RPF0294-Friday

00:00:00.000 | Hey there treasure hunters and bargain seekers.

00:00:03.400 | Are you on the lookout for a local thrift store that has it all?

00:00:06.600 | Look no further.

00:00:07.600 | Pix Exchange is your thrifting paradise right here in the heart of Torrance.

00:00:11.920 | Pix Exchange offers a wide variety of new and used clothing, shoes, new scrubs, uniforms,

00:00:17.480 | new and used furniture all at low prices.

00:00:20.280 | Don't miss out on the ultimate thrifting experience at our Pix Exchange parking lot anniversary

00:00:24.480 | sale at our Torrance location.

00:00:26.200 | Visit pixexchangehhh.org for more details.

00:00:30.080 | Live Friday Q&A show for you.

00:00:31.820 | Today we talk real estate, more real estate.

00:00:34.760 | We're going to have to rename radical personal finance to be radical real estate pretty soon

00:00:39.400 | here.

00:00:40.400 | We also talk, however, life insurance, how to protect spouse and kids with group life

00:00:43.560 | insurance and we talk a little bit about, again, where and how to save money for long-term

00:00:51.160 | goals.

00:00:52.160 | So we have some real gems in here today, I hope you enjoy.

00:01:10.360 | Welcome to the Radical Personal Finance Podcast.

00:01:12.320 | My name is Joshua Sheets and I'm your host.

00:01:14.000 | Thank you for being with me today.

00:01:15.000 | This is the show where I work hard to equip you with the ideas and inspiration you need

00:01:19.720 | to live a rich life now and also to build a plan for financial freedom in 10 years or

00:01:27.160 | less.

00:01:28.160 | Today you're going to hear some ideas on how to do both of those things.

00:01:42.440 | I've been switching our Friday Q&A calls to be a Live Friday Q&A call.

00:01:47.960 | And a quick note about that here as I begin, I really am enjoying this.

00:01:52.120 | I like the personal interaction.

00:01:53.840 | I enjoyed it very much a few months ago when I did it and I like it.

00:01:57.440 | I do warn you, I am still learning.

00:01:59.120 | It's a completely new skill set to figure out how to balance the appropriate length

00:02:03.360 | of an answer and how to stay on point.

00:02:06.800 | So frankly, I did my best but I was just thinking back a little bit after the fact about some

00:02:13.200 | of the answers and I did my best.

00:02:15.560 | But I intentionally often leave my best here for you without going back and editing it

00:02:21.840 | tightly sometimes simply because I want to lead by example.

00:02:28.200 | Anytime you're acquiring a new skill, you're going to find yourself in a situation probably

00:02:32.160 | where you're not very good for a while.

00:02:34.120 | They talk about the stages of competence, right?

00:02:37.000 | If memory is right, you start with unconscious incompetence and then you move to conscious

00:02:41.860 | incompetence.

00:02:43.680 | Then you move on to conscious competence and then finally perhaps to unconscious competence.

00:02:50.400 | But right now with these Friday Q&A shows, I feel like I'm in the stage of conscious

00:02:54.760 | incompetence at the moment.

00:02:57.000 | So bear with me.

00:02:58.000 | Stick with it.

00:02:59.000 | Feel free to use that forward button on your phone.

00:03:01.400 | That's the beauty of podcasting.

00:03:02.520 | If I run a little longer, I'm not able to do a perfect job.

00:03:05.900 | But I do try to leave these breadcrumbs here.

00:03:08.600 | And again, those of you who've listened to the show from the beginning, I am confident

00:03:12.820 | that I have measurably improved and increased in ability over time.

00:03:18.440 | And I've tried to leave those breadcrumbs here to encourage you in your endeavors.

00:03:22.620 | Don't expect to be good at things when you start.

00:03:24.960 | I've heard it said anything worth doing is worth doing poorly at first.

00:03:29.280 | You're not going to be good at things when you start even when I'm not good.

00:03:33.080 | But what we can do is we can continue to get better as we focus on developing the skills.

00:03:39.200 | So I think five or ten years from now, you tune into a Friday Q&A show if I'm still doing

00:03:43.020 | them in that format, and they'll be smooth.

00:03:45.180 | They'll be articulate.

00:03:46.180 | They'll be precise.

00:03:49.220 | But they're not totally there yet.

00:03:50.940 | But I'm working there.

00:03:51.980 | So as you're listening to today's show, my hope is you'll find some good ideas.

00:03:55.220 | But also watch what I'm doing and how I'm doing it because I believe it's a good model

00:03:59.620 | that all of us can apply.

00:04:01.700 | Before I hit play on the interview for you, a couple quick announcements.

00:04:04.980 | Number one, sponsor of today's show is YNAB.

00:04:07.700 | You need a budget.

00:04:08.700 | This is the personal budgeting software that I use.

00:04:11.340 | And they've just recently made some measurable improvements.

00:04:14.340 | If you have tried YNAB in the past and didn't like it, the biggest complaint that I've heard

00:04:19.180 | in the past about YNAB is in the past, they didn't automatically import transactions.

00:04:25.220 | Personally, I find that to be a benefit because then I'm forced to manually enter the transactions

00:04:29.980 | which raises my level of consciousness around my spending.

00:04:34.140 | But if you don't need that level of consciousness and if you have a lot of transactions, it

00:04:38.140 | can be a little bit annoying, totally recognize that.

00:04:40.860 | So in the latest version and update of YNAB, they have completely fixed that and now you

00:04:45.620 | can set up automatic import.

00:04:47.300 | And I think that's the best way to do it because you can set up the automatic import or if

00:04:50.380 | you still want to have the pain of entering in your spending transactions, you can force

00:04:55.980 | that pain onto yourself by doing it manually.

00:04:59.140 | YNAB is the budgeting software that I use to budget my business software and my personal

00:05:03.380 | software every single day.

00:05:05.300 | I'm in the app multiple times a week.

00:05:07.820 | So I commend it to you.

00:05:08.940 | It's the best solution I found for budgeting my family's money.

00:05:11.820 | Get a free 30-day trial at RadicalPersonalFinance.com/YNAB, RadicalPersonalFinance.com/YNAB, short for

00:05:20.660 | you need a budget, RadicalPersonalFinance.com/YNAB.

00:05:24.140 | Quick announcement as well, I have been participating in the online investing conference.

00:05:28.020 | That conference, the early bird registration has now ended.

00:05:31.980 | Hopefully many of you took advantage of that.

00:05:33.540 | However, the late registration is still available and I would recommend to you if you have any

00:05:38.860 | interest in finding out about some of really the world's – some of the world's leading

00:05:43.620 | commentators on investment opportunities in 2016, if you have interest and want to hear

00:05:49.340 | their insight on some of the major opportunities that might be available in this year for your

00:05:54.940 | investments, go to RadicalPersonalFinance.com/OIC which is an acronym for Online Investing Conference,

00:06:01.940 | Online Investing Conference.

00:06:03.860 | You get free access to introductory videos where you can find out the gist of what they're

00:06:09.100 | talking about and then if you decide the conference is right for you, feel free to sign up there.

00:06:13.620 | Finally, I'm about to play the Q&A but I intend to offer these Q&A calls just about

00:06:18.380 | weekly and they will be offered to patrons in the future.

00:06:21.860 | At the end of this recording, you'll hear me kind of quibble a little bit and it's

00:06:26.220 | just very raw.

00:06:27.220 | I'm not editing it but you'll hear me just talk about the patron program.

00:06:31.780 | You'll hear my answers and I've made a few missteps on the patron program but I'm

00:06:35.180 | focused on trying to improve it consistently.

00:06:37.920 | One of the ways that I do want to do that is I will be continuing to do these Q&A calls.

00:06:42.140 | If you would like to have a question answered on the show in this format, I would recommend

00:06:47.500 | to you that you sign up to become a patron and that way you'll get access to the day

00:06:51.820 | and time and phone number for this call and you'll be able to join and access the call

00:06:56.060 | as a patron.

00:06:57.060 | I have a long queue of emails that I get from listeners and subscribers, plenty of questions

00:07:02.420 | that I could answer.

00:07:03.420 | I just have too many to answer and so this is one way of me prioritizing the answers

00:07:08.440 | for the patrons of the show.

00:07:09.440 | So if you'd like to participate with a question or a comment or on anything you like, please

00:07:16.160 | consider becoming a patron of the show.

00:07:17.860 | Go to RadicalPersonalFinance.com/patron and you will then gain access to the Q&A show

00:07:23.340 | information.

00:07:24.340 | Great, welcome to the Q&A call today guys.

00:07:28.740 | I'm looking forward to speaking with you all.

00:07:31.180 | Just real quick, very simple, I'll let you kick us off with a question.

00:07:35.460 | Feel free to talk about anything that you'd like to talk about.

00:07:37.460 | We'll talk and we'll have a little bit of back and forth if you have questions, comments,

00:07:41.140 | but I'm happy to hear your input.

00:07:43.340 | So let's start with Scott in Indianapolis.

00:07:45.540 | Scott, go ahead and ask your question.

00:07:47.740 | Well, thanks a lot, Joshua.

00:07:51.140 | I have a question about, a two-part question about liability umbrella insurance.

00:07:57.180 | I think a lot of us radicals kind of have a handle on what type and how much life insurance

00:08:03.260 | or disability insurance, but in terms of umbrella insurance, I'm kind of in the dark.

00:08:10.100 | There are two schools of thought that I've read about.

00:08:13.140 | One is yes, umbrella insurance is good in the event of damages that exceed your homeowner's

00:08:20.740 | and automobile insurance, but the flip side, completely 180 degree from that is no, you

00:08:27.420 | don't want umbrella insurance because that will make you an easier target for a damaged

00:08:33.380 | payout.

00:08:34.380 | So my first part of the question is, is it good, bad, or does it depend on the individual

00:08:40.580 | situation?

00:08:41.580 | And the second part is how much umbrella liability insurance do you need if you determine that

00:08:48.380 | you do need some?

00:08:51.060 | This is a fun one.

00:08:52.060 | I've also read those different perspectives.

00:08:55.020 | It's an area where I'm weak on in terms of practical experience.

00:08:59.340 | I've looked for, tried to find somebody who would be an expert on this area to bring on

00:09:04.740 | for an interview.

00:09:05.740 | And in fact, if there's anybody listening to this podcast who is an expert on this topic,

00:09:11.900 | who'd like to talk about it, I'd love to have you on the show.

00:09:14.580 | Just email me, joshua@radicalpersonalfinance.com, and I'd be happy to bring you on and discuss

00:09:19.260 | it.

00:09:20.260 | But I was taught – so I've never sold liability insurance nor have I worked extensively

00:09:25.300 | in that marketplace beyond just what I did to pass the CFP exam and beyond the basic

00:09:29.660 | certified financial planner recommendations.

00:09:32.620 | So the basic rule I was taught though, my instructor in preparing for the CFP exam,

00:09:38.420 | he said, "If you ever see liability insurance as an option on the test, make sure that you

00:09:53.380 | go ahead and check that because it's going to be right."

00:09:58.860 | The rule that they taught was liability insurance, umbrella liability insurance is always a good

00:10:04.140 | idea.

00:10:05.180 | So I have no differing opinion to that.

00:10:08.580 | I think the whole easier target thing, I don't know.

00:10:18.480 | It doesn't make sense to me that – I'm speechless because I just don't know the

00:10:23.500 | answer.

00:10:24.500 | I don't think that prudent protection is going to make you a target.

00:10:27.180 | I think that probably more of the other things that you do in your life are going to make

00:10:31.100 | you a target.

00:10:32.100 | I think you can minimize that risk is to simply focus on living a less flashy lifestyle.

00:10:38.580 | So for me, I always have been into the concept of never let people know how much money you

00:10:44.340 | have, never let people know how much you're worth, and I think that most wealthy people

00:10:48.980 | live their lives that same way.

00:10:50.860 | Now obviously, you live in a certain zip code, you live in a certain type of house.

00:10:55.120 | People are going to make assumptions about that.

00:10:57.140 | I don't think that having insurance is going to make the difference.

00:11:01.940 | If someone can present to me evidence to the contrary, I'd love to see it and I'll

00:11:06.100 | change my opinion, but I've never seen evidence for that.

00:11:08.260 | As far as how much, it's generally so cheap, I don't see any reason not to protect – essentially,

00:11:18.540 | I don't see any reason not to protect most of your assets or especially at least not

00:11:22.260 | most of the assets that aren't protected by some other mechanism.

00:11:26.540 | I know that's kind of fuzzy, but that's just been – if I had $5 million net worth,

00:11:31.100 | having a $5 million umbrella liability policy to me just seems like a decent place to start.

00:11:37.380 | I don't know anything more specific than that and rather than me go on and on, I'll

00:11:42.500 | just repeat what I said.

00:11:43.500 | If there's an expert in this area, I have a few friends who deal here in Palm Beach

00:11:47.620 | and like the high net worth market that maybe I'll reach out to them personally and see

00:11:51.900 | if they'd like to come on and talk about it and I'll see if I can get you a better

00:11:54.900 | answer in the future, but that's all I got, Scott, unfortunately.

00:11:58.020 | That's fine, Joshua.

00:12:00.100 | That's pretty much my assessment as well.

00:12:03.020 | I picked up an extra $1 million umbrella insurance policy about a year and a half ago and it's

00:12:09.660 | only like $100 a year.

00:12:12.340 | It's really cheap and the extra $100 doesn't really move the needle in terms of our cash

00:12:19.500 | flow statement.

00:12:20.500 | So yeah, thanks for your time.

00:12:23.500 | That helps.

00:12:24.500 | The only other thing I do know that you want to make sure of and most of the time the insurance

00:12:28.700 | agent will do this for you, but make sure that your coverages are lined up properly.

00:12:33.780 | So if on your homeowner's insurance you have a liability limit of let's just say $500,000,

00:12:39.700 | you want to make sure that your umbrella policy is picking up at $500,000 and it's going

00:12:46.180 | from $500,000 to $1.5 million.

00:12:49.620 | You want to make sure that it's not kicking in at a million dollars.

00:12:51.940 | You don't want there to be a gap between the coverages.

00:12:54.540 | So if you line those things up properly, then there'll be a good interplay between the home

00:13:03.180 | and your car and the umbrella policies.

00:13:05.460 | I think it's the big thing I've learned to look out for on liability insurance.

00:13:09.060 | If you can find an expert liability insurance agent, I think it's really, really valuable

00:13:15.580 | to have because there can be a lot of little things that you want someone to go through.

00:13:21.180 | This is again where my friend who specializes in working with high net worth families here

00:13:24.820 | in Palm Beach, he'll talk about going through and recognizing, "Oh, okay, we've got the

00:13:29.660 | jet skis on the yacht."

00:13:30.660 | Well, you've got to make sure that those are covered because you don't want to have a loophole

00:13:34.620 | where one of the teenagers was riding the jet ski that was on the yacht, there was no

00:13:39.140 | insurance policy in force, and now there was an accident of some kind and you're found

00:13:44.260 | liable.

00:13:45.260 | You've got to make sure that everything is covered.

00:13:46.580 | So I think in addition to the umbrella policy, it's important to have somebody just talk

00:13:50.320 | through all the little risks, make sure that all the vehicles, that the ATVs are covered,

00:13:55.340 | that the shed, the structures are covered, just all of the little things.

00:13:58.540 | I think that's also important in approaching liability insurance.

00:14:02.340 | So that's the best I got.

00:14:03.340 | Again, I welcome any readers or listeners who have better opinions.

00:14:07.020 | Joshua at RadicalPersonalFinance.com.

00:14:09.340 | Let's go next and I'll let you guys choose who would like to go next.

00:14:14.340 | I wouldn't mind going next, Josh.

00:14:20.480 | Go ahead.

00:14:21.480 | Yes, I actually have a bunch more questions after listening to that answer about insurance,

00:14:27.200 | but I'll leave those for another day.

00:14:29.200 | My question I was calling about was just about a simple life insurance purchase through my

00:14:37.840 | W-2 job.

00:14:39.120 | My wife has recently decided to stay at home and leave her job and on the re-…

00:14:45.740 | You have to stay with our two kids at home, but when redoing my benefits, I kind of was

00:14:52.500 | looking through the different options I had again and I can elect to change some of those.

00:14:57.000 | And one that I had never considered before was spouse life insurance or child life insurance.

00:15:01.680 | I always just skipped over them thinking she was either covered or financially.

00:15:06.080 | I didn't think there was a…

00:15:10.440 | If we lost a child, I didn't know financially how that would impact us.

00:15:13.960 | So I always skipped over those ones, but I was looking at the prices of them and it seems

00:15:18.320 | to go up in $10,000 increments for about 37…

00:15:21.440 | Or I guess it's like 18 or 19 cents per week if you cost it out.

00:15:25.720 | So that comes to about $480 a year for $500,000 of insurance or like the last caller said,

00:15:33.480 | it's just under $100 a year for $100,000 of insurance.

00:15:36.960 | And hearing him makes me think, "Okay, that lines up price-wise with other things, which

00:15:42.040 | is good."

00:15:43.040 | But I'm just kind of curious about the overall thought process of how to decide whether I

00:15:47.720 | should go for this or not.

00:15:49.360 | I'm more inclined to skip it still, but I just want to make sure I'm not missing

00:15:54.720 | anything.

00:15:55.720 | My answer to the question is it's going to depend on the numbers and there are a couple

00:15:59.720 | different steps to the thinking process.

00:16:02.940 | The first thing you have to ask yourself and let's separate the question of spouse versus

00:16:06.200 | kids and answer them separately because they're very different approaches.

00:16:09.820 | So the first question when you're thinking about, "Does my stay-at-home wife, does

00:16:13.920 | she need insurance coverage?"

00:16:16.760 | My answer is yes, she does.

00:16:18.700 | So hopefully most people will agree.

00:16:22.000 | The only exception would be if you're financially independent and you don't need it and I'd

00:16:24.840 | still probably buy it.

00:16:26.640 | If my wife is a stay-at-home mom and if she died, I mean, I don't know what I'd do.

00:16:33.340 | I don't know how I'd build.

00:16:34.580 | I would have no possibility of continuing the plan going forward and being able to take

00:16:39.660 | care of our children in the way that we've dreamed.

00:16:41.600 | So there's no question about my having as much life insurance on her as I can get.

00:16:48.480 | So let's start with yes, she needs life insurance.

00:16:51.340 | Next you got to figure out how much.

00:16:53.060 | Now when you have somebody who is a wage earner, then you can calculate their economic contribution

00:17:02.020 | to the household and you can calculate the economic needs.

00:17:04.860 | It's relatively simple.

00:17:07.380 | The best way is you do a needs analysis and you figure out how much money they're bringing

00:17:10.660 | into the household and you can figure out the appropriate amount of life insurance or

00:17:13.780 | you can just simply say, "I want to replace their salary."

00:17:16.940 | When you have a stay-at-home spouse, it's a lot more difficult because I can't prove

00:17:24.860 | in my family, I can't prove what the economic value is of my wife.

00:17:29.740 | I'll tell you, it is huge.

00:17:32.500 | It's massive.

00:17:34.100 | She's far more valuable to our family than any amount of money that she could earn out

00:17:38.300 | in the workforce.

00:17:39.580 | So that's what I'm trying to protect.

00:17:41.420 | Now it gets a little bit fuzzy as to figure out what's an appropriate amount of life insurance

00:17:45.460 | and the only thing I've ever been able to figure out to do is to say, "Get at least

00:17:53.500 | half of what the wage-earning spouse has in insurance coverage."

00:17:59.140 | You could probably go through and figure out, "Well, how much would I need to buy these

00:18:02.540 | certain services?"

00:18:04.040 | But it's just such an unknown.

00:18:05.420 | Even though I like precision, I've never been able to get to that level of precision.

00:18:09.700 | And so when I used to sell insurance, if the husband was going to buy $2 million, I'd

00:18:15.620 | get at least $1 million for a stay-at-home spouse.

00:18:17.180 | If the husband needed $1.5 million, I'd try to get $750 or $1 million for the stay-at-home

00:18:22.020 | spouse.

00:18:23.020 | I have about $2.5 million of insurance on me and my wife has $1 million on her.

00:18:28.000 | So it's similar ratios.

00:18:31.860 | That's the best I can get to with the amount.

00:18:34.140 | Then you got to decide, "Well, what's the best way to do it?

00:18:36.860 | Is it best to do it through your job or is it best to do it independently?"

00:18:40.660 | The answer is it's always best to do it independently unless you can get just some crazy screaming

00:18:46.500 | deal through your job.

00:18:48.180 | You want it independently because you don't want her ability to have life insurance to

00:18:55.580 | be connected to your job.

00:18:58.140 | Imagine the scenario where you lose your job and you're staying at home now and she's caring

00:19:03.180 | for you and then all of a sudden she dies during that time.

00:19:06.980 | Not only did you lose your life insurance, but you lost her life insurance as well.

00:19:10.940 | I always want to have the appropriate amount of life insurance that we can get in an individually

00:19:19.620 | owned life insurance policy.

00:19:20.860 | It's probably going to be a term life insurance policy, or at least for the majority of it,

00:19:25.860 | because you have a temporary need when your kids are younger and you have a temporary

00:19:30.940 | need, that 20-year time span, so that's a great fit for a term policy.

00:19:35.860 | You want to get it with that individual term policy so it's not connected to your job.

00:19:41.300 | Now, once you've got that in place, you go back and look at the insurance at your job

00:19:46.740 | and you say, "Is this a good deal?"

00:19:48.980 | Here's where it can be a little bit fuzzy.

00:19:52.540 | Let's say that you've got $2 million of insurance on you and you got a million-dollar life insurance

00:19:58.500 | policy on your wife as a separate term policy that you own personally, and then you're looking

00:20:05.380 | at your group benefits and you can see that she can get $350,000 for just pennies.

00:20:11.820 | Take that number that they quote you on the benefits statement and compare it to what

00:20:18.820 | you're paying for term insurance.

00:20:21.580 | Sometimes it'll be more, sometimes it'll be less.

00:20:24.380 | If it's substantially less, if it's cheap, maybe I'm biased because I'm formerly an insurance

00:20:30.740 | agent, but if it's super cheap, I would usually just add it on because I feel good having

00:20:36.160 | a little bit of extra money, especially knowing that sometimes with some insurance companies,

00:20:40.700 | you can't quite qualify for as much as you'd like.

00:20:43.460 | Frankly, I'd like to have a little bit more insurance on my wife and I haven't really

00:20:47.700 | applied for it, but I do know from having been an insurance agent that right now, if

00:20:51.420 | we were to go and apply for more life insurance for her, we couldn't economically justify

00:20:55.540 | it based upon the internal underwriting guidelines.

00:20:58.820 | So if I had the opportunity to pick up a few extra $100,000 at my job for a couple of bucks

00:21:04.220 | here and there and it's substantially below the open market rates, I would do it, but

00:21:08.700 | it's not a precise answer.

00:21:10.180 | Now if you don't have the insurance in place individually, then definitely yes, get it

00:21:15.700 | at the job and also if you can't get a good rate on insurance individually, let's say

00:21:22.540 | your wife is sick or is unhealthy in some way and she's being quoted too high of a rate,

00:21:28.500 | well then it's very compelling to step in and get the insurance coverage at her job.

00:21:33.140 | So it's a matter of running the numbers and comparing what premiums you're quoted at your

00:21:39.820 | job versus the premiums in the open market.

00:21:42.580 | Have you done any of that analysis yet?

00:21:44.980 | No, actually I haven't done anything at all.

00:21:49.100 | In fact, outside of just the free insurance, we get the hidden cost insurance that we don't

00:21:56.100 | pay for through my job and her job that are just some multiples of our salary that are

00:22:01.140 | paid for by the companies.

00:22:02.180 | We don't have really any life insurance at all and I know it's a big gaping hole for

00:22:07.820 | the whole avoid catastrophe part of it.

00:22:11.060 | We have been passing on it just because we keep thinking off the cuff, okay, if one of

00:22:17.380 | us dies, we can still get by, but obviously there's going to be impact and it was just

00:22:23.060 | a matter of is it a catastrophic impact?

00:22:27.060 | I mean, obviously beyond losing the spouse or whatever, but financially it's like, well,

00:22:32.100 | the answer was always, yeah, we see a way that we could get by without it, but obviously

00:22:35.940 | things would be a lot easier if we did have it.

00:22:38.540 | So we just, being ignorant, we just kind of pass on it rather than buy it without knowing

00:22:44.020 | what to buy or how to analyze it or even simple things like what's a screaming deal considered?

00:22:50.300 | I only had one data point, which was the deal from work and now after hearing what you said,

00:22:57.340 | maybe I should have got independent insurance while she was, or before she quits work even

00:23:02.380 | maybe, but they probably have rules about how long after that you can quit.

00:23:07.060 | Yeah, I haven't run the numbers on anything.

00:23:10.180 | Okay.

00:23:11.180 | So about what age is your wife?

00:23:12.620 | Sorry, I went back on mute.

00:23:16.460 | She is 30, she's 34.

00:23:19.420 | Okay.

00:23:20.420 | So a 34 year old female, healthy non-smoker, you could buy a million dollars of term life

00:23:26.100 | insurance, annual renewable term insurance, which probably gut instinct here, I would

00:23:31.580 | say probably in about the $35 to $40 a month range.

00:23:35.220 | So that's about $400 a year, something like that.

00:23:39.740 | So and you can run some numbers.

00:23:42.520 | In fact, what I'm going to do, I'm going to hit pause just a moment here and I'm going

00:23:45.420 | to run a quick quote so we use real numbers.

00:23:47.700 | Okay.

00:23:48.700 | So I just ran some rates here and to answer this question a little bit better and the

00:23:55.140 | website that I use, I won't link it in the show notes, I'll just simply say it here in

00:23:58.220 | the audio, but I use a website that I've mentioned on the show before called thestamagency.com.

00:24:03.380 | T-H-E-S-T-A-M-M-A-G-E-N-C-Y.

00:24:08.820 | And the reason I'm not linking it in the show notes is because this is a website that's

00:24:12.260 | for brokers.

00:24:13.260 | I've interviewed, it's my friend, Todd Simpson, he's been on the show before.

00:24:19.300 | This is the agency that he runs and they do, they have on this website term insurance rates

00:24:29.260 | that you can run if you want to run term insurance.

00:24:31.420 | And so there's no sales funnel.

00:24:32.580 | This isn't like all of the terminsurance.com and all the gazillion options that exist there.

00:24:37.660 | There's no sign up to contact agents.

00:24:39.620 | If you're just trying to get an idea of how much insurance is going to cost for you, you

00:24:42.940 | can use this.

00:24:43.940 | There's no follow-up funnel for you.

00:24:46.460 | So a 10-year level term insurance policy for a million dollars for a 35-year-old female

00:24:54.100 | in the state of Florida, preferred best non-tobacco here, we're talking an annual premium of $230

00:25:00.220 | for 10 years level term.

00:25:02.740 | That's with protective, MetLife 230, Banner Life 240, and Principal 250.

00:25:08.000 | Now preferred best is a little bit tough to get, but let's just start with that.

00:25:11.260 | And that's why I say you got to actually get some real numbers.

00:25:13.940 | Or if you wanted to stretch it out to, let's get 15-year, and let's just look at 20-year

00:25:17.580 | term here, level 20-year term insurance, protective life for a 35-year-old female, a million bucks

00:25:23.900 | is $371 a year level for 20 years.

00:25:27.760 | So we're actually talking even for level term there, we're talking less.

00:25:33.260 | This website doesn't quote annual renewable terms, so it doesn't do it well anyway.

00:25:37.680 | So I can't quote you those prices.

00:25:39.700 | Let's just stick with level term.

00:25:42.360 | So we're basically talking about $25 to $40 a month.

00:25:47.580 | You can get, again, 20-year level term insurance for $380 a year for 20 years.

00:25:55.020 | So when I look at those numbers and I compare them to the financial scale that most of us

00:25:59.020 | are dealing with, those numbers are insignificant.

00:26:03.940 | It's not going to make or break somebody.

00:26:07.060 | You obviously have to, each individual listener, obviously have to check your budget and see

00:26:12.020 | is this $30 a month, is this going to make or break me?

00:26:14.500 | Is this going to make a big difference?

00:26:15.500 | And you might need a little bit less, you might need to figure something else out.

00:26:20.380 | But when I look at that, I just say in the grand scheme of things, that's not a big deal,

00:26:24.340 | especially as compared to the peace of mind that I get knowing that I have a lot of insurance

00:26:31.180 | in place.

00:26:32.180 | Because I'll tell you what, if my wife passed away, my business would be closed down, it

00:26:37.580 | would take me a long time to figure out what to do.

00:26:41.580 | And the insurance would make a big difference.

00:26:44.160 | So you could compare those numbers, got a little off track there, but you could compare

00:26:48.380 | those numbers to what you're being offered at your job.

00:26:53.620 | Now it's not going to be a direct comparison because what you're offered at your job is

00:26:58.580 | actually a yearly renewable term policy bundled within a group contract.

00:27:03.420 | So it's not directly comparable.

00:27:05.420 | But if Protective Life is saying they'll offer you a contract for $230 a year for 10 years

00:27:11.100 | level for a million bucks and you go at your job and you find out that instead of $230

00:27:17.140 | a year, it's going to be $400 a year, well then there's no reason for ... I wouldn't

00:27:23.340 | get the group insurance in that place.

00:27:24.820 | I'd go buy the level term contract out in the open market.

00:27:27.940 | Now if on the other hand, you get in there and you say, "Well, it's a hundred bucks a

00:27:30.740 | year," now you know you're getting a good deal and go ahead and buy it there at your

00:27:34.540 | group contract.

00:27:35.860 | So that's how I would answer the question of insurance for your wife who's a stay at

00:27:40.920 | home mom and do that.

00:27:43.180 | Now let's switch to the kids because it's a different conversation.

00:27:48.140 | With regard to insurance for kids, there are a few different schools of thought.

00:27:52.980 | One school of thought is make sure that you have just enough money to bury the kids.

00:27:59.560 | Another school of thought, if something happens and you've got to pay for a funeral, that

00:28:03.780 | can be an unexpected expense, so therefore you want to make sure that you cover that

00:28:07.020 | with insurance.

00:28:08.500 | That's one school of thought.

00:28:09.500 | Another school of thought is just don't bother with insurance.

00:28:13.960 | It's unlikely to happen.

00:28:15.320 | It's not really going to be a big deal.

00:28:17.620 | Another school of thought is to buy a lot of life insurance because of the money that

00:28:21.260 | you're investing into your kids.

00:28:24.260 | And then there are other variations of it.

00:28:27.940 | Personally, I believe it's very valuable to have insurance for your kids.

00:28:34.900 | I own life insurance policies on both of my children.

00:28:38.420 | When it comes to how to do it, the challenge is that you cannot buy term life insurance

00:28:43.700 | for kids in the open market, or at least if you can, I've never found out where and how

00:28:48.100 | to do it.

00:28:49.100 | If any listener can show me where and how, I'll be happy to spread that information.

00:28:52.340 | I've never found a place to buy a term life insurance policy for my kids in the open market.

00:28:57.900 | The only place I've seen those policies offered is as bundled with a group contract, just

00:29:03.220 | like you have the option there at your job.

00:29:06.100 | The cool thing about those term policies that are offered there as a group contract is they're

00:29:10.020 | really, really cheap.

00:29:11.020 | Now, there's not going to be that much insurance, but they're pretty cheap.

00:29:15.140 | And so it's just a matter of saying, "Is it going to be 19 cents a month?

00:29:20.660 | Well, if so, then I'll go ahead and do it just in case.

00:29:23.780 | If it's going to be five bucks a month, I don't know."

00:29:27.860 | You have to run the risk of it, and you could compare the amount of the insurance versus

00:29:33.280 | the amount of the benefit.

00:29:35.860 | I usually just told people sign up for it because usually those group contracts, they're

00:29:39.860 | very, very inexpensive.

00:29:41.780 | The statistical likelihood of your children dying at a young age is tiny, but you'd be

00:29:46.340 | glad to have it if it happened.

00:29:48.580 | What I have done is purchased small whole life insurance policies for my kids because

00:29:54.900 | to me, the biggest value of those is the ability to buy additional amounts of insurance in

00:29:59.940 | the future.

00:30:01.140 | So I have $25,000 whole life policies on each of my kids, and the policies are carefully

00:30:07.180 | designed so that they have maximum growth and death benefit, minimum premium payments

00:30:13.260 | due with a good quality insurance company.

00:30:16.800 | And then also they have a couple of riders on them, and they have two riders that to

00:30:20.100 | me are very important.

00:30:21.100 | They have one is a waiver of premium rider where if the child ever gets sick or disabled,

00:30:25.940 | the premiums are waived on the contract.

00:30:28.220 | And they also have an additional purchase benefit rider where those small $25,000 policies

00:30:33.620 | actually have a total of just under about a million bucks of additional purchases that

00:30:38.040 | are available.

00:30:39.180 | So if for some reason my kids got sick or hurt in the future, they would not be able

00:30:45.500 | to and they couldn't get more insurance, then at least in that situation, we could go ahead

00:30:50.980 | and buy more insurance under the contract that they have, even if they couldn't medically

00:30:55.880 | qualify for it or if they couldn't occupationally qualify for it because one of them has started

00:31:00.500 | racing cars in NASCAR or something like that.

00:31:03.260 | So to me, that's important.

00:31:04.660 | Many people feel strongly differently about it.

00:31:06.820 | You buy them at age zero, they're about $20, $25 a month.

00:31:11.460 | And cash accumulation in kids' policies is very slow.

00:31:16.160 | It's a really bad rate of return in the very beginning.

00:31:19.060 | It's really, really bad because of the costs of insurance when you start that little.

00:31:24.000 | But you will at some point recoup the money if you cash them out.

00:31:27.380 | Their whole life policies, they'll go paid up in somewhere between 10 and 20 years.

00:31:31.880 | So I just like them.

00:31:33.460 | I think it's flexible and I'm willing to – that small amount of money is small enough that

00:31:39.940 | it's not – I don't ever view it as something that is going to make my family rich, but

00:31:44.700 | I like having it as a backstop.

00:31:46.500 | And it makes me feel good knowing that if something happened and one of my kids died,

00:31:50.980 | there would be enough money there to do – probably to do something in their honor.

00:31:56.120 | And yes, we have other savings accounts and emergency funds and things like that that

00:32:00.380 | we wouldn't have to go to a life insurance policy, but I like having a life insurance

00:32:04.660 | policy.

00:32:05.660 | It's one of those where I can't give you a hard and fast rule, but that's how we've

00:32:10.540 | approached it.

00:32:11.540 | Any follow-up questions on that?

00:32:13.780 | No, that's really helpful to hear how you think through that and all the details on

00:32:19.180 | the policy for the kids.

00:32:20.980 | Thank you very much.

00:32:21.980 | The only limitation I might have on the spouse insurance through my work is I think – if

00:32:30.060 | I'm not mistaken, it does cap out at $500,000, so I may – I know you're talking on the

00:32:36.380 | orders of multiples of millions, one or above, so that might be the other factor that pushes

00:32:41.940 | me out into the open market even if it was a better deal than the open market.

00:32:46.500 | So yeah, thank you very much.

00:32:47.660 | It's all very helpful.

00:32:48.660 | You're welcome.

00:32:49.660 | I consider a million bucks to basically be the minimal insurance policy that I'd ever

00:32:53.180 | even bother with, and the reason for it is a couple of things.

00:32:56.740 | For most people, the cost – and again, we're talking mass market, the majority of listeners

00:33:02.540 | listening to this show, middle market, median income, upper median income, a million bucks

00:33:07.500 | of insurance is on the range of 20 to 40 bucks a month for most people, and that's just

00:33:12.460 | not a lot of money.

00:33:14.780 | Saving – going to $13 a month instead of $19 a month in order to get 500,000 instead

00:33:20.260 | of a million, OK, fine.

00:33:22.480 | You can do it, but I've never bothered with that little amounts.

00:33:26.580 | Number two is a million dollars of insurance today is really useful.

00:33:32.060 | Twenty years from now, figure out what that million dollars would be worth.

00:33:36.060 | Let's do some quick math here.

00:33:38.140 | Let's punch a million bucks into a calculator as a present value, and present value, let's

00:33:45.260 | say 20 years, let's run this in as a 3% annual inflation, no payments, and let's

00:33:57.700 | see what that'll be worth in 20 years.

00:33:59.060 | So in 20 years, a million dollars of insurance is going to be worth $543,794, the equivalent

00:34:06.380 | in today's dollars if we have a 3% inflation rate.

00:34:09.780 | So when you're buying a term policy like this, a 20-year term policy, you got to factor

00:34:15.460 | that in as well.

00:34:17.300 | So I just basically think a million bucks is the minimum unit, and if someone wants

00:34:23.640 | to get half a million, fine.

00:34:25.060 | It doesn't work in my head, but that's up to you.

00:34:28.300 | Run the numbers, and what you'll see is – quick comment that might be interesting

00:34:32.460 | to some people.

00:34:35.140 | The way insurance is priced, it's generally with most companies, most insurance policies,

00:34:40.220 | there are exceptions, but it's completely linear, but there's a policy fee in the

00:34:46.340 | insurance.

00:34:47.340 | What I mean by it's linear.

00:34:48.340 | So if I'm looking at this 10-year term $100,000 contract that's on the screen in front

00:34:53.780 | of me, that's $230 a year.

00:34:56.220 | If we were to increase that to $2 million, it would basically be about double except

00:35:03.100 | for the policy fee.

00:35:04.940 | So usually an insurance contract will have a policy fee.

00:35:07.380 | It could be anywhere from $50 to $100 a year, and that policy fee is how the insurance company

00:35:13.320 | calculates the cost of maintaining the contract, the cost of sending out the annual notices,

00:35:18.420 | the cost of all of those things.

00:35:19.820 | So let's say it's a $50 policy fee.

00:35:22.800 | So what that means is if the contract is $230 minus a $50 policy fee, the cost of insurance

00:35:29.780 | is $180, and that number is linear.

00:35:33.660 | So if we wanted to figure out if those were the real numbers, if we wanted to figure out

00:35:37.020 | the exact additional cost, we would take the $230, pull out the $50 policy fee, which equals

00:35:42.660 | $180, and that's $180 for a million units, a million dollars of insurance.

00:35:48.900 | Multiply that number times two, it would be 360, and then we would add the $50 back in.

00:35:54.420 | So that would be $410.

00:35:56.660 | So the cost for a $2 million policy would be $410, and the cost for a $1 million policy

00:36:01.260 | would be $230.

00:36:03.340 | That's how insurance is priced.

00:36:05.020 | That's how it works.

00:36:06.300 | So when you get down to the very minimal numbers, $150, and you know you're going to have a

00:36:11.740 | built-in $50, $75, $100, $90 policy fee, and that's in every contract, there's no reason

00:36:18.980 | not to increase the amount of insurance to the point where the policy fee is a negligible

00:36:24.740 | amount of the premium.

00:36:26.340 | That's another reason why I just assume we're starting at a million bucks.

00:36:31.340 | This other little tip I would say is I would always choose a higher amount of insurance

00:36:35.940 | in a shorter term if I had to.

00:36:40.620 | If I'm trying to figure out a budget, I'd rather have a $2 million – and you got to

00:36:45.140 | actually look at your situation, but in general, a good rule of thumb, have more insurance

00:36:49.200 | for a lesser amount of time so that you have more coverage in the beginning in case something

00:36:55.360 | happens then.

00:36:56.360 | That's just a little thing that I lean towards as well.

00:36:59.460 | All right.

00:37:00.460 | Last question.

00:37:01.460 | Who wants to go next?

00:37:02.460 | Hi, Joshua.

00:37:03.460 | Is it okay if I go?

00:37:04.460 | Go for it.

00:37:05.460 | I'm sorry, Brandon.

00:37:06.460 | Thank you again, Joshua, for everything.

00:37:07.460 | I just wanted to say I love your podcast.

00:37:08.460 | I have a question.

00:37:09.460 | Basically, my wife, at her work, she's been contributing about $15,000 a year in our

00:37:12.460 | fourth review.

00:37:13.460 | Lately, I've been looking at our overall finances and I'm wondering if you could

00:37:20.460 | share with us what you're looking at right now.

00:37:31.460 | I'm looking at our overall finances and it just seems like the way we have it right

00:37:33.140 | now, we have about $450,000 in our combined retirement account.

00:37:37.180 | Some of that is Roth.

00:37:38.180 | Some of that is traditional IRA.

00:37:40.260 | Then we also have almost $100,000 in cash.

00:37:43.740 | Whenever I run the numbers, it just seems like that just will be very excessive in our

00:37:49.980 | moderate payments that we're basically living off of.

00:37:55.380 | We live fairly frugally despite having three kids.

00:37:58.580 | Probably our expenses are, without the mortgage, it's about $38,000 a year.

00:38:03.220 | It just seems like if I project out what we have already tied up in our retirement accounts,

00:38:09.980 | that it just, to keep squirreling away in there, just doesn't seem to make sense rather

00:38:15.900 | than we have other priorities like maybe buying an investment house to basically diversify

00:38:20.820 | a bit there or rather than putting 529 accounts that are just dedicated to our kids, having

00:38:26.980 | something more flexible and also maybe having some money as a dry cotter or just save for

00:38:32.980 | a potential business for me since I'm going to leave my work soon.

00:38:37.180 | With all that in mind, my wife tried to basically stop contributing as much into her fourth

00:38:42.620 | rebate, but the investment advisor at her work, because she's at a nonprofit, he was

00:38:47.500 | kind of trying to talk her out of it and saying that he's never heard of anybody regretting

00:38:51.700 | putting too much into their 403B.

00:38:54.140 | I don't think he's seen our finances yet, but I'm meeting with him tomorrow.

00:38:57.380 | I just want to know where he might be coming from.

00:39:01.580 | I just want to make sure my wife is comfortable with the whole conversation too.

00:39:04.700 | Even though I am, just your thoughts on that and what we need to consider and any other

00:39:11.340 | opinion on it.

00:39:12.660 | Mad Fientist: Probably what would be the most helpful response is let me tell you what the

00:39:16.820 | job of most financial advisors is.

00:39:19.940 | This is where people get frustrated with the term "financial advisor."

00:39:25.940 | In general, so she's working at a 403B, what type of nonprofit institution is she

00:39:29.740 | working at?

00:39:30.740 | David Keefer: She's a nurse, so she works at a hospital.

00:39:34.140 | I guess the banking advisors, they basically take care of the fund there.

00:39:42.260 | Mad Fientist: Okay.

00:39:44.900 | The type of conversation that most financial advisors have with people is really, really

00:39:48.940 | boring and it's primarily based around trying to encourage people to save money.

00:39:54.800 | If you look at the statistics and look at the data, the majority of people simply don't

00:39:58.620 | save.

00:39:59.620 | They don't save much.

00:40:00.620 | They don't save much at all.

00:40:04.060 | We who are financial advisors, we've been trained to try to get people to save money

00:40:08.780 | and to try to get people to squirrel away as much as possible.

00:40:13.060 | The entire industry lives and breathes that.

00:40:17.440 | Is it for nefarious purposes?

00:40:19.620 | Well, there's a little bit of self-interest in it.

00:40:22.580 | The advisor is getting paid probably in a position like that where they're working

00:40:26.980 | with the nurses in a 403B program.

00:40:29.540 | They're partly probably getting paid maybe some salary or some base compensation and

00:40:34.540 | then partly some type of performance-based compensation.

00:40:36.900 | So there's a little bit of self-interest.

00:40:41.080 | Maybe that has an influence.

00:40:42.420 | I mean I've certainly been under that influence where you want people to fund your accounts.

00:40:48.940 | This is often a criticism of financial advisors.

00:40:51.940 | If you're managing money and you're getting paid based upon how much money is in the account,

00:40:56.120 | you want to manage as much money as possible.

00:40:58.300 | I think that is a legitimate potential conflict of interest.

00:41:02.760 | But my guess is more than that.

00:41:04.700 | It's just simply that we feel like it's the right thing to do.

00:41:09.180 | It's basically the crusade.

00:41:10.660 | It's the gospel that we preach to say you've got to save money because most people don't.

00:41:15.300 | So you've got an advisor who is spending all day every day meeting with people who are

00:41:21.260 | saving $5,000 into their accounts, who have account balances of $50,000 and they're accustomed

00:41:29.060 | to speaking to people in that circumstance.

00:41:31.280 | The type of family who is a young family with three children who has a half a million dollar

00:41:36.820 | net worth who's putting $15,000 per year into a 403B, you are in the top few percent of

00:41:43.980 | people in the United States in terms of wealth accumulation, assets, and financial planning.

00:41:48.660 | So this is not a normal situation that that financial advisor is facing.

00:41:54.300 | The next thing that you've got to pay attention to is that most people who are advisors in

00:41:58.500 | that type of capacity are not financial planners.

00:42:01.660 | They are, well, depending on how cynical you want to be, we'll just say they're financial

00:42:08.060 | advisors, they're account advisors.

00:42:10.460 | You could perhaps be so cynical as to say they're commissioned salespeople.

00:42:15.900 | That certainly can be the case.

00:42:18.060 | Most of the people I've met personally, they're not bad people.

00:42:22.940 | They're not trying to do anything nefarious.

00:42:25.700 | It's just the job that they've taken.

00:42:27.580 | So you're not dealing with someone as a representative of an account like that.

00:42:30.820 | You're not dealing with somebody who is a comprehensive financial planner who specializes

00:42:34.980 | in going out and helping people build out their whole financial plan.

00:42:39.340 | Most people who are financial advisors, who are with various firms, who are even, well,

00:42:47.660 | if they at least have a CFP certification, they probably can do a financial plan because

00:42:51.820 | they're required to do one to do that.

00:42:53.020 | But most people whose business card says financial advisor, they can't run a financial calculator.

00:42:56.860 | They can't build a plan.

00:42:58.420 | So you can ask them some questions, but I guess all that we would say would be that

00:43:04.980 | your best way to work with somebody in that capacity is not to ask financial planning

00:43:08.900 | questions but to ask specific plan-related questions.

00:43:13.140 | They'll be an expert at answering, "Here are the investment options that we feature in

00:43:16.380 | this plan."

00:43:17.420 | They'll be an expert at sharing with you what the fees are in the plan or how the accounts

00:43:22.900 | work or the different options or the matching.

00:43:25.740 | Those are the type of questions that that type of financial advisor can work with.

00:43:30.420 | So they really have never heard of anybody putting too much money into retirement because

00:43:33.900 | – I've never heard of anybody putting too much money into retirement really because

00:43:39.820 | we're not – the modern, I guess, financial independence culture that we're developing

00:43:45.020 | is not – this is not mainstream financial thought.

00:43:50.220 | So all that to say, I guess my answer to it is I wouldn't expect too much from that

00:43:54.740 | type of financial advisor.

00:43:56.980 | I've given presentations to rooms of financial advisors.

00:44:01.620 | I'll give the best example.

00:44:03.260 | In this little niche that I'm a part of, an 800-pound gorilla website like Mr. Money

00:44:09.420 | Mustache is very well known.

00:44:12.220 | I gave a presentation about savings rates to a room full of financial advisors, seasoned,

00:44:17.740 | experienced financial advisors, and I put Money Mustache's website up on the screen

00:44:23.100 | and I asked how many of them knew of it.

00:44:25.940 | Almost nobody had heard of it.

00:44:26.940 | I think there was one person in the room who had heard of it.

00:44:29.500 | So you've got to recognize there's a major disconnect in conversation between mainstream

00:44:34.700 | financial advice versus this niche, early retirement, aggressive savings, financial

00:44:39.200 | independence, people taking control of their lives and control of their financial futures,

00:44:44.140 | and they speak different languages.

00:44:45.940 | That's why I'm here to try to translate the two over.

00:44:51.380 | You want to ask a more specific question than that or is that, I guess, a place to start?

00:44:54.820 | No, that's a good place to start.

00:44:57.900 | I guess I'm coming from it too is that I think I've heard you talk about when you

00:45:02.220 | started your business, you had kind of – it was kind of hard to get some of that liquid

00:45:07.620 | capital and I perceive myself being in that situation maybe in a year or two.

00:45:13.220 | And so I think that's part of it.

00:45:15.180 | So I don't know if you wanted to speak to that or I don't remember if that was specifically

00:45:19.580 | with your down payment of your house only or whether that was also your retirement account

00:45:23.260 | that you were referring to or I don't know if you could speak to that.

00:45:26.220 | Sure.

00:45:27.220 | In hindsight, knowing what I now know, if I were to do it all over again, for me, and

00:45:32.500 | I'm emphasizing the for me because I have an entrepreneurial bent, because I know what

00:45:36.740 | I want because I'm moving in that direction, I probably would never have even contributed

00:45:42.580 | to tax-deferred accounts in the first place.

00:45:47.300 | I always contributed to Roth IRAs.

00:45:49.420 | I did have some pension plans but I always contributed to Roth IRAs.

00:45:52.380 | I didn't spend a long time in the corporate environment where I was contributing to a

00:45:56.740 | 401(k).

00:45:58.260 | And so would I have still funded the Roth IRAs?

00:46:00.580 | Maybe.

00:46:01.580 | But I guess in hindsight, I would have put a lot less money behind bars and I would have

00:46:05.740 | kept a lot more where I could touch it and where I could use it.

00:46:09.260 | So that's my answer.

00:46:11.580 | Now for you, I'll tell you, if you are planning on leaving a job, if you are planning on building

00:46:17.140 | up a side business or something like that, I don't believe you'll regret having cash

00:46:22.260 | available.

00:46:24.260 | There's no reason to go crazy and start cashing out retirement accounts.

00:46:28.180 | I'm not there.

00:46:29.180 | A lot of people are.

00:46:30.180 | I'm not there.

00:46:31.180 | But I do think that you'll find the capital much more useful when it's sitting in a bank

00:46:36.740 | account and you have access to it.

00:46:38.700 | It'll bring you more safety in your business.

00:46:41.140 | It'll bring you more cushion.

00:46:42.660 | It'll bring you more peace and it'll give you more options and more ideas.

00:46:48.060 | And it was interesting in the patron, the regular Facebook group, there were several

00:46:55.500 | listeners who commented that after my sharing on last week's show about just the limitations

00:47:01.700 | of money and retirement accounts, that they had made similar choices.

00:47:08.580 | I try to speak very clearly and honestly and truthfully and transparently about what I

00:47:13.340 | believe and why and just leave things where they are.

00:47:16.220 | I tell you, I even feel like it's hard because I go against the orthodox of most of the mainstream

00:47:21.740 | financial planning profession.

00:47:23.440 | But after seeing it at this point, I kind of feel like I was – I guess I was – I

00:47:28.340 | feel like I – I don't know if I was misled or what, but I just feel like the whole mainstream

00:47:35.120 | financial advice industry is not working well for most people.

00:47:38.700 | Most people are not becoming wealthy.

00:47:40.800 | When I look at who is wealthy, it has nothing to do with the 401(k)s.

00:47:43.720 | And so I've made the steps and the decisions to walk away and to adjust things going forward.

00:47:48.640 | Check back in 10 years and I'll tell you how things are going.

00:47:51.780 | But so far, they're going well and if you have a plan of starting a business, yes.

00:47:58.320 | Diminish things at least just down to the match.

00:48:00.080 | I'd take the matching dollars probably if they still offer the match.

00:48:03.340 | Diminish things down.

00:48:04.440 | Do pay attention to your tax planning.

00:48:06.260 | Run your tax brackets.

00:48:07.260 | I don't want to be foolish.

00:48:08.260 | I want to run some numbers.

00:48:09.940 | If you're in a situation where you have too high incomes and you can shelter some of the

00:48:13.120 | money there temporarily over the next couple of years, you need to take those things into

00:48:17.500 | account because you can save at your highest marginal tax bracket.

00:48:21.380 | If you're going to go to a low income situation in the future, so do some good planning.

00:48:27.000 | But roundabout way of saying, I'm not too worried about diminishing retirement contributions.

00:48:34.080 | Let's run a quick math just to see.

00:48:36.200 | Ballpark, how old are you guys?

00:48:39.240 | 37.

00:48:40.240 | Okay.

00:48:41.240 | So let's just say, is the money that's in the 401(k) and retirement accounts, is that

00:48:48.160 | money generally intended for traditional retirement age opportunities?

00:48:52.280 | Yeah, I think so.

00:48:55.200 | I think because she's going to get a pension basically.

00:48:59.080 | She has basically, you could consider her pension vested at like 7,000 right now.

00:49:04.360 | She loves her job, so she's going to continue working for another, I don't know, it could

00:49:07.480 | be another 20 years.

00:49:08.480 | And then if she does that, then she gets 20% of her salary.

00:49:12.960 | So she could get like $23,000 a year from that if that continues, which seems likely

00:49:16.760 | to me, but you never know.

00:49:18.720 | So the only thing guaranteed is I think we have about 7,000, well, it's not guaranteed,

00:49:23.360 | but 7,000 that she's vested in her pension.

00:49:26.560 | And if I quit my job today, I think I've run the calculation on Social Security that I

00:49:30.440 | would get in about 11,000 a year.

00:49:32.720 | And her, maybe about the same, but if she quit, but she's probably going to continue

00:49:35.720 | working, so probably closer to 30.

00:49:37.980 | And so that by itself could pay for our living expenses in retirement.

00:49:42.360 | So it's kind of a fail-safe to even have the retirement account as it is now.

00:49:49.080 | But yeah, so I don't know if that answered your question.

00:49:52.040 | So let's punch this into a calculator, $450,000 present value.

00:49:57.080 | Let's just say 25 years, that would take you up to 62.

00:49:59.800 | So $450,000 present value, 25 years.

00:50:04.760 | Let's say you get, let's go with the, what rate of return would you feel comfortable

00:50:09.160 | using on this projection?

00:50:12.680 | I don't know, kind of a 5.9, I guess, you know, around there.

00:50:17.600 | So let's use a 6% annual rate of return, net of taxes, net of fees.

00:50:22.640 | That's $1.9 million would be the projected value of that account at 62.

00:50:27.960 | So you can project that and you can say, do I feel that that would be adequate given my

00:50:34.640 | other sources?

00:50:35.640 | Do I feel that that would be adequate where I'm not taking a huge risk by going ahead

00:50:39.560 | and diverting my attention elsewhere?

00:50:41.960 | I mean a $2 million account under relatively conservative assumptions there, $2 million

00:50:48.800 | account is nothing to sneeze at.

00:50:51.320 | So you'll have to take it beyond that with your own individual personal financial planning.

00:50:55.320 | It's more than I can do on the call here.

00:50:57.520 | But I would look at that and I would say 37 years old, half a million bucks.

00:51:00.520 | If you've got some other uses for the money, I say go for it.

00:51:04.200 | That would be how I would handle it.

00:51:05.800 | All right, next question.

00:51:06.800 | Hi.

00:51:07.800 | Hey, Joshua.

00:51:08.800 | It's Brandon.

00:51:09.800 | Let's go with Brandon.

00:51:10.800 | Let's, yeah, Brandon, you go first and then the other one.

00:51:11.800 | Okay.

00:51:12.800 | I just have a quick question.

00:51:13.800 | Going back to real estate a little bit, in your experience in going to that Schwab conference,

00:51:26.040 | what are the general terms that you get with someone when you're doing like a private financing

00:51:31.080 | deal?

00:51:32.080 | Like you're going to finance a house that you're going to buy or vice versa.

00:51:35.480 | What sort of terms do you see with that?

00:51:37.760 | You mean specific numbers or dollar amounts?

00:51:40.400 | Yeah, like, yeah, specific like rates of interest and specific time limit.

00:51:44.400 | Do you see like people doing 30 year loans or 10 year loans?

00:51:48.240 | I don't know what the industry average is.

00:51:50.040 | What would be a good starting point to negotiate?

00:51:56.560 | I can't answer the generalized question.

00:51:59.660 | One thing that Schwab makes a point of, and he has replaced this rule, but in the past

00:52:04.760 | talked about don't pay anything more than 10% interest rate.

00:52:09.600 | And so the only place that you could get a real general answer to that question would

00:52:13.920 | be if you were working with somebody like a professional hard money lender.

00:52:17.940 | And I think like here in my local area, I got a friend of mine who is lending money

00:52:22.800 | out right now in that capacity.

00:52:26.080 | I think he said he's lending money at 12% right now.

00:52:30.240 | So that tend to – I would guess if you were to do a survey of hard money lenders there

00:52:35.280 | in your area, you're probably in that 9, 10, 11, 12% range is what they're looking

00:52:40.840 | for to lend you money under those terms.

00:52:44.440 | My guess would be that if Schwab were answering that question, he would – the answer would

00:52:53.360 | not be to focus on the general number, but it would be to put together the deal that

00:52:57.080 | works.

00:52:58.080 | So what he makes a point of and I think is good is you find the solution – you find

00:53:03.200 | what somebody wants and needs and you put together a deal that works.

00:53:06.960 | So let's say that we were talking – he gave a few examples that he's done.

00:53:12.880 | But let's say that you have somebody who's working as a dentist or a doctor or some other

00:53:18.520 | high-income profession and you go to them with a deal and they would like to buy real

00:53:24.400 | estate but they don't have the time to buy real estate.

00:53:26.400 | They're busy.

00:53:27.400 | They don't have the time to be out knocking on doors.

00:53:30.120 | So you can go to somebody like that and you can write up a partnership agreement if you

00:53:33.600 | find the deal and you find the property and they may fund the whole thing and you just

00:53:37.600 | simply split the profits on the back end.

00:53:39.320 | You don't have to pay any stated interest rate currently.

00:53:44.840 | Or there would be a number of different ways to put a deal together.

00:53:49.440 | So I think the better answer to the question rather than focusing on general terms is to

00:53:53.040 | say, "What is the interest that somebody has?

00:53:55.720 | Does somebody need current income?"

00:53:58.000 | If you have somebody like a hard money lender, they're usually focused on the current return

00:54:02.240 | from that asset and they're going to be looking for a current rate of return, a current

00:54:10.720 | income.

00:54:11.720 | But if you can finance it with somebody who doesn't necessarily need that current income,

00:54:16.200 | you can maybe work out a different type of deal.

00:54:18.640 | So I could go to people here in my area and if I wanted to put together deals and have

00:54:23.680 | people use their 401(k) money to invest in my real estate company and I could put together

00:54:28.320 | some contracts that to them, they would lend me money and let's say I offer – if I were

00:54:32.340 | to go out today and offer a guaranteed seven, six or seven percent rate of return to somebody

00:54:38.920 | for money in their 401(k), current income payment secured by local real estate, there

00:54:44.360 | would be a lot of people who after the frustrations of a volatile stock market, there would be

00:54:48.680 | a lot of people who would take that deal.

00:54:50.840 | So I would say it's more a matter of looking as with any negotiation, trying to figure

00:54:55.120 | out what are the interests of the other person and how can I put together a deal that's

00:54:59.320 | going to solve their interests in a way that's best for all of us, not about what are the

00:55:03.760 | exact terms.

00:55:04.760 | Right.

00:55:05.760 | So maybe I was confused.

00:55:06.760 | So if I wanted to buy a house as a rental that someone's selling, instead of going

00:55:12.120 | to the person that's selling the house and kind of coming up with a deal with them and

00:55:16.600 | saying, "Hey, I'll give you 10 percent down if you'll finance the rest on these

00:55:20.040 | terms," you're actually using someone else's money like portfolio as a middleman

00:55:27.160 | in that process.

00:55:28.160 | Is that what you're saying?

00:55:29.160 | There would be a number of different ways and probably what would be the best is maybe

00:55:32.560 | I should get Shah back on and maybe collect some real estate questions and talk him through.

00:55:38.960 | But it's all going to depend on the individual scenario.

00:55:43.120 | What you're looking for when you're looking for owner financing is usually trying to solve

00:55:47.800 | somebody's problem for them.

00:55:49.840 | And so many times what you're looking for is a house that's empty but that has debt

00:55:53.360 | on it would be ideal.

00:55:55.280 | And what you're trying to do is to take the house off of their hands and maybe just assume

00:56:00.240 | their mortgage.

00:56:01.760 | That would be one scenario that can work really well.

00:56:03.840 | Now some mortgages have a clause in them that they're not assumable, but even though that's

00:56:09.640 | the case, at least Shah taught in the class and we talked about, practically you can still

00:56:14.580 | do it even knowing that that's a risk because practically the banks are not going to cause

00:56:19.640 | any problems.

00:56:20.880 | So if you have a seller who is just underwater and they need some relief on their payments,

00:56:28.120 | then you can take over the house subject to their existing loans.

00:56:34.240 | So it's not about all doing it with investors.

00:56:38.680 | It's a matter of finding a situation where you can solve somebody's problem based upon

00:56:44.000 | whatever debt is on the house.

00:56:47.080 | Probably – go ahead.

00:56:48.080 | Well, I guess from a seller's point of view, I own two properties and just thinking about

00:56:53.760 | it for our own personal situation, it makes sense that we're ever going to sell either

00:56:57.680 | of those properties as long as we don't need the capital for any other business venture

00:57:03.240 | to own or finance it to whoever buys it and collect the payment plus the interest for

00:57:08.440 | the next 20 or 30 years.

00:57:10.120 | Does that make sense?

00:57:11.120 | Exactly.

00:57:12.120 | And that's one of the primary areas that John Schaub encouraged the students to look for

00:57:17.560 | is if you're looking for a property, one great place for you to find houses is to buy

00:57:24.640 | them from a retiring investor.

00:57:27.480 | And the retiring investor, that deal will work exactly.

00:57:31.280 | I know a couple of local real estate investors here in my area, mid-60s, same type of thing.

00:57:35.920 | They're wanting to slow down and pull back and they just want to get rid of some of their

00:57:39.040 | properties and they are very comfortable selling their properties on terms to you or to me.

00:57:45.160 | They would be very comfortable doing that because they know if something happens, they

00:57:48.720 | can just go ahead and either renegotiate the deal or take the house back.

00:57:52.040 | It solves a problem for them.

00:57:53.240 | It gives them income for retirement.

00:57:54.840 | It solves a problem for me.

00:57:56.440 | It's a win-win across the board.

00:57:57.840 | Yeah, and it takes their liability away from having to do maintenance on the house.

00:58:01.240 | They essentially get to keep renting it for a certain amount of time for a certain profit.

00:58:05.680 | Exactly.

00:58:06.680 | Okay, thanks.

00:58:07.680 | My other question was, what are your plans with the Patreon campaign?

00:58:10.520 | Are you ready to disclose that yet?

00:58:13.480 | Yeah, I'll go ahead and I'll just talk about it here.

00:58:17.560 | I've been struggling with it.

00:58:19.960 | This show is going out on Friday.

00:58:20.960 | I've only released two shows this week and it's been a difficult last couple of weeks

00:58:25.120 | for me to try to figure out what's the next step?

00:58:28.200 | How do I take things forward with radical personal finance?

00:58:37.160 | Things have worked well, but I've reached the limits of my capacity and I've got to

00:58:42.120 | build the organization behind me, but knowing how to do that is a challenge in this space.

00:58:49.120 | I really want to build more value in the Patreon campaign, but what I've discovered is that

00:58:54.000 | even just basically managing additional things, I keep dropping the ball as far as managing

00:59:00.940 | the things that I want to manage.

00:59:02.240 | The only thing I've successfully been able to continually do is keep the shows coming

00:59:06.920 | out, but what's happened is I haven't been able to build the time behind the scenes for

00:59:10.920 | me to build the other products and services.

00:59:15.060 | What I intend to do for the Patreon campaign is I think I'm going to lower the prices for

00:59:19.600 | – the feedback that I've gotten is the most valuable thing that people really appreciate

00:59:23.880 | is the Facebook group.

00:59:25.400 | There's just an awesome community of men and women there in the Facebook group answering

00:59:29.440 | questions, interacting with each other.

00:59:31.880 | I think it would be beneficial to have more people there, and so I think I'm going to

00:59:35.280 | lower the price of that level.

00:59:37.680 | I'm removing the top tier mastermind option because – well, I'm removing that top tier

00:59:44.920 | and I'm probably going to lower down the $25 level.

00:59:48.160 | What I haven't figured out how to do is what bonus or benefit to offer to people above

00:59:53.680 | – if I lower the price on the Facebook group, I haven't figured out what bonus or benefit

00:59:58.760 | to offer people at a higher level that I can deliver on.

01:00:03.800 | That's why I haven't quite made the changes on the website.

01:00:06.200 | I'm about ready to do it, but that's what I'm thinking.

01:00:09.280 | I've struggled with regard to the advertising.

01:00:13.080 | Advertising has helped me to bring in more income, but I just don't really like doing

01:00:16.760 | it and I don't – I try to do a good job with the ads and I've chosen the advertisers

01:00:22.820 | very carefully.

01:00:23.820 | They've all been companies and services that I really feel are very valuable for people,

01:00:29.720 | but at the end of the day, my best profit potential is for me to create more products

01:00:33.800 | or courses that are carefully – very, very rich with content and concise.

01:00:42.000 | That's what I need to spend my time doing.

01:00:44.200 | I'm going to pull back on the frequency of the shows a little bit so that I can create

01:00:48.880 | more products and courses.

01:00:50.400 | I'm going to try to get more energy behind the Patreon campaign somehow, especially with

01:00:56.280 | the Facebook group.

01:00:57.920 | I think these calls are going to – my hope is that these calls will help people to participate.

01:01:02.200 | I intend to offer these only for patrons.

01:01:05.480 | Right now, I've opened it up to all patrons, but I think I'm going to open it up to $5

01:01:08.600 | and $10 patrons just to ask questions on these Q&A calls.

01:01:12.240 | Then I'm going to pull back a little bit on the amount of content that I'm creating

01:01:15.560 | on the podcast so that I can do more – so I can get some products and some things to

01:01:20.680 | sell because that's where my highest profit margins are going to come from and I need

01:01:24.160 | to help the show be more profitable so I can expand and hire the help that I need to manage

01:01:30.520 | more and more of the things behind the scenes.

01:01:33.320 | I wasn't really quite prepared to answer the question, but hey, that is where it is

01:01:36.000 | off the cuff as of 2 p.m. on February the 11th.

01:01:39.160 | That's where I'm at.

01:01:43.160 | All right.

01:01:46.280 | Let's go on.

01:01:47.280 | Next question.

01:01:48.280 | Hi.

01:01:49.280 | I'm going to stick with real estate on this question.

01:01:52.280 | I currently have six houses and they're all in my name.

01:01:55.200 | I was curious what you're going to do with your properties, if you're going to put

01:01:58.680 | them in an LLC or in a corporation or keep them in your name?

01:02:03.160 | I'm not qualified to answer the question professionally.

01:02:07.800 | Again, it's interesting how much interest there's been in real estate and I'm a

01:02:11.800 | total novice on this area.

01:02:14.440 | In the beginning, I will keep them all in my name because I think there are some benefits

01:02:20.060 | to that and I think the risk of doing that is generally overstated.

01:02:26.080 | For the initial deals, as I learn how to put together the deals here in my area, I will

01:02:31.240 | put them in my name.

01:02:34.440 | As I grow and as my portfolio becomes larger, then I will start to establish some different

01:02:41.800 | entities.

01:02:43.240 | Also, depending on the deal, it's possible that I'll put something into a qualified

01:02:55.520 | account of some kind.

01:02:57.600 | I don't mind owning some real estate inside a Roth IRA if I do that appropriately.

01:03:04.120 | It's also possible that if I do some deals with investors that we would put those into

01:03:08.700 | an entity of some kind.

01:03:12.360 | My best opinion is that there are advantages and disadvantages to every structure.

01:03:20.560 | The advantage and disadvantage is going to change depending on where you go.

01:03:24.380 | The best example I could give that I am actually knowledgeable about would be with regard to

01:03:29.880 | business entity selection.

01:03:31.560 | I run Radical Personal Finance currently as a sole proprietorship and I do it intentionally

01:03:37.240 | because I get a lot of benefits from a sole proprietorship that I wouldn't get if I put

01:03:41.560 | it into an LLC or into an S corporation.

01:03:44.960 | A lot of times people say, "Well, you should always just put a business into an S corporation."

01:03:50.200 | There are advantages but there are also disadvantages to an S corporation.

01:03:53.040 | If I built Radical Personal Finance first as a sole proprietorship, I will transition

01:03:59.440 | it very soon into a business entity.

01:04:04.060 | When I do that, I'll lose one set of advantages but gain another set of advantages.

01:04:08.960 | I believe it's the same with real estate.

01:04:11.240 | Each thing that you do has benefits and each thing that you do has disadvantages and restrictions.

01:04:18.680 | Is that helpful?

01:04:23.320 | Sure.

01:04:24.320 | Good luck in your purchases.

01:04:27.120 | I think, and this is for me, just the ease of buying and selling when you're trying to

01:04:31.600 | close quickly and just write a check.

01:04:33.880 | At this point, I don't want to get involved with establishing an entity in the initial

01:04:40.600 | stages, but I think it makes sense down the road.

01:04:43.360 | Best I got.

01:04:44.360 | Mine's a little tricky because I have six houses but they're in three different states.

01:04:48.040 | If I did LLCs, I think I'd have to have one in each state.

01:04:52.800 | That's a specialty area where I have no idea how that works beyond me at this point.

01:04:58.000 | All right, next question.

01:04:59.000 | I'll take one more question here on today's call.

01:05:01.000 | I want to go, Mohamed, are you still on the show?

01:05:04.400 | You wanted to ask a question.

01:05:05.400 | Yeah, I would love to ask a question.

01:05:08.760 | My question is, is it worthwhile for me to pick up any extra shifts for extra income?

01:05:14.200 | My background is I'm 37.

01:05:15.840 | I have no student loans.

01:05:16.840 | I paid those all off.

01:05:17.840 | I have a small condo that I paid off.

01:05:21.040 | I'm planning to be financially independent in about three years.

01:05:27.120 | What would you be giving up by picking up extra shifts?

01:05:32.600 | Free time, whatever it is that I do with my free time, either go to the gym or hang out

01:05:37.280 | at a coffee shop, library, bookstore.

01:05:38.280 | I don't have a family, so I'm single.

01:05:42.320 | Pretty much just be social time or relaxing time.

01:05:45.920 | Would you feel greatly hindered or hurt or feel like you've given up something very important

01:05:50.720 | if you were to have less free time in exchange for more money?

01:05:55.440 | Probably not.

01:05:56.440 | I mean, I think I could shuffle things around a little bit, try to have a better regimen

01:06:00.440 | to prep food on time and have a little bit more time early in the day maybe to go to

01:06:05.760 | the gym.

01:06:10.040 | I guess for me, the question of once you reach a certain point, what you're always trying

01:06:15.640 | to figure out is what is the opportunity cost of this decision?

01:06:18.920 | What am I giving up by doing this?

01:06:21.360 | So if there's something that were very important to you, and I'll just give my example.

01:06:25.640 | We're in different situations.

01:06:27.000 | But for me, if I were working a lot of hours as a physician, I'm away from the home, and

01:06:31.880 | now I'm going to say I'm going to pick up extra shifts, if that took me away from something

01:06:36.680 | that were very important, time with my kids, being able to put them in bed, well, I would

01:06:41.640 | be slow to pay that cost because at this stage of my life, those things are more important

01:06:46.680 | to me.

01:06:47.680 | If you're just comparing it, however, to free time, I don't personally – me personally,

01:06:51.520 | I don't take or create a lot of free time.

01:06:54.480 | Most of my time is pretty given to things.

01:06:56.320 | So if it's just, "Well, I'm going to sit around or do something that's not so important

01:06:59.360 | to me," then I don't see any reason not to put the work in.

01:07:02.160 | It could help you potentially to get closer to financial independence in – maybe it's

01:07:07.880 | there in two years.

01:07:09.240 | And then what are you going to do at that point in time?

01:07:12.440 | So if there's something really compelling and you can shorten out the process to two

01:07:15.840 | years – I like to work hard and work hard in shifts.

01:07:20.080 | It works well for my personality.

01:07:21.560 | I can really pour myself into something for a short period of time.

01:07:25.440 | So you obviously have to be careful to avoid burning yourself out.

01:07:28.200 | Pay attention to your health.

01:07:29.280 | Pay attention to how you're feeling and those things.

01:07:31.640 | But as long as you value the money more than what you value what you're giving up, I don't

01:07:36.520 | see any reason not to, but that's a very subjective decision.

01:07:40.920 | Any more comments?

01:07:41.920 | Is that helpful, Mohamed?

01:07:42.920 | Yeah, that's actually pretty helpful.

01:07:45.360 | Thank you.

01:07:47.080 | Opportunity cost is the greatest undiscussed – it's the biggest undiscussed thing that

01:07:54.800 | we have in our – we don't consider it.

01:07:58.600 | And so we need to constantly be thinking about opportunity cost.

01:08:02.440 | What am I giving up?

01:08:03.440 | And that opportunity cost will change at different points in time.

01:08:07.440 | And so it's okay for one phase to say I'm working right now.

01:08:11.200 | I'm working like crazy and this is important to me.

01:08:13.760 | And it's okay at another phase to say I'm not ready to work at this point in time.

01:08:21.360 | There's no external scorecard.

01:08:23.080 | It's got to be based upon our own internal values.

01:08:26.680 | And I find that challenging a lot of times because I look at other people who do more

01:08:30.640 | than I do or who make more money than I do or who have other things and I often find

01:08:35.040 | it easy to compare myself to other people.

01:08:37.200 | I have to constantly remind myself, "Joshua, they share different values.

01:08:40.360 | They have a different vision for their life.

01:08:42.240 | They have different goals.

01:08:43.640 | Stay focused on your values and your goals."

01:08:48.060 | So if we consider that, I think we can make better choices.

01:08:52.940 | Thank you all for calling in on the call today.

01:08:55.880 | I hope that these answers have been useful and I hope that you'll check back next week

01:08:59.960 | and we'll do this call again next week.

01:09:02.240 | I really enjoy interacting with you guys.

01:09:04.400 | I just want to say, however, I do my best to give you an answer, but don't take what

01:09:11.000 | I have to say as gospel truth.

01:09:13.200 | You got to take it and test it, weigh it out, research it.

01:09:16.680 | If you found any area in which I've been wrong today or I've said something that wasn't

01:09:21.360 | correct, I'm happy to learn about that.

01:09:22.760 | Feel free to come by the blog post for today's show and let me know.

01:09:25.760 | And if any of you listeners to this show have feedback or comments that you think will be

01:09:31.040 | helpful for any of these questions, please make sure to come by the blog post for today's

01:09:36.600 | show.

01:09:37.600 | Share that information on the blog post so that the question can be more fully answered.

01:09:43.000 | And thank you all for calling in.

01:09:45.120 | Are you ready to make your next pro basketball, football, hockey, concert, or live event unforgettable?

01:09:50.800 | Let Sweet Hop take your game to the next level.

01:09:53.320 | Sweet Hop is an online marketplace curating the best premium tickets at stadiums, arenas,

01:09:58.400 | and amphitheaters nationwide.

01:10:00.040 | Sweet Hop's online marketplace makes it easy to browse and book the best seats.

01:10:04.680 | With no hidden fees and a 100% purchase guarantee, you can feel confident when you book your

01:10:09.420 | premium LA tickets with Sweet Hop.

01:10:11.640 | Visit suitehop.com today.

RPF0294-Friday_QA