | There's something to be said about what's

00:08:56.840 | your instinct tell you based upon the goals.

00:08:59.240 | Often, I like to get to three to four stories to tell,

00:09:01.960 | meaning at Oracle,

00:09:03.920 | we worked on what are the toughest challenges

00:09:06.160 | that organizations are facing today as a top-line message.

00:09:09.280 | Then you have different stories that live under it.

00:09:11.920 | I think it's interesting to use that market data

00:09:15.280 | because if you lead with the data aligned to the goals,

00:09:18.480 | you'll set yourself apart from

00:09:20.040 | other communicators because often,

00:09:22.160 | we are a gray art in science.

00:09:24.840 | If you're the person that comes with data and is

00:09:27.920 | a little more informed in tech and the tech stack,

00:09:31.040 | and I don't mean like tech is in the industry,

00:09:32.880 | but I mean, how does the newsroom work?

00:09:35.200 | How do you use platforms

00:09:37.400 | like Meltwater to understand your sentiment?

00:09:39.640 | You'll differentiate yourself.

00:09:41.160 | But I do think that differentiation will

00:09:43.720 | help you both from a career path and furthering your career.

00:09:46.680 | >> I'm a nerd like you and I get

00:09:49.360 | fascinated when it comes to data.

00:09:51.120 | I think in my own world of web marketing,

00:09:52.960 | like things like understanding what segments are

00:09:55.120 | engaging with your website and where are they converting on,

00:09:57.360 | and either supporting hypotheses you have about who they are,

00:10:01.000 | versus what they're looking for.

00:10:02.440 | What kind of data sets, if you don't mind,

00:10:04.240 | just double-clicking just a little bit deeper for you.

00:10:06.720 | When you're looking at data for

00:10:08.800 | understanding your audience that informs stuff,

00:10:11.320 | what data sources are you typically looking at?

00:10:13.600 | What data sets matter to you?

00:10:16.560 | Can you tell us a little bit about that?

00:10:18.600 | >> At the highest level,

00:10:21.120 | we started talking about

00:10:22.040 | Public Relations and Corporate Communications.

00:10:23.680 | >> Right.

00:10:23.880 | >> Often, I'm looking at,

00:10:25.680 | you can look at ways that your communications

00:10:27.720 | are affecting the stock price.

00:10:29.240 | That's an outcome-based metric.

00:10:30.920 | There are activity-based metrics,

00:10:32.600 | meaning meetings and content you're pushing out,

00:10:34.840 | but I'm looking at outcome-based metrics.

00:10:36.240 | How are you influencing the stock price with a product launch

00:10:39.280 | or with reputational activity like diversity, equity, inclusion?

00:10:43.360 | >> Got it.

00:10:43.760 | >> You can look at something more specifically within

00:10:45.560 | Public Relations such as how's your message pull through,

00:10:48.640 | and how's the sentiment wherever it's showing up?

00:10:51.480 | I would say now,

00:10:53.320 | because I come from a couple of different fields,

00:10:55.800 | having worked in social media,

00:10:57.320 | it's also looking about what's your engagement within your core audience.

00:11:01.800 | I think the integrated marketing columns is so critical now,

00:11:05.480 | and understanding how that data goes when you think about

00:11:08.320 | the brand and the video shares to the engagement,

00:11:12.400 | and the social engagement from a lead gen activity and sales.

00:11:17.360 | I could go across.

00:11:18.600 | There's different data values such as within employee columns.

00:11:21.560 | It can be, what's the sentiment of the surveys if

00:11:24.240 | your employee is leaving an employee town hall or a post meet?

00:11:27.280 | With executive communications,

00:11:29.080 | where are your executives being placed?

00:11:31.320 | What kind of volume people are attending?

00:11:33.600 | How long is the content living?

00:11:35.160 | With an analyst relations,

00:11:36.680 | industry analysts, because there's financial analysts.

00:11:39.720 | With an industry analyst,

00:11:41.040 | it could be, how are you placing within the top reporters?

00:11:44.040 | There's a lot of data.

00:11:45.680 | With AR, there are firms that have platforms.

00:11:47.840 | There's also Tableau.

00:11:49.360 | It really starts with what problem are you trying to solve?

00:11:52.800 | What data sources can you use like Meltwater for PR,

00:11:56.000 | or Sprinkler for social,

00:11:57.600 | or Tableau helping to work with your AR engagements?

00:12:00.840 | Then how do you use that to educate and inform what you do next?

00:12:05.640 | >> Yeah. That's such great insight

00:12:08.960 | because it made me think about even in my time at LinkedIn.

00:12:11.800 | I've never really actually paid much attention

00:12:14.320 | to the function of internal comms, let's say.

00:12:17.000 | But now I'm thinking about it,

00:12:18.240 | it's like the thing that really set that company apart was,

00:12:20.400 | they did really great employee poll surveys,

00:12:23.880 | but they did fully transparent company readouts,

00:12:27.880 | the good and the bad.

00:12:29.520 | Everyone had visibility into

00:12:31.640 | what they're holding leaders accountable to,

00:12:33.400 | and here's where we did well,

00:12:34.720 | and here's where we underperformed.

00:12:36.200 | The thing that you're talking about in terms like

00:12:37.840 | brand building and brand loyalty as an employee,

00:12:41.120 | you're like, "Oh, shoot, this company cares about me,

00:12:43.600 | and they care about my input,

00:12:44.720 | and I see where I'm represented on the screen."

00:12:47.640 | That builds, again, a sense of ownership to the company.

00:12:50.920 | I can only imagine the impact of that externally as well.

00:12:54.120 | It's finally clicking for me,

00:12:56.120 | the way you described that, which is really, really cool.

00:12:58.360 | >> It's also interesting because in an era like with the media,

00:13:02.280 | where I call multi-hyphenates,

00:13:04.000 | you're not just reporting, you're also consulting,

00:13:06.160 | maybe you're taking in-house role.

00:13:08.000 | Industry analysts are taking on multiple roles.

00:13:10.520 | Your employees are your advocates.

00:13:13.040 | The challenge, employee comms in some ways is sometimes

00:13:15.800 | the toughest role because they know all your hiccups.

00:13:18.080 | Some messages that may play to

00:13:19.760 | the informed general public or to

00:13:21.120 | the media will not play to your employees because they know,

00:13:24.000 | and they know the truth, but you know.

00:13:26.120 | There's an opportunity to really build

00:13:28.960 | a groundswell support for the organization.

00:13:31.680 | If you have a great employee social media program,

00:13:34.200 | if you have a regimented way to get your messages out,

00:13:36.760 | if you have a feedback mechanism.

00:13:39.040 | In some of these organizations where you may have

00:13:41.640 | hundreds of thousands of employees or even tens of thousands,

00:13:45.120 | they can really be the make or break.

00:13:47.320 | For instance, I work on a campaign at a company where we

00:13:50.600 | primed the market with our employees before we even had day one.

00:13:55.240 | There is a risk of a leak,

00:13:56.640 | but if you do it the right way,

00:13:58.120 | they can be better than any news article

00:14:01.280 | or a single video because they will carry it forward.

00:14:04.320 | >> Is that the category of like when you think crisis comms,

00:14:08.000 | is that what the discipline falls under or is it different?

00:14:12.400 | >> Crisis comms is a practice

00:14:14.480 | and it can live under any of those comms functions.

00:14:17.000 | I haven't caught response comms

00:14:19.240 | because everyone wants to work on a crisis and it might be,

00:14:22.160 | but crisis comms essentially often lives under corporate communications

00:14:27.240 | and they'll be the linchpin for you to have a product issue.

00:14:30.880 | If you have an executive transition,

00:14:32.800 | if there's activist shareholders,

00:14:35.680 | it often lives in corporate communications,

00:14:37.560 | but you can have a crisis for your employees that's internal.

00:14:40.880 | The key thing when you have crisis comms,

00:14:43.080 | in my opinion, is you do have a leader,

00:14:46.080 | it's cross-functional in nature,

00:14:48.040 | and it's about your principles of engagement.

00:14:50.080 | It's the transparency, it's the structure,

00:14:53.200 | and you need to have a playbook in place for as many of the situations.

00:14:57.920 | Being able to differentiate what's an external crisis,

00:15:01.400 | what's an internal crisis,

00:15:02.840 | and also what's truly a crisis and what's just an issue.

00:15:06.440 | >> I want to make a quick pivot here because I

00:15:09.600 | think now that we've did a really good job,

00:15:12.360 | or we, you, have done a really good job,

00:15:15.240 | picture the landscape here.

00:15:16.320 | >> We've done it, yeah.

00:15:17.760 | >> I think having a conversation around,

00:15:20.360 | let's say if someone is considering a pivot into

00:15:24.080 | PR comms or this is their first time entering it,

00:15:27.360 | can we have a little conversation around

00:15:29.640 | just the skills they should be building up or looking for?

00:15:33.200 | In my mind, I'm thinking of someone like me who,

00:15:35.920 | let's say I've worked in,

00:15:37.800 | let's say high-tech or whatnot in an industry that's not comms,

00:15:40.480 | and I'm thinking about pivoting.

00:15:41.680 | What skills do I have that could apply?

00:15:44.040 | You mentioned storytelling earlier.

00:15:45.840 | I'm assuming writing skills about that

00:15:47.640 | because can you talk about that a little bit?

00:15:50.160 | >> Let's start with a top three.

00:15:53.200 | I think that intelligence,

00:15:55.720 | curiosity, and passion are critical.

00:15:57.920 | I think if you start with those three baseline,

00:16:00.200 | everyone's an expert in comms,

00:16:01.880 | but the fact you're treating every day like

00:16:04.120 | a master class and you're doing it with energy,

00:16:06.680 | I think that's the key skill to start with.

00:16:09.040 | From there, I think there's a series of

00:16:11.520 | disciplines and skill sets that will help you.

00:16:14.680 | The ability to storytell,

00:16:17.480 | grit, the resiliency that you bring,

00:16:21.040 | writing skills, creative skills,

00:16:24.480 | attention to detail, I think is critical.

00:16:27.200 | I think also an awareness of global business.

00:16:30.840 | Then I think finally,

00:16:32.880 | a passion for data and analytics and technology.

00:16:36.280 | These are all nice to have,

00:16:38.360 | but I think if you start with that intelligence,

00:16:40.000 | that passion, and that curiosity,

00:16:41.680 | that will help you in a communications.

00:16:44.240 | Because you have to learn the business,

00:16:46.240 | you're a partner to the business.

00:16:47.800 | One of the key challenges when you're in

00:16:49.520 | a comms role is when you're entering these situations.

00:16:52.200 | What's a business strategy decision

00:16:54.360 | versus a communication strategy?

00:16:55.960 | Meaning, is there a tough decision for the business and

00:16:58.920 | they need the C-levels or

00:17:01.080 | the executives need to make a decision and then

00:17:02.560 | communications can talk

00:17:04.240 | about what's going to happen because of it,

00:17:06.000 | or has a decision been made and

00:17:07.800 | then communications can be part of it.

00:17:10.120 | Often, I've had the experience where you are advising

00:17:13.200 | different by-products of what happens with business strategy.

00:17:16.720 | You can say, "This is what happens if we play this out."

00:17:19.360 | >> What do you look for in,

00:17:23.360 | let's say, a new hire candidate?

00:17:25.040 | Let's put some swimming lanes on this question.

00:17:30.280 | If it's a, let's say,

00:17:31.680 | first early career applicant

00:17:34.880 | versus someone who's maybe five years into the career.

00:17:38.840 | We focus on the early career.

00:17:40.680 | What do you look for in a resume to even

00:17:43.480 | separate them from the pile of resumes,

00:17:46.080 | to even get an opportunity to talk to you,

00:17:48.520 | to demonstrate they have curiosity?

00:17:50.200 | Because curiosity doesn't come across on paper very well.

00:17:53.240 | What do you look for?

00:17:54.840 | >> What I look for is being open to

00:17:58.040 | new ideas and a variety of experiences.

00:18:00.920 | In addition, have they taking writing projects on?

00:18:03.920 | For instance, were they on the school newspaper?

00:18:06.080 | Were they in a journalism program?

00:18:07.880 | Do they take within professional clubs

00:18:10.160 | some kind of role that help them work across?

00:18:13.920 | That passion, curiosity, intelligence,

00:18:16.960 | does it come across in what's

00:18:19.280 | the story behind the story in their resume?

00:18:21.840 | What other skills and hobbies they have that complements it?

00:18:24.600 | Because personality is critical.

00:18:27.360 | You can be an extrovert,

00:18:28.680 | you can be an introvert,

00:18:30.400 | but you should be curious.

00:18:33.320 | I think you can get that from a resume.

00:18:35.920 | Those internships, those experiences,

00:18:39.040 | you'll walk in the door at least to have

00:18:40.640 | a foundation for your work.

00:18:44.120 | >> I think that is really good.

00:18:46.560 | Actually, I want to reiterate that because it's so important.

00:18:48.960 | Because we came into this conversation with me saying,

00:18:52.120 | "Hey, I'm not sure if I pivot,

00:18:53.920 | do I have the qualifications or not?"

00:18:55.240 | What you're telling me is like, "Look,

00:18:57.160 | life experience is the life experience,

00:18:59.440 | and your ability to show all the areas

00:19:02.200 | where you've taken a risk,

00:19:03.640 | and you explore something,

00:19:04.560 | or you created something,

00:19:06.240 | that in itself on paper illustrates that,

00:19:08.520 | at least the variety,

00:19:10.040 | or the portfolio you attach to that,

00:19:11.960 | helps people understand that you are this curious individual.

00:19:15.160 | And anyone then can quite frankly do that

00:19:17.560 | if they have, to your point,

00:19:19.200 | if they're naturally curious,

00:19:20.240 | they should have that body of work,

00:19:21.320 | or it's not too late to start one,

00:19:23.360 | and maybe set yourself up like a few months

00:19:25.280 | or a quarter from now to demonstrate that.

00:19:27.840 | >> I would just underline that in bold

00:19:30.000 | with attention to detail,

00:19:31.160 | with any communications you're submitting for,

00:19:33.360 | because that is your handshake to the organizations.

00:19:36.120 | The ability, the formatting,

00:19:39.360 | it's the how and the what,

00:19:40.800 | the how you're delivering it,

00:19:42.040 | that attention to detail is critical,

00:19:43.360 | because you can show that curiosity,

00:19:45.040 | but a typo, hanging sentences, small things,

00:19:49.040 | that's so critical.

00:19:50.120 | And I know that sounds small, but it is big.

00:19:53.880 | And for someone who's maybe five years

00:19:56.040 | to 10 years into the career,

00:19:57.360 | so now you're looking at someone

00:19:58.920 | who's looking at maybe promoting,

00:20:00.240 | or looking to get promoted to maybe a people manager,

00:20:02.720 | or maybe going or branching off,

00:20:04.680 | like what kind of advice would you give to them,

00:20:06.600 | and what skillsets are you looking for for that individual?

00:20:08.880 | And I know it might depend on the role they're applying for,

00:20:12.000 | but just broadly speaking,

00:20:12.920 | what are you looking for there?

00:20:14.440 | >> A couple of things.

00:20:17.200 | Are you close to the audience you're trying to reach,

00:20:19.800 | or are you close to the product?

00:20:21.440 | You should be close to one of them,

00:20:22.640 | and have had experiences,

00:20:24.320 | because the highest levels of satisfaction

00:20:26.600 | for people being managed,

00:20:27.560 | is when their manager knows how to do the job,

00:20:29.720 | and understands the business.

00:20:30.920 | So that would be number one.

00:20:32.520 | Number two is, whether it's been in the job,

00:20:35.480 | or outside the job, have you had leadership experiences?

00:20:38.840 | And if you're not getting that work,

00:20:40.680 | like I said, I'm involved with

00:20:41.720 | San Francisco Animal Care and Control,

00:20:43.280 | and Parks and Alliances, we're working on Jackson Park.

00:20:46.440 | There's things I've done outside of work,

00:20:48.440 | and they're almost great petri dishes of leadership,

00:20:51.200 | and one of my best leadership experiences

00:20:54.520 | was actually in my MBA,

00:20:56.040 | where I was the admissions lead for my year,

00:20:59.000 | and I made a lot of mistakes.

00:21:00.600 | I made, there's an actor that says,

00:21:02.440 | do you have experience?

00:21:03.480 | Congratulations, you made a mistake.

00:21:05.480 | I made a lot of mistakes, but I still use those.

00:21:08.840 | So the ability to show outside of work,

00:21:12.760 | those leadership experiences,

00:21:14.080 | or if you get them in work, that's great.

00:21:16.120 | And number three, showing that initiative,

00:21:18.320 | meaning, are you taking training classes?

00:21:20.880 | Are you doing stretch assignments?

00:21:22.840 | Are you taking on some of the hairiest challenges

00:21:25.840 | that your manager may have?

00:21:27.600 | So they feel comfortable that you are gonna be someone

00:21:29.640 | who's gonna step into the role,

00:21:31.280 | have the leadership, have some of the experience,

00:21:34.040 | and understand either the audience or the product.

00:21:37.600 | And then finally, that you will take charge

00:21:40.520 | and help them further their mission.

00:21:42.680 | I mean, there's some famous

00:21:44.760 | consumer packaged goods companies that say,

00:21:48.240 | the leader doesn't get promoted

00:21:49.720 | until they prepare someone to take over their role.

00:21:52.360 | And I think that's taken into account.

00:21:54.800 | - Yeah, I love everything that you said there.

00:21:57.440 | And you said one thing in particular

00:21:59.200 | that really stood out and resonated with me,

00:22:00.880 | which is talking about with your,

00:22:05.280 | let's say you're on an interview

00:22:06.360 | and walking through your experiences, right?

00:22:09.320 | - Yeah.

00:22:10.160 | - The context of how you talk through failures

00:22:11.800 | or even challenges is really important.

00:22:13.600 | 'Cause I think you and I would agree as managers of people

00:22:15.760 | that the end result is one thing,

00:22:18.080 | it's understanding how you get there

00:22:20.320 | is probably the most important part.

00:22:21.720 | Like, how are you processing things?

00:22:23.240 | If you're stepping through, let's say,

00:22:24.840 | a difficult example of something you had to overcome,

00:22:28.040 | spending more time understanding like,

00:22:29.120 | hey, here's how I'm processing the situation.

00:22:30.880 | Here are all the factors.

00:22:32.320 | Here I was working through things

00:22:33.800 | and maybe it didn't turn out the way I wanted to.

00:22:35.600 | Okay, cool.

00:22:36.440 | Then here's what I did with that then.

00:22:38.440 | Understanding how you're wired

00:22:41.480 | and tells a lot about your individual.

00:22:43.320 | Because the outcome, everyone will say,

00:22:44.760 | here's a shiny outcome.

00:22:46.480 | But what differentiates is like how you get there.

00:22:49.040 | That's the you.

00:22:50.720 | - I think it's, for me in those situations,

00:22:53.520 | it's about trusting my gut.

00:22:55.800 | It's about, it's okay to fail,

00:22:57.200 | but fail fast and learn, like you were saying.

00:22:59.520 | Have some fun in the process.

00:23:02.560 | Like this is, that smile and that will come across.

00:23:05.520 | And across all the questions you've asked

00:23:08.200 | and hopefully what people understand

00:23:10.640 | is understand your three or four value propositions

00:23:13.840 | moving into a room.

00:23:14.680 | Meaning, I hope I stand for authenticity

00:23:17.760 | in the spaces I enter.

00:23:19.440 | I hope that that resiliency comes across.

00:23:22.240 | So if you know consistently,

00:23:23.440 | you can't stand for everything.

00:23:24.600 | If you know your three to four value propositions,

00:23:26.800 | then when you are in a point of failure,

00:23:28.640 | you can fall back on those.

00:23:29.960 | And like I said, take all feedback seriously,

00:23:34.320 | but don't take it personally.

00:23:35.760 | That's critical because that will help you get,

00:23:37.920 | learn and succeed forward.

00:23:40.760 | - Yeah, and actually I've observed

00:23:42.600 | a lot of those qualities in you.

00:23:43.880 | Almost just to kind of reaffirm you,

00:23:45.880 | going through this process.

00:23:46.720 | 'Cause like I respected you very early on

00:23:48.920 | because like you had a really creative mind.

00:23:50.680 | You had, you're also very disciplined in your creativity.

00:23:53.440 | So it wasn't just some weird random ideas,

00:23:55.480 | but you can see the vision at the end of that.

00:23:58.040 | I think knowing that you're super attention to detail,

00:24:01.160 | you built a really wonderful relationships.

00:24:02.640 | Like you had to your point,

00:24:03.880 | all the core values or tenets of you as an individual

00:24:06.800 | that obviously like your success is like,

00:24:09.480 | it's not surprising to me.

00:24:10.320 | Like just the way you're built.

00:24:12.080 | And so there's actually a good segue.

00:24:13.400 | 'Cause I would love to hear about how you stepped

00:24:16.240 | into the world of PR and corporate comms.

00:24:18.960 | Like, and from the very beginning, like what,

00:24:21.440 | maybe even like, what did you think it was about?

00:24:23.640 | And at what you stepped in,

00:24:24.960 | did like expectation meet reality?

00:24:26.960 | And like, and how did you even get your first job?

00:24:29.040 | Let's hear about your journey.

00:24:30.000 | I mean, I'm just really interested about this.

00:24:32.120 | - So there's like three ways I want to take your question.

00:24:34.160 | So go with, bear with me on this journey.

00:24:36.880 | One is where you started.

00:24:38.640 | The creativity and discipline.

00:24:41.080 | I believe in search and reapply.

00:24:42.760 | And I grew up on the 20th Century Fox a lot.

00:24:45.040 | When you're producing a TV show,

00:24:48.360 | there's the creative realm and there's the production realm.

00:24:52.240 | And watching how they do that taught me how I do my job.

00:24:56.960 | And so basically how it all started was I've, like I said,

00:25:00.280 | I've always been fascinated

00:25:01.120 | about the wide psychology communications.

00:25:03.640 | My, one of my first roles was

00:25:06.360 | I actually had a speech writing internship

00:25:08.640 | in the White House, doing research and memos.

00:25:11.240 | And I had applied a bunch of times, got that.

00:25:14.080 | And I parlayed that into 20th Century Fox.

00:25:16.960 | And you were asking me about the myths,

00:25:18.640 | which was another direction I wanted to take this.

00:25:21.040 | The cons is glamorous, that it's easy,

00:25:23.080 | that you have to be an extrovert.

00:25:24.480 | And none of those are true.

00:25:26.040 | And in my time at 20th Century Fox, I launched Family Guy,

00:25:30.000 | but I found myself everywhere in con, at a festival,

00:25:34.720 | to being on the law and working on some major initiatives

00:25:38.200 | to running, helping to run our Hollywood Foreign Press

00:25:40.720 | Golden Globes campaigns.

00:25:42.800 | I found the pull of tech to be more powerful

00:25:45.160 | than like entertainment.

00:25:46.680 | I love entertainment.

00:25:47.560 | I love TV.

00:25:48.640 | Some people love sports.

00:25:49.560 | I love television.

00:25:50.400 | I love the medium and what it can do for society.

00:25:53.400 | That said, I am a tech geek.

00:25:54.560 | So I found my way up to Silicon Valley

00:25:56.760 | and worked across the stack apps, network server storage,

00:26:00.440 | Cisco, IBM, VMware, NetApp, Oracle.

00:26:04.480 | And what was always driving me in the roles

00:26:06.600 | was a tougher challenge,

00:26:07.800 | an opportunity to take a deeply technical concept.

00:26:11.000 | And additionally, a VC I worked with at my agency days

00:26:16.720 | taught me in-house agency startup,

00:26:20.160 | growth company, stable company, turnaround.

00:26:23.040 | Learn, and so what you'll see

00:26:24.960 | when you're working with me on a team,

00:26:26.480 | and I only get to work with many of you,

00:26:28.560 | is I'm constantly searching and reapplying.

00:26:32.440 | I'm pulling from the playbook of,

00:26:34.200 | 'cause when I got my MBA,

00:26:35.520 | I spent some time at P&G in a summer camp

00:26:38.800 | and then did an internship at PepsiCo.

00:26:41.000 | I'm constantly thinking about

00:26:43.120 | how did they do their communications project

00:26:45.240 | and how can I move forward?

00:26:47.080 | You've seen Shakespearean books become hit movies.

00:26:50.320 | Think about, collect those ideas

00:26:52.360 | because you will be able to use them.

00:26:54.480 | And I think, again, it all goes back to that psychology

00:26:56.880 | and the ability to excite someone

00:26:59.400 | about what you're offering.

00:27:01.000 | And I think even at its toughest moments

00:27:03.120 | when I've worked on crisis comms with employees,

00:27:05.920 | with our products, it's fun.

00:27:08.080 | - Did you think your MBA,

00:27:11.040 | did it add to your existing PR journey

00:27:14.440 | or was it at the start and it kind of got you into it?

00:27:18.480 | - It was midway.

00:27:19.440 | And many people who get an MBA don't work in comms

00:27:23.440 | and it was not as additive as it was for me.

00:27:25.920 | Many people who got it had already done econ

00:27:28.080 | and stats, et cetera.

00:27:30.120 | When I work on corporate earnings, I use my MBA.

00:27:33.040 | When I am expanding my network and looking,

00:27:36.040 | if I ever go on an agency side, new business,

00:27:38.680 | that will help me.

00:27:39.760 | So I'm forever grateful for that experience.

00:27:41.760 | It was incredibly tough for me

00:27:43.160 | because I do not have that background.

00:27:45.600 | In fact, when people ask me,

00:27:46.560 | what's your greatest weakness during an interview,

00:27:48.160 | I say financial modeling and budgeting

00:27:50.560 | and how I addressed those.

00:27:51.400 | I went to go get an MBA to understand it.

00:27:53.440 | So I think that it was additive.

00:27:56.680 | It was really helpful for me.

00:27:58.240 | And some of my best friends I ever made,

00:28:00.920 | I made through that program.

00:28:02.080 | And we're phone in touch in the Bay Area.

00:28:04.120 | - What would you say are,

00:28:07.040 | let's say the highlights of your career,

00:28:12.080 | like the top three achievements or crowning achievements

00:28:15.160 | that would define things you're really, really proud of?

00:28:18.360 | And if you're willing to share maybe a few examples

00:28:21.120 | of areas that you struggled

00:28:22.920 | or what we would classify as a failure or whatnot,

00:28:26.640 | can you just kind of share a little bit

00:28:27.480 | about your experience in those areas?

00:28:29.600 | - I'm gonna start with the failure.

00:28:30.600 | I don't know if it was a failure,

00:28:31.440 | but I'll classify this

00:28:32.480 | 'cause I think a lot of people experience this.

00:28:34.760 | I spent eight years at 20th Century Fox.

00:28:36.760 | So after that time,

00:28:38.800 | I wanted to go through a series of experiences

00:28:42.560 | and not necessarily stay at one place for a long time

00:28:45.200 | because I'd already done that.

00:28:46.720 | I experienced some challenges with recruiting.

00:28:50.280 | So I wanted to bring this up because people have done it

00:28:52.640 | and you'll be interviewed.

00:28:53.480 | They're like, you're only here for a certain amount of time.

00:28:56.440 | But it was about experiencing different cultures

00:28:58.360 | and learning the ways that people do things.

00:29:00.200 | And so trust your gut if that's the right.

00:29:04.000 | For me, it worked because now I have that backlog,

00:29:06.880 | but it was really challenging with recruiting.

00:29:10.000 | And as far as your first question

00:29:11.440 | about some of the greatest experiences,

00:29:13.240 | I'm gonna use one outside of work.

00:29:15.480 | I'm still on the board

00:29:16.320 | of San Francisco Animal Care and Control.

00:29:18.160 | And I was a small part of the work

00:29:19.640 | that we did to raise tens of millions of dollars,

00:29:22.960 | about 70 million to help build a new animal shelter.

00:29:26.520 | And I, again, worked on the initial messaging

00:29:30.000 | and I love animals.

00:29:32.120 | And I think the reason I bring this up first

00:29:34.400 | is it's important to find your side projects,

00:29:36.600 | your side hustles that also,

00:29:39.240 | when you have a tough day at work, you can turn over here.

00:29:41.120 | So when I've had a tough day working on crisis or maybe M&A,

00:29:45.600 | I go look at the animals

00:29:47.080 | and how many dogs are in the shelter

00:29:48.840 | and I can work on a project like our major donor events.

00:29:52.120 | And it just helps me balance out.

00:29:56.320 | Number two, I will go back to Family Guy

00:29:58.280 | and Launching Bones,

00:30:00.040 | because I remember when my VP asked me to take the lead

00:30:02.960 | and I actually said no,

00:30:04.280 | 'cause I didn't feel like I was ready.

00:30:06.280 | And I'm proud of that work

00:30:08.360 | because it was working with different groups

00:30:11.520 | and it was pushing myself beyond my comfort zone.

00:30:15.280 | And I think if any mistakes I made early on

00:30:19.160 | was I wasn't bold enough

00:30:20.320 | because I wasn't sure I was ready for it.

00:30:23.400 | And then finally, I guess leading VMworld at VMware

00:30:28.280 | and being the global comms lead, I should say, for VMworld,

00:30:31.800 | because the model I set up continues to be carried forward.

00:30:35.600 | And I'm always,

00:30:37.040 | a lot of people talk about leadership approach,

00:30:38.840 | like I'm a servant leader or I'm a change agent,

00:30:41.680 | whatever that is, and that's fabulous.

00:30:43.680 | I like to think about leadership purpose.

00:30:45.400 | What is your purpose as a leader?

00:30:47.200 | And for me, it's about elevating the next generation

00:30:49.160 | of talent or taking talent forward.

00:30:52.800 | I feel like I was able to build a model for VMworld

00:30:56.080 | that's carried on and became Explorer.

00:30:58.280 | And I'm proud of that.

00:30:59.400 | - Yeah, that's cool.

00:31:01.160 | I mean, you're talking about things like legacy, right?

00:31:04.000 | And your ultimate life mission.

00:31:06.200 | Excuse me.

00:31:08.840 | Just one last question for you.

00:31:10.480 | So for me, like just to age myself,

00:31:13.800 | I'm looking at like,

00:31:15.040 | it would be great if I could retire after the next 20 years.

00:31:18.800 | And for me, that then means

00:31:21.640 | I'm looking for different things in my career,

00:31:23.520 | different experiences,

00:31:24.520 | and I'm wondering where I should take things,

00:31:26.920 | podcasts included, right?

00:31:28.760 | And so for you,

00:31:30.800 | you're like, what are you looking for now?

00:31:32.320 | When you're looking at the next five to 10 years,

00:31:34.480 | like what's important to you?

00:31:36.000 | Is it still aligned to this area?

00:31:39.240 | Or to your point, is it supplemental?

00:31:40.840 | Is there something else

00:31:41.680 | that kind of like intellectually stimulating you?

00:31:43.920 | Like, what are you looking for now?

00:31:46.240 | - Definitely intellectually stimulating.

00:31:47.800 | I want to continue on this path

00:31:49.160 | because at some point I'd love to be a vice president

00:31:51.960 | or chief communications officer.

00:31:53.680 | I do not come, I'm LGBTQIA.

00:31:59.040 | I have some other points of diversity.

00:32:01.480 | I like to think just by showing up in the room

00:32:04.000 | and having a seat at the table,

00:32:05.240 | I can help change things quietly for the next generation.

00:32:09.200 | In addition, I'd like to balance that.

00:32:10.840 | I'm currently working on the board of Jackson Park

00:32:14.080 | as part of SF Parks and Alliances.

00:32:16.240 | So continuing that city work,

00:32:17.600 | we're raising 45 million.

00:32:19.120 | We've raised 30 of the 45 already

00:32:21.200 | for a new park in Potrero Hill.

00:32:23.040 | So it's really that passion and that purpose.

00:32:24.800 | That purpose is the city.

00:32:25.920 | That passion is the work I do in corporate communications.

00:32:29.720 | The reason I chose entertainment

00:32:30.960 | is I thought it could change society and it does.

00:32:33.040 | The reason I'm in corporate America

00:32:34.440 | is I know that communications can change the company

00:32:38.840 | and the world as a whole.

00:32:41.080 | And if you look at the Edelman Trust Barometer

00:32:43.360 | and several other studies,

00:32:45.160 | people look to companies now

00:32:47.360 | more than they look to several other outlets such as media.

00:32:50.840 | So if you can, as a comms expert,

00:32:52.800 | help lead the company and be some of the moral conscience,

00:32:56.480 | I'm hoping to do some good work in the next 10 to 15 years.

00:32:59.400 | - Well, I think you have everything it takes to succeed.

00:33:01.720 | So I'm personally looking forward

00:33:03.440 | to kind of seeing where you take everything.

00:33:05.720 | Alex, I just want to thank you for your time today.

00:33:07.400 | I personally learned a lot from you.

00:33:08.760 | I'm pretty sure our listeners have as well.

00:33:12.000 | Is there anything you want to call out

00:33:13.360 | in terms of how people can get ahold of you?

00:33:14.960 | Or you mentioned like some societies for dogs

00:33:17.200 | that you're passionate about.

00:33:18.360 | Is there anything you want to call out here?

00:33:19.840 | - So first of all, San Francisco Animal Care and Control

00:33:22.560 | is the public facility that brings in the animals,

00:33:25.120 | 10,000 animals a year.

00:33:26.480 | Please look into it.

00:33:27.600 | And Parks and Alliances, Jackson Park and Potrero

00:33:32.760 | would be another.

00:33:33.600 | Feel free to reach out to me on LinkedIn.

00:33:34.880 | I always love talking to people.

00:33:36.240 | I feel like you have to treat every day like a master class

00:33:39.360 | and I always learn through every conversation.

00:33:41.320 | So I'd welcome people reaching out.

00:33:43.720 | - And we'll put some of those links

00:33:45.040 | in the video description below

00:33:46.200 | so people can find those organizations

00:33:47.520 | you're talking about.

00:33:48.920 | So Alex, thanks a lot.

00:33:50.440 | - I've always loved our friendship.

00:33:51.720 | I remember the first meeting I was in with you.

00:33:53.640 | It was June 2012.

00:33:56.960 | I remember sitting down and it was a VMworld meeting

00:33:59.920 | and I remember our first engagement.

00:34:01.520 | So I really appreciate you inviting me on.

00:34:03.120 | - Yeah, absolutely.

00:34:04.400 | Alex, thanks and have a great one the rest of the day.

00:34:06.520 | - All right, thanks Tim.

00:34:07.360 | - All right, thank you.

00:34:08.320 | (upbeat music)

00:34:10.920 | (upbeat music fades)

00:34:14.000 | [BLANK_AUDIO]

What's the difference between Public Relations (PR), Corporate Comms and Global Comms?

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