E144: Biden targets Elon, BRICS challenges the West, Tiger hit piece & more

00:00:00.000 | You want to see something?

00:00:01.000 | Look at my eyes.

00:00:02.280 | Look at his eyes.

00:00:04.240 | It's fucking contagion over here.

00:00:05.760 | Broski, what happened?

00:00:06.520 | You have conjunctivitis.

00:00:07.600 | Yeah. Double I got it from my

00:00:09.440 | daughter. He got something in his

00:00:11.040 | eye. And then I got this like

00:00:11.960 | fucking allergic reaction to it.

00:00:13.480 | It is. I'm just messed up, dude,

00:00:15.080 | for two days now. I haven't been

00:00:16.180 | able to see.

00:00:16.720 | OK, well, let me tell you about

00:00:17.960 | this weekend, which was

00:00:19.960 | the most motherfucking exhausting

00:00:21.400 | weekend of my life.

00:00:22.200 | I mean, where do I even

00:00:24.100 | start? OK, here's here's where I

00:00:25.320 | start. So I fucking fly home

00:00:27.360 | for mentally from Italy.

00:00:29.720 | Get back in the air and thirty

00:00:30.920 | five thousand feet.

00:00:31.920 | I decide to troll the mids.

00:00:33.520 | Oh no. We'll talk about that

00:00:35.900 | later. But anyways, I'm sitting

00:00:37.660 | a beautifully chilled white

00:00:39.200 | burgundy by trolling the mids.

00:00:40.860 | You mean that you were occupying

00:00:42.480 | their airspace,

00:00:43.560 | flying at the level of commercial

00:00:46.200 | jets to fly by.

00:00:47.420 | It's a forty five thousand feet.

00:00:48.700 | I said a forty five thousand feet.

00:00:50.160 | I went down where the public

00:00:51.860 | airlines fly. And I was like,

00:00:53.120 | blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:00:54.020 | Made me came back.

00:00:58.920 | Let your winners ride

00:01:00.120 | Rain Man, David Sack.

00:01:02.960 | And it's said we open sources

00:01:07.480 | to the fans and they've just gone

00:01:09.000 | crazy.

00:01:10.000 | We know.

00:01:11.800 | I land in L.A.

00:01:15.740 | and I go straight

00:01:17.040 | house.

00:01:18.380 | I land it like, you know, I get

00:01:19.900 | there like one thirty or two thirty

00:01:21.480 | or something, three o'clock,

00:01:22.340 | something on there in the morning.

00:01:23.780 | I take it in the afternoon, take an

00:01:25.300 | ice bath and boom, we start

00:01:27.180 | playing at four o'clock.

00:01:28.300 | OK, we start playing for this.

00:01:29.480 | That is not a big deal.

00:01:30.360 | It's like one day of poker.

00:01:31.560 | We play poker.

00:01:32.320 | We finish at like three or four in

00:01:33.720 | the morning. We're exhausted.

00:01:34.720 | Kevin shows up in a wheelchair

00:01:36.360 | because he had pulled his

00:01:38.120 | fucking abdomen.

00:01:39.400 | Kevin Hart, Kevin Hart in a race

00:01:41.380 | with Stephen Ridley hit a 40 yard

00:01:43.000 | dash with Stephen

00:01:44.000 | pulled off his muscles like

00:01:46.760 | I think you need a 40 inch

00:01:48.480 | dash if it was Kevin Hart.

00:01:49.800 | That's a 40 inch dash.

00:01:51.160 | Anyways, Kev, Kev pulls all these

00:01:52.800 | muscles, more legs, door in the car

00:01:54.480 | opens and wheelchair

00:01:55.760 | comes, wheels himself

00:01:57.560 | to the table.

00:01:58.560 | And so that was the beginning.

00:02:01.160 | I was like, this is like this is an

00:02:02.540 | odd way to start poker.

00:02:03.680 | We play till four in the morning,

00:02:05.540 | go to bed, wake

00:02:07.460 | up, do our thing,

00:02:09.120 | start the game again Thursday at

00:02:11.100 | four.

00:02:12.100 | OK, we play again

00:02:14.460 | till fucking three or four in the

00:02:15.540 | morning.

00:02:16.540 | Wake up, we go to Burbank at 10 and

00:02:18.560 | we fly to Porto Vallarta for

00:02:19.780 | bachelor party. It's unbelievable.

00:02:22.620 | OK, 10 bedrooms, huge

00:02:24.500 | compound on the beach, the whole

00:02:26.180 | nine yards.

00:02:27.800 | We start gambling on the plane.

00:02:29.360 | I just want you guys to know that we

00:02:31.940 | slept nine hours and four days

00:02:33.800 | and we just kept playing and playing

00:02:37.320 | and playing at one point said,

00:02:39.320 | and this is exactly how the

00:02:40.440 | interaction with said, hey,

00:02:42.180 | guys, maybe we should go to the

00:02:43.780 | St. Regis for it.

00:02:45.280 | And then as soon as he's about to say

00:02:46.720 | dinner, I was like, shut up, keep

00:02:48.460 | playing.

00:02:49.480 | The point is that we played

00:02:52.200 | from the plane in

00:02:53.680 | the car, we played on an app,

00:02:56.240 | then we played in the house.

00:02:57.440 | The food was served buffet style.

00:02:59.440 | It all decorum just

00:03:00.840 | went away. We didn't do anything.

00:03:03.520 | We didn't leave that house.

00:03:04.760 | We didn't walk on the beach.

00:03:05.800 | We didn't fucking nothing.

00:03:07.200 | You didn't put your feet in the

00:03:08.180 | ocean.

00:03:08.940 | I played until

00:03:09.940 | I landed in Moffitt on

00:03:12.840 | Monday afternoon.

00:03:13.840 | Can you fucking believe it?

00:03:16.160 | It's so it's like almost like, you

00:03:17.400 | know, six days straight of

00:03:19.180 | poker. I will say this.

00:03:20.240 | It's an incredible house.

00:03:22.000 | The food was incredible.

00:03:23.160 | I really wish I could have seen more

00:03:24.720 | than my bedroom and the poker table.

00:03:26.280 | I wish I could tell you that the

00:03:29.680 | Pacific Ocean was nice.

00:03:31.280 | I have no fucking idea.

00:03:32.720 | You put in a bucket.

00:03:33.880 | You can even see the bathrooms in

00:03:34.960 | this house.

00:03:35.960 | No, I had the doors open

00:03:38.200 | so that I could run to my room and

00:03:39.740 | pee and come back.

00:03:40.560 | I mean, it was a waste time.

00:03:42.160 | You know, it was the most D.

00:03:44.360 | Jen weekend I've ever been a part

00:03:45.980 | of. And then all of us, by the way,

00:03:47.640 | we're so exhausted.

00:03:48.640 | We slept for fucking 10 hours a day

00:03:50.680 | for the like the last three days.

00:03:51.940 | Oh, and by the way, so smart.

00:03:53.920 | You know, you think it's a bachelor

00:03:55.080 | party. It's like there'll be girls

00:03:56.240 | or nothing.

00:03:57.160 | Not even the housekeepers were

00:03:58.560 | women. Everybody was mad.

00:03:59.960 | No distractions.

00:04:02.240 | Literally no distraction.

00:04:04.280 | It's just all dudes, dudes, cleaning

00:04:06.480 | the house, dudes cooking, dudes,

00:04:07.960 | dudes doing this, dudes.

00:04:09.200 | Our one attempt to go off site to

00:04:11.740 | go to a dinner was like, no,

00:04:13.160 | sit down.

00:04:14.320 | The best. He's the best.

00:04:15.320 | That should pay for some tequila

00:04:16.700 | research.

00:04:17.600 | He's the best.

00:04:18.460 | My Lord. I just want to I don't

00:04:20.280 | want to make this into tequila

00:04:21.240 | part two, but my email is filled

00:04:23.480 | with 8000 word tequila

00:04:26.040 | missives and overviews from

00:04:28.800 | Friedberg and every tequila

00:04:30.260 | producer in the world.

00:04:31.280 | And my Twitter, my

00:04:32.280 | axe is filled with posts

00:04:35.200 | about Chabot's man in the arena

00:04:36.680 | comments. They have set off

00:04:37.920 | an absolute fury

00:04:40.120 | as Chamath was alluding

00:04:42.160 | to. So the man in the arena tweet.

00:04:43.880 | I don't know the timestamp here.

00:04:45.960 | It looks like 1022 a.m.

00:04:47.920 | I don't know what that is.

00:04:49.880 | Italian time. But Chamath decided

00:04:51.560 | to say, I'm in the arena trying

00:04:52.840 | stuff. Some will work, some

00:04:54.040 | wound, but always learning.

00:04:55.200 | You're anonymous and afraid of

00:04:57.040 | your own shadow. Enjoy the

00:04:58.200 | sidelines. And this, of course,

00:04:59.160 | was to somebody who is

00:05:00.640 | criticizing a SPAC or

00:05:02.400 | something. And I think this

00:05:03.840 | person had eight followers.

00:05:05.280 | And let's just go through the

00:05:06.800 | memes here. Here, somebody with

00:05:08.440 | the AI revolution has made a

00:05:10.200 | Chamath version of Gladiator,

00:05:12.160 | who is Russell Crowe and

00:05:14.200 | Chamath's DNA being mixed.

00:05:16.000 | Friedberg, I didn't know this

00:05:17.360 | was possible in DNA today, but

00:05:19.200 | I guess there is a new

00:05:21.200 | actor storming Hollywood and

00:05:22.960 | it's Chamath Crowe. It's

00:05:25.800 | Russell Polly hoppity. Beautiful.

00:05:27.920 | I mean, what a great job that

00:05:29.320 | is. It looks like you. So great

00:05:31.840 | job to whatever mids did that

00:05:33.720 | in whatever mid software.

00:05:35.080 | Do you want to actually talk

00:05:36.080 | about the man in the arena

00:05:37.120 | comment and what the context of

00:05:38.760 | it is? Can we talk about that?

00:05:40.200 | Actually? Yeah, I think people

00:05:41.560 | got upset because what I said

00:05:43.400 | was the truth. And this is no

00:05:45.920 | different than when I've said

00:05:47.080 | stuff before that's become a

00:05:48.280 | huge meme and a huge moment

00:05:50.160 | cultural moment. Telling the

00:05:52.200 | truth, especially when it's so

00:05:53.720 | clear and so obvious, sometimes

00:05:56.040 | can really touch a nerve. And

00:05:58.320 | what I said is basically the

00:05:59.680 | following, which is that there

00:06:02.200 | are all these people, the four

00:06:03.680 | of us are examples who are

00:06:05.560 | constantly doing things. And

00:06:08.240 | then we come into x and we

00:06:10.160 | don't confuse x with the arena.

00:06:11.880 | You know, we don't do stuff in

00:06:13.720 | the in x, we talk on x. But

00:06:17.200 | then you go back and you

00:06:18.120 | actually do things you start

00:06:19.480 | companies, you invest in

00:06:20.560 | businesses, you incubate ideas,

00:06:22.240 | you help founders get their

00:06:23.600 | businesses off the ground.

00:06:24.800 | Those are meaningful things and

00:06:26.840 | success is never guaranteed.

00:06:28.480 | But there is a small strain of

00:06:30.520 | people who just violently either

00:06:33.680 | hate themselves, or hate the

00:06:36.520 | fact that you're doing things,

00:06:37.880 | and then that you talk about

00:06:39.160 | them. And I think what this

00:06:41.400 | touched was just that, in a

00:06:42.960 | simple nutshell, it forced

00:06:45.320 | people to confront the fact

00:06:46.520 | that, hey, hold on a second, am

00:06:47.680 | I this anonymous rube on the

00:06:49.160 | sideline that just throw shade

00:06:50.880 | or I'm actually doing stuff

00:06:52.640 | here, I just wanted to take an

00:06:54.040 | actual direct line of attack on

00:06:55.720 | people who are constantly

00:06:58.120 | blaming others for everything.

00:07:00.560 | And if you aren't trying and

00:07:02.920 | iterating, you're a fucking

00:07:04.480 | loser, go out and try

00:07:05.920 | something. And whether it works

00:07:08.120 | or not, x is a great place to

00:07:10.040 | then go and talk about it.

00:07:11.280 | That's the cycle.

00:07:13.120 | Sachs, your thoughts on the man

00:07:14.760 | in the arena?

00:07:15.320 | Well, look, I think speaking of

00:07:17.640 | crazy, politically motivated

00:07:19.480 | witch hunts, did you see this

00:07:20.640 | latest story today? That now

00:07:23.680 | there's a new government

00:07:24.600 | investigation of Elon, they're

00:07:26.520 | investigating him for

00:07:28.320 | supposedly Tesla was going to

00:07:29.920 | build him a glass house. Which

00:07:34.480 | he said is ridiculous. It's not

00:07:36.520 | true. So the administration, you

00:07:39.680 | know, I guess to turn a phrase

00:07:41.320 | people who live in glass houses

00:07:42.560 | shouldn't be investigating glass

00:07:43.840 | houses. You have the Biden

00:07:45.480 | administration. Now the latest

00:07:46.960 | revelations is that Biden was

00:07:49.440 | using a pseudonym in 5000 emails

00:07:52.760 | and he was emailing hunter Biden

00:07:55.080 | under the name Robert Peters. Why

00:07:58.440 | would you do that about barisma?

00:08:00.560 | So this is how they're

00:08:01.600 | communicating first. Biden said

00:08:03.800 | he said,

00:08:04.160 | level.

00:08:06.040 | Yeah. Well, first, remember, at

00:08:08.680 | Yahoo.com. First Biden said, I

00:08:11.400 | don't know anything about my

00:08:12.160 | son's business. Then it turns

00:08:13.640 | out, based on the sworn

00:08:15.000 | testimony of Devin Archer, who

00:08:16.960 | is hunter Biden's partner, that

00:08:18.680 | Biden participated in over 20

00:08:20.200 | phone calls where he would call

00:08:21.760 | in when they're in the room with

00:08:23.680 | clients to quote be the brand.

00:08:25.520 | And now we find out that Biden

00:08:27.600 | was communicating with hunter

00:08:28.840 | about recently using a pseudonym

00:08:31.200 | account, basically a burner

00:08:32.440 | account under the name Robert

00:08:34.080 | letters. Allegedly, allegedly.

00:08:35.520 | Okay, but this is what the

00:08:37.000 | Comer investigations turned up.

00:08:38.480 | It's certainly not looking good.

00:08:39.800 | And as you said, my point is

00:08:41.440 | people are living in glass

00:08:42.400 | houses shouldn't be

00:08:43.000 | investigating glass. Here's the

00:08:44.480 | thing, like, if you're going to

00:08:47.040 | evaluate, and listen, obviously,

00:08:48.840 | I'm biased. But if you're going

00:08:50.800 | to investigate Tesla over this,

00:08:53.200 | like, people can buy and trade

00:08:56.040 | the stock however they want.

00:08:56.920 | Like, there seems to be some

00:08:58.480 | Biden administration, you know,

00:09:01.080 | like jihad against Elon, they're

00:09:02.640 | going after him for this. And

00:09:03.960 | totally

00:09:04.600 | a week or two ago,

00:09:06.720 | summit, I mean, it's all I think

00:09:09.560 | that's where the whole thing

00:09:10.280 | started is that they wouldn't

00:09:11.800 | invite them to the summit because

00:09:13.120 | they're not a union shop. And

00:09:14.480 | then Elon spoke out about that

00:09:16.760 | member, Biden introduced the CEO

00:09:19.400 | of GM giving her credit for

00:09:20.960 | launching the whole EV

00:09:22.000 | revolution. So Elon criticized

00:09:24.480 | administration for that. But I

00:09:25.480 | think the main reason why they

00:09:26.600 | don't like him is because what

00:09:27.560 | he's done with free speech on

00:09:29.240 | Twitter, Twitter, yeah, this

00:09:30.960 | glass house investigation is the

00:09:32.560 | second one. The one that happened

00:09:34.240 | last week is they're

00:09:35.240 | investigating SpaceX for

00:09:37.240 | supposedly screening out foreign

00:09:39.520 | nationals in the hiring process.

00:09:41.080 | They they are saying, wait a

00:09:42.800 | sec, the DOJ is alleging that

00:09:45.200 | SpaceX was hiring too many

00:09:47.000 | Americans, and they need to hire

00:09:49.120 | more refugees, my head spinning.

00:09:51.080 | Even though even though there's a

00:09:53.520 | lot of nationals, not refugees,

00:09:55.360 | no, no, no refugees, refugees, a

00:09:58.200 | refugee is somebody fleeing a

00:09:59.920 | country, Nick, because of my

00:10:01.840 | political persecution. What What

00:10:04.360 | where did the term refugees come

00:10:05.640 | from? No, it is a term. A refugee

00:10:08.600 | is somebody fleeing a country

00:10:10.560 | because of political person

00:10:12.000 | persecution. Why would they use

00:10:13.120 | that term?

00:10:13.600 | The DOJ sued SpaceX, basically

00:10:16.280 | for DEI footfalls. They said that

00:10:18.680 | there was not enough refugees and

00:10:21.120 | asylum seekers that were being

00:10:22.680 | adequately considered and being

00:10:24.040 | hired by SpaceX. The problem with

00:10:26.720 | that, as it turns out, is that the

00:10:28.920 | DOJ is not even allowed to hire

00:10:31.200 | asylum seekers.

00:10:32.520 | I mean,

00:10:33.600 | SpaceX is governed under the same

00:10:36.280 | laws, because it's a rocket

00:10:38.000 | company as advanced weapons,

00:10:39.880 | contractors, and they and the

00:10:42.040 | whole industry has been under the

00:10:43.560 | belief for many years that they

00:10:45.480 | could only hire American citizens

00:10:48.440 | and green card holders for these

00:10:50.120 | very sensitive jobs. And what

00:10:52.760 | happened is earlier in the year,

00:10:55.680 | the Biden administration released

00:10:57.760 | what they called a clarification

00:10:59.080 | here, I'll post this, Nick, can

00:11:00.440 | you pull this up? So the US US DOJ

00:11:03.280 | civil rights division released

00:11:04.600 | this, again, what they call the

00:11:06.000 | clarification how to avoid

00:11:07.280 | immigration related

00:11:08.160 | discrimination when complying

00:11:09.480 | with us export control laws. The

00:11:11.680 | export control laws is what

00:11:13.240 | governs rocket companies and

00:11:15.600 | weapons contractors. It's

00:11:17.280 | basically the companies that are

00:11:18.400 | involved in these sensitive

00:11:20.160 | national security areas. Until

00:11:22.480 | now, the government was pretty

00:11:23.720 | clear that you were only supposed

00:11:26.040 | to hire US citizens and green

00:11:28.680 | card holders.

00:11:29.280 | Explain to me

00:11:31.800 | because they have this crazy idea

00:11:34.560 | that that these companies, these

00:11:36.920 | national security companies

00:11:38.080 | should be hiring more refugees

00:11:40.520 | and asylum seekers, really, even

00:11:42.560 | though this is the definition of

00:11:44.520 | a national security risk. But

00:11:46.160 | they're really crazy thing. So

00:11:47.280 | first of all, I think this this

00:11:48.640 | update that they issued this is

00:11:49.920 | lawmaking. Okay, they called it a

00:11:51.640 | clarification. But this is a

00:11:53.000 | Biden administration making new

00:11:54.280 | law through Yeah, that's not the

00:11:56.360 | process. agency. I think this is

00:11:58.680 | a crazy law. It's really the

00:12:00.800 | opposite of what we should want,

00:12:01.840 | which is more Americans getting

00:12:03.440 | jobs. Saks can answer your

00:12:04.720 | question. But what they've done

00:12:05.720 | with this lawsuit is they're

00:12:06.640 | going back and remember, the

00:12:07.880 | key here is that that was only

00:12:09.200 | issued in April of this year.

00:12:10.760 | They've gone back and said that

00:12:12.240 | from 2008 to 2022. SpaceX is

00:12:16.120 | governed by this new

00:12:17.200 | understanding. So they're

00:12:18.080 | basically making it retroactive.

00:12:19.480 | Okay, putting aside this legal

00:12:21.840 | lease here for a second, I just

00:12:22.800 | want to talk first principles.

00:12:23.920 | If you were a foreign government,

00:12:26.480 | and you wanted to infiltrate some

00:12:29.040 | company like SpaceX or Andrew or

00:12:31.720 | whatever, would it not be easier

00:12:34.120 | to send a quote unquote refugee

00:12:37.080 | to America, especially to get in

00:12:38.960 | versus flipping an American who

00:12:40.640 | already works there? It should be

00:12:42.040 | a much easier process, especially

00:12:44.080 | because all sense,

00:12:45.280 | right, because especially since

00:12:46.920 | all you have to do is go to the

00:12:48.520 | hole in the wall in Yuma, Arizona

00:12:50.520 | as RFK Jr. showed, and you just

00:12:52.760 | mentioned the word asylum, like

00:12:54.680 | the cartel has taught you to. And

00:12:56.720 | all of a sudden, you're a refugee

00:12:58.120 | you're in, they give you a piece

00:12:59.560 | of paper that tells you you're

00:13:00.400 | going to be in court in three

00:13:01.280 | years, but you're in 1000s of

00:13:03.040 | people 10s without millions of

00:13:04.320 | people have done this.

00:13:05.080 | Also, another pragmatic question

00:13:06.720 | for you, how many people who are

00:13:08.200 | coming in as asylum seekers have

00:13:10.400 | the advanced degrees or

00:13:13.600 | background to work at Andrew

00:13:15.400 | spacex? I don't know, pick a pick

00:13:17.000 | an aerospace weapons based

00:13:18.120 | company. Like what percentage of

00:13:20.080 | refugees do you think coming

00:13:21.560 | across the southern border or

00:13:22.640 | whatever border they're coming in

00:13:23.800 | would actually have those

00:13:24.680 | qualifications. So anyway, this

00:13:26.000 | seems insane.

00:13:27.080 | Well, and so Jake, you raised an

00:13:28.360 | interesting point, because I

00:13:29.360 | think one of the really unusual

00:13:30.600 | things about this DOJ lawsuit

00:13:32.360 | against SpaceX is that the

00:13:35.760 | remedies are seeking are

00:13:37.040 | unprecedented. What they've said

00:13:38.240 | is, anybody who was screened out

00:13:41.040 | as part of this process, was

00:13:43.600 | entitled to back pay lost wages,

00:13:46.760 | since they were screened out. So

00:13:48.240 | in other words, it assumes that

00:13:49.840 | every single one of those people

00:13:51.000 | would have been hired

00:13:51.720 | gotten the job when they got the

00:13:53.040 | job, they hire one out of 1000

00:13:54.600 | or one out of 100 applicants gets

00:13:56.080 | hired.

00:13:56.360 | If they could have gotten a job

00:13:58.200 | at SpaceX, as we all know, their

00:13:59.600 | bar for hiring is incredibly

00:14:01.080 | high, they probably didn't have

00:14:02.480 | damages because they could

00:14:03.240 | probably get jobs at 10 other

00:14:04.280 | companies as well.

00:14:05.520 | Oh my god, the Biden

00:14:06.840 | administration is just like

00:14:07.800 | self inflicted wounds here. This

00:14:09.160 | is so dumb. What a stupid

00:14:11.400 | approach

00:14:12.440 | is the glass house thing, a

00:14:14.040 | misallocation of funds claim

00:14:15.840 | like it's a securities issue. Is

00:14:17.320 | that what

00:14:17.520 | it's a securities issue that it

00:14:18.760 | was improperly disclosed and that

00:14:21.480 | they may not have filed the

00:14:23.320 | proper taxes because it would

00:14:24.560 | have been a paid benefit to

00:14:25.920 | Elon. Right? Right.

00:14:27.400 | But I mean, don't you feel like

00:14:28.760 | this is a stretch? I mean, they

00:14:30.640 | are stretching every law they

00:14:32.480 | can to go after this guy, it's

00:14:33.760 | getting to be a little bit

00:14:34.680 | trump to bring it up.

00:14:36.240 | Let's be clear. Here's what's

00:14:37.240 | happening. I think that when

00:14:39.120 | Elon bought Twitter, what

00:14:42.640 | effectively happened is the

00:14:43.880 | biggest psyops organization for

00:14:45.960 | the Democratic Party was taken

00:14:47.720 | away from them. And I think that

00:14:50.480 | they are increasingly feeling

00:14:52.600 | like if it really does, if

00:14:54.040 | Twitter or x becomes a town

00:14:55.800 | square, that's really bad for

00:14:57.920 | them. And so they can't shape

00:15:00.480 | people, they can't amplify the

00:15:02.600 | victimization, they can't

00:15:03.840 | amplify the government's going

00:15:06.520 | to save you narratives. And so

00:15:08.960 | this is the sort of death by 1000

00:15:11.440 | cuts approach that the blob has

00:15:14.360 | of trying to bring him down. And

00:15:16.560 | so you see a DOJ lawsuit over

00:15:19.960 | here, it's, you know, nominal,

00:15:21.760 | but whatever, then you're going

00:15:22.800 | to see, you know, the SEC

00:15:25.400 | investigation over $50,000 of

00:15:28.400 | glass, I mean, the guy is worth

00:15:30.560 | a quarter of a trillion dollars,

00:15:32.120 | and we're sweating the $50,000

00:15:33.800 | glass purchase. But the point is,

00:15:35.760 | the goal is to tie him up, and to

00:15:39.120 | distract him. And to basically

00:15:41.480 | take resources away his mind

00:15:44.120 | share from working. Now, we all

00:15:46.080 | know him. So he's going to do the

00:15:47.560 | exact same work. Not gonna work.

00:15:49.760 | Alex Spiro is going to have a job

00:15:51.320 | for the rest of his life. That's

00:15:52.400 | his lawyer from Quinn Emanuel.

00:15:53.680 | And Alex is going to beat these

00:15:55.400 | things back. And generally, Alex

00:15:57.840 | will win most lawsuits. I say

00:16:00.400 | most. But not all. But anyways,

00:16:06.600 | the point is that the point is

00:16:08.160 | that

00:16:08.400 | I think you're exactly right

00:16:12.880 | about what's motivating this and

00:16:14.400 | what's going on. But I'll tell

00:16:15.720 | you when it all began is that

00:16:17.160 | Biden has a press conference,

00:16:18.720 | where he said that Elon needed to

00:16:20.600 | be looked at. Do you remember

00:16:22.000 | this? Yeah, Biden said, Well, I

00:16:25.160 | don't know that he wants to do

00:16:25.960 | anything wrong. But I think we

00:16:27.280 | need to look at his relationships

00:16:28.920 | with other countries. So this

00:16:30.360 | was the signal to all of the

00:16:33.160 | ambitious apparatchiks in our

00:16:36.400 | law enforcement agencies, looking

00:16:39.760 | for advancement, that he's the

00:16:41.800 | target go after him find

00:16:43.520 | something. Now, in fact, they

00:16:45.880 | couldn't find anything. So they

00:16:47.840 | look at his relation with other

00:16:48.880 | countries. And what you would

00:16:50.000 | expect is that maybe he hired

00:16:52.640 | some foreign nationals he

00:16:53.760 | shouldn't have. But it was the

00:16:55.560 | exact opposite. They didn't hire

00:16:57.600 | foreign nationals. The crime

00:17:00.000 | will get you. It reminds me of

00:17:02.120 | the whole Alvin Bragg thing where

00:17:03.600 | Alvin Bragg made that case, that

00:17:06.040 | Trump was required by campaign

00:17:09.200 | finance laws to pay Stormy

00:17:10.560 | Daniels using donor money. But

00:17:14.920 | you know, you know that if they

00:17:16.800 | had found that Trump paid Stormy

00:17:18.360 | Daniels with donations, they

00:17:20.040 | would have charged him with that.

00:17:21.760 | It's like investigating the guy

00:17:23.360 | finding he did nothing wrong, and

00:17:25.040 | then charging him with the

00:17:26.040 | opposite. What do you know

00:17:26.800 | equivalency between these and

00:17:28.720 | Trump's behavior, but

00:17:30.080 | it's the weaponization of the

00:17:31.200 | justice system. It showed me the

00:17:32.920 | man and I'll show you the crime.

00:17:34.280 | Now, incorrect with the last two.

00:17:36.160 | I mean, he committed a lot of

00:17:37.760 | crimes, but we'll leave that off

00:17:38.600 | the docket for now. We're going

00:17:39.640 | to read a disagree on that one.

00:17:40.840 | Okay. Just very interesting media

00:17:45.360 | related story and find you're

00:17:46.800 | giving Robert Peters too much

00:17:47.960 | credit. I mean, Joe Biden.

00:17:49.600 | I'm listening. Biden's got to go.

00:17:53.120 | Trump's got to go. We need a new

00:17:55.880 | platform. I have announced that I

00:17:58.000 | am supporting Nikki Halley and

00:18:00.160 | Chris Christie slash Revec.

00:18:01.440 | Vivek. That would be my ideal

00:18:04.160 | ticket right now. I want the only

00:18:05.560 | person freeberg who brought up

00:18:07.320 | spending in either party. Nikki

00:18:11.520 | Halley.

00:18:11.760 | I let's just agree. I'll move on.

00:18:13.800 | But I just want to also say we

00:18:15.800 | were wondering who won the debate

00:18:17.760 | last week. Biggest increase Nikki

00:18:19.480 | Halley. So I didn't see the

00:18:22.240 | tribune. What's it look like?

00:18:23.760 | I think she went from two to nine

00:18:25.880 | seven to nine in different in

00:18:28.680 | different polls. So it's

00:18:30.760 | somewhere between she tripled

00:18:32.040 | was not a huge bounce. I think

00:18:33.280 | you went I think you're right.

00:18:34.200 | She went to nine to seven.

00:18:35.960 | There was one two to seven one

00:18:37.680 | two to nine but putting it aside

00:18:39.000 | the Trump people are actually

00:18:40.200 | promoting it because they want

00:18:42.000 | Trump to be up against a bunch.

00:18:43.920 | They want to be up against a

00:18:45.720 | bunch of kids. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

00:18:47.960 | Three people at 10 to 15% is

00:18:50.320 | better than one at 30. I was

00:18:51.880 | probably correct.

00:18:52.920 | Could I just ask because I haven't

00:18:54.320 | followed it this week. What was

00:18:55.640 | the set? What like after it

00:18:58.040 | settled after the bounces and the

00:18:59.600 | spikes? saxipoo? What? Where?

00:19:01.800 | Where are we at now in the

00:19:02.840 | Republican race after this past

00:19:04.920 | week and having people having a

00:19:07.040 | chance to really figure out what

00:19:08.680 | happened in the debate? Yeah,

00:19:09.640 | exactly. Yeah,

00:19:10.120 | I think the consensus view just

00:19:11.600 | about is that the biggest

00:19:12.600 | beneficiary of the debate was

00:19:14.600 | Vivek Ramaswamy. By far. Yes,

00:19:17.000 | Nikki Haley did get a little bit

00:19:18.320 | of a bounce, but Vivek got a

00:19:19.840 | much bigger one. He's much

00:19:20.960 | better known to the base now.

00:19:22.680 | And I think that it's Vivek and

00:19:26.440 | DeSantis are now more or less

00:19:28.640 | neck and neck for number two.

00:19:29.880 | Haley might be number three at

00:19:31.680 | this point. But I think it helped

00:19:34.240 | Vivek the most. Now. It's also

00:19:36.880 | true that he got a lot of

00:19:38.160 | criticism. But I think that's

00:19:40.360 | kind of where he wants to be. I

00:19:42.480 | mean, you want to be the center

00:19:44.040 | of attention. And the people who

00:19:45.960 | are attacking him now are all

00:19:47.160 | these neocons. It's basically

00:19:48.960 | the whole military industrial

00:19:50.320 | complex. It's all the bond paid

00:19:52.400 | for politicians and think tanks

00:19:54.800 | who, you know, want America to

00:19:56.640 | be in these forever wars. So I

00:19:58.760 | think he's being attacked by the

00:19:59.720 | right people. And that's going

00:20:00.520 | to help him. Yeah.

00:20:01.960 | So sacks you you see him like

00:20:04.280 | basically, it's going to be

00:20:05.760 | Trump versus Vivek, if this

00:20:07.920 | continues.

00:20:08.600 | Well, it's hard to say. I mean,

00:20:12.480 | I think the census is still in

00:20:14.240 | the mix. I think it's noteworthy

00:20:15.720 | that the top three candidates

00:20:17.240 | all have expressed significant

00:20:20.640 | either misgivings or opposition

00:20:22.520 | to our involvement in Ukraine.

00:20:25.520 | Trump, Vivek and DeSantis with

00:20:28.440 | varying degrees of strength have

00:20:30.600 | basically all opposed Biden's

00:20:31.800 | policy. And they are the leading

00:20:33.480 | candidates in the Republican

00:20:34.520 | primary. I think that's telling

00:20:35.600 | you something very important.

00:20:37.320 | Haley, Christie, Pence, Tim

00:20:41.440 | Scott, they all would like to do

00:20:43.800 | even more in Ukraine. And that

00:20:45.400 | is not where the party is. So

00:20:47.040 | some of the country is nobody's

00:20:48.920 | there. One other piece of

00:20:50.400 | debate fallout that I thought

00:20:51.720 | was really interesting was that

00:20:53.520 | they interviewed Oliver Anthony.

00:20:55.040 | Remember the the guy who sings

00:20:57.120 | that song? The Richmond North

00:20:59.000 | Richmond, because Fox News made

00:21:01.640 | the first question about his

00:21:02.640 | song. And he clarified what the

00:21:05.760 | song was about what he said is,

00:21:07.320 | the Richmond he's talking about

00:21:08.880 | North Richmond are the people in

00:21:10.520 | DC. It's the blob. And with the

00:21:12.400 | same people on the debate stage.

00:21:13.680 | Yeah. Well, but what he said

00:21:15.640 | specifically was it was the it

00:21:17.560 | was the people who got us into

00:21:19.400 | all these endless wars when I

00:21:20.920 | was growing up. It was the

00:21:22.440 | Republicans who did specifically

00:21:24.000 | he was talking about Bush Cheney

00:21:26.440 | Republicans, neocons. He made

00:21:28.920 | that explicit and clear. I'm

00:21:30.640 | singing more about like a lot of

00:21:33.240 | the older super conservative

00:21:34.680 | politicians that brought us into

00:21:36.640 | endless war through my entire

00:21:38.880 | childhood. Those are Bush era

00:21:41.480 | neocons. He said the people on

00:21:43.080 | that stage is who I'm talking

00:21:44.160 | about. Don't use my song. This

00:21:45.560 | song is not a left or a right

00:21:46.920 | song. It's about the people. It

00:21:48.400 | was a song about his

00:21:50.000 | contemporaries is what he said.

00:21:51.200 | Not and he's talking about both

00:21:53.000 | parties. And he said, specifically

00:21:54.160 | if the people on that stage I'm

00:21:55.400 | talking about, don't use my song

00:21:56.560 | again. Okay, let's go on to the

00:21:57.680 | next story. There was a leaked

00:21:59.680 | document. And we had this come up

00:22:01.600 | last week, the leaked document was

00:22:03.840 | sent to Chamath. And it was about

00:22:06.720 | Tiger Global's struggles. It had

00:22:09.240 | a line at the top that said this

00:22:10.680 | was a spiked or a draft of a New

00:22:13.440 | Yorker story. And a draft is the

00:22:14.920 | way they said it. And we had a

00:22:18.200 | little conversation about here,

00:22:19.280 | we decided not to publish it, we

00:22:20.800 | had a little discussion, because

00:22:23.160 | we did not think in our private

00:22:25.160 | discussion, that this was a real

00:22:27.840 | story, high star grammatical

00:22:29.200 | errors in it. SAC said, we really

00:22:31.640 | can't publish something like this

00:22:32.800 | because it's slanderous, and we

00:22:34.920 | don't know the provenance of it.

00:22:36.480 | And on Friday, Tiger sent a letter

00:22:39.520 | to its LPS in response to the

00:22:40.800 | document. They wrote that they are

00:22:43.040 | being targeted, quote targeted

00:22:44.680 | with a series of misinformation

00:22:46.120 | attacks, anonymously using a

00:22:47.640 | cryptic messaging platforms like

00:22:48.920 | signal we strongly believe these

00:22:50.640 | were written by a disgruntled

00:22:52.840 | form employee with whom we parted

00:22:55.120 | ways unlike the anonymous coward

00:22:56.800 | spreading this false narrative on

00:22:58.000 | the internet. You know who we are.

00:22:59.600 | And we are here and ready to

00:23:01.240 | answer your questions. Rest

00:23:02.720 | assured, our team remains highly

00:23:04.080 | focused on our core business,

00:23:05.280 | which has been forming this year.

00:23:07.840 | So Chamath, just your broad

00:23:10.720 | thoughts on the Tiger Global non

00:23:12.520 | story, fake faux story by a former

00:23:15.320 | employee. Chase is a incredible

00:23:18.680 | person. I've said this before, he

00:23:20.160 | helped me get into the business of

00:23:21.720 | investing, he seeded my first

00:23:24.240 | angel fund. I was pretty helpful,

00:23:29.240 | I think in getting them on the cap

00:23:30.840 | table at Facebook many, many years

00:23:33.600 | ago, which helped them get going

00:23:34.960 | as well. So I think that he's a

00:23:37.560 | wonderful human being. And I've

00:23:39.240 | had nothing but positive things to

00:23:40.520 | say about him. Scott Schleifer, I

00:23:41.880 | don't know as well. But he seems

00:23:44.960 | like clearly a hard charging

00:23:46.280 | person that's achieved quite a lot.

00:23:47.720 | And so I'm glad that we didn't

00:23:50.600 | publish it or talk about it. And if

00:23:53.800 | there is something to be said, the

00:23:56.480 | story will be validated and people

00:23:58.280 | will get to the bottom of it. What

00:24:00.280 | is crazy is I don't understand what

00:24:02.680 | this document actually serves,

00:24:05.640 | except exactly as you said, to a

00:24:09.520 | disgruntled person who has

00:24:10.680 | absolutely no economics, meaning,

00:24:12.480 | if you're an LP, you don't want

00:24:14.720 | this document to be out. If you're

00:24:18.120 | a partner that has carry, you don't

00:24:20.560 | want this out into the out in the

00:24:22.520 | wild either. If you're a portfolio

00:24:24.360 | company, you don't want this

00:24:25.960 | document out in the wild. I tend to

00:24:28.800 | believe that this is just a

00:24:30.200 | disgruntled person. Again, look,

00:24:31.360 | I've had this experience as well. So

00:24:34.360 | which is that there are all kinds

00:24:36.600 | of employees who work with you. We

00:24:39.840 | try our best as leaders of

00:24:41.200 | organizations to compensate them

00:24:43.120 | as well. But invariably, what I find

00:24:46.040 | are people overestimate their

00:24:47.920 | contributions. And people try to

00:24:51.080 | take way more credit. They try to

00:24:53.280 | take credit for deals that they've

00:24:54.760 | done that they didn't actually do.

00:24:56.960 | They try to take credit for all the

00:24:59.640 | internal workings. And then

00:25:02.440 | invariably, when the leadership

00:25:04.520 | decides that those folks aren't a

00:25:06.680 | good fit anymore, mostly for

00:25:08.240 | cultural reasons, and are exited,

00:25:11.840 | they have a bone to pick and an

00:25:13.120 | axe to grind. And they try to sort

00:25:16.360 | of distribute misinformation to

00:25:19.520 | other LPS to other GPS to

00:25:21.560 | portfolio company CEOs. It's

00:25:23.520 | happened to me. It's happened to

00:25:25.240 | chase. It's happened to Sequoia.

00:25:28.400 | It's happened to any of us that

00:25:29.840 | have been successful. So

00:25:30.960 | extra grind people, you know,

00:25:31.920 | it's just like, again, it's just

00:25:33.960 | another example of like, there are

00:25:35.880 | the people that are in the arena

00:25:37.320 | doing and then there are the

00:25:38.480 | people that kind of get kicked out

00:25:39.920 | and really upset and lose track of

00:25:44.560 | what's important. These people

00:25:46.560 | instead of writing these missives

00:25:48.200 | should be working.

00:25:49.360 | Yeah. I mean, how how disgruntled

00:25:52.720 | sacks does a former employee need

00:25:54.840 | to be to put in this kind of effort

00:25:57.160 | to write a 10 page faux New Yorker

00:25:59.960 | style expose and you were the voice

00:26:03.080 | of reason I think in our group chat

00:26:04.760 | and just saying like, I don't even

00:26:05.880 | think we should talk about it in a

00:26:07.040 | meta kind of way. We weren't going

00:26:08.360 | to cover the details of it. But

00:26:09.280 | we did have a discussion of it. You

00:26:10.960 | put the kibosh on which we would

00:26:13.440 | have been first like kind of

00:26:14.400 | highlighting this craziness, but

00:26:16.000 | you took a pretty hard stance and

00:26:17.440 | your thoughts on it.

00:26:18.280 | Well, it was written like it was

00:26:21.480 | some sort of journalistic article,

00:26:23.040 | but a journalistic article has a

00:26:25.160 | byline, you know, who wrote it, you

00:26:27.160 | know, who publishes it, it has

00:26:28.960 | provenance, you know, therefore, who

00:26:30.960 | is liable if it's slanderous. Yeah.

00:26:34.600 | This piece that was going around had

00:26:36.800 | none of those things. And therefore

00:26:38.520 | my view was that we shouldn't

00:26:40.160 | discuss it. And my view is we

00:26:41.840 | shouldn't even mention it because

00:26:43.440 | all you're then doing is drawing

00:26:44.880 | attention to something that again,

00:26:47.000 | you don't know the providence of

00:26:48.000 | and you don't know whether it's

00:26:48.800 | true or not. And you don't know

00:26:49.760 | who's standing by it. Now, what's

00:26:51.880 | happened in the last week is that

00:26:52.920 | Tiger has issued a statement about

00:26:55.360 | it. And that statement was covered

00:26:56.400 | by the press. So I guess we can

00:26:58.400 | talk about the fact that they've

00:27:00.200 | had to respond to this. I'm still

00:27:02.120 | not comfortable talking about any

00:27:03.080 | of the contents of it. Because

00:27:04.200 | again, we don't have nobody's put

00:27:05.400 | their name by it. So why even put

00:27:08.160 | a position of needing to respond

00:27:09.560 | to it? Yeah. Until somebody is

00:27:11.640 | willing to basically raise their

00:27:12.720 | hand and say, this is what I

00:27:14.280 | think. The piece that was

00:27:15.400 | circulated was a mix of both

00:27:18.440 | business criticism or business

00:27:20.240 | issues and personal slander. So,

00:27:23.360 | I mean, are there business issues

00:27:24.880 | in there that we could discuss?

00:27:26.280 | Yeah. I mean, then they would be

00:27:27.720 | interesting, but until we know

00:27:30.520 | that there's some authenticity to

00:27:32.120 | it, I don't feel comfortable

00:27:33.360 | giving any attention whatsoever to

00:27:35.160 | this thing. Personally, I think

00:27:36.360 | even talking about it now is still

00:27:37.960 | a waste of time.

00:27:38.560 | Freeberg, any thoughts on it just

00:27:40.160 | as we wrap here?

00:27:41.200 | No, it's clearly a disgruntled

00:27:44.600 | person trying to cast a negative

00:27:48.800 | light.

00:27:49.240 | Just get a job bro. All right.

00:27:51.120 | D dollarization corner bricks

00:27:53.040 | added six new members climbing to

00:27:55.360 | 11 total and bricks. Of course,

00:27:58.280 | everybody knows Brazil, Russia,

00:28:00.040 | India, China and South Africa.

00:28:02.600 | These four countries make up 40%

00:28:04.760 | of the world's population 25% of

00:28:06.440 | global GDP joining the bricks

00:28:08.600 | block are Saudi Arabia, Iran,

00:28:12.080 | Ethiopia, Egypt, Argentina and the

00:28:14.080 | UAE new bricks and it's kind of

00:28:16.360 | being set up as like an

00:28:17.840 | alternative to G seven g eight I

00:28:20.280 | guess new bricks makes up almost

00:28:22.920 | 50% of the global population with

00:28:25.920 | a third of GDP. This is the first

00:28:28.120 | expansion in 13 years since South

00:28:29.880 | Africa joined sacks. You've got

00:28:31.840 | some thoughts on the bricks and a

00:28:32.840 | little presentation here. Inform

00:28:34.440 | the audience.

00:28:35.200 | Alright, so Jake, like you said,

00:28:36.840 | they added six new members.

00:28:38.240 | Argentina, Egypt, Ethiopia, Iran,

00:28:40.760 | Saudi Arabia and UAE. This on top

00:28:42.600 | of the original five members. Now,

00:28:45.240 | you've described this group of

00:28:47.680 | countries as mid I don't know what

00:28:50.080 | metric you're using to make that

00:28:52.640 | determination. If you look at share

00:28:55.720 | of global GDP in purchasing power

00:28:58.640 | parity terms, and we can debate

00:29:00.280 | whether that's the right method or

00:29:01.880 | not. But a lot of economists

00:29:03.080 | believe that PPP is the right way

00:29:04.920 | to look at it. The original bricks

00:29:06.840 | were 32% of global GDP, the new

00:29:10.080 | bricks bring it to 37%. And there's

00:29:12.600 | a couple dozen more countries have

00:29:14.000 | expressed an interest in joining

00:29:15.600 | bricks, which would bring it to 45.

00:29:17.800 | The G seven is only 30%. And that

00:29:21.920 | number has been declining over time

00:29:23.720 | back in 1995. It was all the way at

00:29:25.480 | 45%. Whereas the bricks were only

00:29:28.880 | about 17%. You can see that decline

00:29:31.600 | or shift here in this chart going

00:29:33.520 | all the way back to the 1980s.

00:29:35.080 | This is why I think a lot of

00:29:36.320 | Americans have this casually

00:29:37.680 | dismissive attitude towards the

00:29:39.640 | bricks is they're thinking that

00:29:40.920 | these countries are still living in

00:29:43.600 | the era of the 1990s of uni

00:29:46.520 | polarity. When the G seven was, you

00:29:50.520 | know, more than half of global GDP,

00:29:52.880 | but now the bricks are bigger than

00:29:55.400 | the G seven, again, in terms of PPP,

00:29:57.840 | the rest have risen, and it's become

00:30:00.760 | a very substantial part of the world

00:30:02.040 | economy. If you look at global oil

00:30:04.240 | production, the new bricks now have

00:30:06.720 | 54% of global oil production, it's

00:30:09.440 | almost double what the G seven

00:30:10.640 | produces, despite the US still being

00:30:12.840 | the number one producer of oil. We're

00:30:15.160 | not the biggest exporter because we

00:30:16.440 | use it all.

00:30:17.200 | Just to add to that point, oil is, of

00:30:20.120 | course, a declining commodity with

00:30:22.960 | renewables and nuclear and people

00:30:25.240 | don't rely on it less. So sure, I

00:30:27.320 | don't think renewables are anywhere

00:30:28.560 | close to be able to replace fossil

00:30:30.800 | fuels. If it's actually hold on, let

00:30:35.800 | me just answer to that. It's cheaper

00:30:38.000 | now, and Chamath can speak to this to

00:30:39.880 | install solar wind than it is to do a

00:30:43.080 | lot of the carbon based fuels. So it

00:30:46.440 | actually has tipped economically, where

00:30:48.840 | it's I think, cheaper and 80% of cases

00:30:50.920 | 85% of cases to install renewables. Is

00:30:53.520 | that correct? From broadly speaking,

00:30:55.040 | the cost of solar is effectively now

00:30:57.880 | the the cheapest form of energy, you

00:31:00.000 | know, on a kilowatt per hour basis.

00:31:01.480 | Great. Okay, continue.

00:31:02.520 | Well, this is a prevent journey from

00:31:04.880 | sliding into a massive recession

00:31:06.440 | because they're not able to get cheap

00:31:07.960 | energy anymore.

00:31:08.960 | Yeah, they turned out also, that also

00:31:11.600 | supposes that you have the actual

00:31:13.040 | supply. And to David's point, why

00:31:15.120 | Germany has such a difficult issues

00:31:17.360 | because they turned off that gas, they

00:31:18.640 | turned off the reactor, and there's

00:31:20.960 | just not enough solar installed right

00:31:22.760 | now. So, you know, you also think

00:31:24.320 | about a country. What I just meant was

00:31:26.560 | more the levelized cost of energy,

00:31:28.240 | which is if you had an installation

00:31:29.800 | here and an installation there of two

00:31:31.760 | different modes of energy generation,

00:31:33.520 | solar is cheaper. But Dave, David is

00:31:35.880 | right, like, you know, it's still

00:31:36.760 | going to take some time for the

00:31:37.960 | proliferation of solar

00:31:39.000 | agrees with that.

00:31:39.680 | Yeah, we all agree.

00:31:40.840 | The US is already roughly energy

00:31:43.520 | independent, we produce about 20

00:31:45.440 | million barrels of oil a day, we

00:31:47.400 | consume about 20 million. So we are

00:31:49.880 | roughly neutral. With respect to the

00:31:53.120 | world, we're neither a net importer or

00:31:54.400 | net exporter as of now. So I oil is

00:31:57.840 | still going to be a huge, it's the

00:31:59.360 | number one global commodity. If BRICS

00:32:02.640 | adds Venezuela, Algeria and Kazakhstan

00:32:04.880 | as they may do, as soon as next year,

00:32:07.840 | they'll control 90% of all oil and gas

00:32:10.320 | traded globally, you're going to have

00:32:11.880 | an OPEC plus BRICS sort of symbiosis

00:32:16.280 | because Russia and Saudi Arabia

00:32:17.480 | basically run OPEC plus new BRICS is

00:32:19.520 | also really strong in food production.

00:32:21.040 | Five of the world's six biggest food

00:32:23.120 | producers are now part of BRICS China,

00:32:25.720 | Brazil, India, Argentina, Russia. The

00:32:27.920 | only other one is the US. They have 46%

00:32:30.680 | of global population, 36% of global

00:32:33.200 | landmass. So my point is BRICS isn't

00:32:36.280 | just strong in global GDP, they're

00:32:38.880 | strong in the production of what are

00:32:41.600 | currently the two most important

00:32:43.760 | commodities in the world, which is oil

00:32:45.240 | and food. They also have influence over

00:32:48.280 | strategic trade routes. So if you look

00:32:49.920 | at where these countries are located,

00:32:52.040 | and I'm sure this went into the

00:32:53.520 | thinking of who they just admitted to

00:32:56.000 | BRICS, because they had a lot of

00:32:56.960 | choices, that's something like 26

00:32:59.200 | countries applied, and these are the

00:33:00.880 | first six they've added. So they now

00:33:03.840 | control the Arctic Sea route, which is

00:33:05.600 | basically as the polar ice cap starts to

00:33:08.720 | melt in the Arctic, you're seeing a new

00:33:11.120 | ability to create maritime routes north

00:33:14.400 | of Russia, basically, from Europe to

00:33:16.440 | Asia, it's a much faster route than

00:33:18.640 | going around the Horn of Africa or

00:33:19.880 | through the Suez Canal. You have this

00:33:22.200 | international north south

00:33:23.680 | transportation corridor, which is

00:33:25.600 | basically a combination of overland

00:33:28.160 | routes and some maritime that connect

00:33:30.720 | Russia, Iran and India. You've got

00:33:32.880 | Belt and Road, these east west

00:33:34.400 | corridors, you've got the Persian Gulf,

00:33:36.000 | the Red Sea and the Suez Canal, they're

00:33:37.960 | all now part of BRICS. And the point of

00:33:41.840 | that, I think strategically is to

00:33:43.160 | bypass choke points like the Strait of

00:33:45.360 | Singapore, the Strait of Malacca, the

00:33:47.240 | Bosphorus, and the Strait of Hormuz. So

00:33:49.920 | the point here is that the US Navy has

00:33:52.320 | very strategically over decades, been

00:33:54.520 | circling China with military bases on,

00:33:59.120 | you know, island chains around China,

00:34:01.200 | this is going to basically neutralize

00:34:03.640 | that whole strategy because China will

00:34:05.080 | have ways of securing its trade routes

00:34:08.400 | over land, or again, over sea going

00:34:12.600 | through the Arctic. So this has huge

00:34:14.840 | geostrategic implications. The other

00:34:17.200 | big thing that I think BRICS is doing

00:34:18.920 | is they have this five to 10 year goal

00:34:20.440 | of allowing BRICS members to sell

00:34:21.680 | trades and local currencies. I think

00:34:23.720 | that you guys may be seeing it the

00:34:26.200 | wrong way. The goal here is not to

00:34:28.240 | create a new reserve currency. It's

00:34:30.200 | simply to create a way to bypass the

00:34:31.960 | dollar complex. They're trying to break

00:34:33.960 | the petrodollar monopoly. This is not an

00:34:36.080 | offensive organization. And they're not

00:34:37.840 | necessarily trying to create a single

00:34:41.080 | alternative to the US dollar. They are

00:34:43.960 | trying to create a way to not have to go

00:34:46.880 | through the dollar complex in order to

00:34:48.800 | do their trade when they're trading with

00:34:50.680 | each other.

00:34:51.800 | And I would like to

00:34:53.160 | say China and Brazil are doing is a test

00:34:55.880 | case for this, where they are setting up

00:34:58.000 | a yuan clearing arrangement with Brazil.

00:35:01.400 | And the goal to be clear, Sax here is to

00:35:03.800 | have a voice versus the G seven, which

00:35:06.160 | they feel they've a lot of these

00:35:07.200 | countries feel they've been left out of

00:35:08.600 | and to maybe not have as much

00:35:11.560 | dependency on the West and form this

00:35:15.680 | block that has a bigger voice in the

00:35:18.040 | world, right?

00:35:20.880 | I go a little further and say this isn't

00:35:22.240 | just about them having a voice. It's

00:35:24.520 | about them having economic sovereignty.

00:35:27.440 | They do not want to be completely

00:35:29.640 | dependent on the United States to secure

00:35:31.880 | their economies. And the big driver of

00:35:34.640 | this has been the weaponization of the

00:35:36.720 | US dollar.

00:35:37.440 | And swept. Yeah.

00:35:38.880 | Yes. So in conjunction with this Ukraine

00:35:42.400 | war, the US sees Russia's foreign

00:35:44.640 | reserves, which were in dollars, they've

00:35:47.040 | widely imposed sanctions were now

00:35:48.640 | sanctioning dozens and dozens of

00:35:50.440 | countries. And we are tactically

00:35:53.240 | limiting who can use Swift as part of

00:35:55.400 | this. So if you are any of the BRICS

00:35:58.160 | countries, you're asking yourself, wait

00:35:59.920 | a second, when I am doing business with

00:36:03.200 | another member of BRICS, why should the

00:36:06.320 | US be any part of that transaction?

00:36:08.200 | Yeah, they do not want that

00:36:10.000 | transaction to be mediated by the US at

00:36:12.160 | all,

00:36:12.400 | in a way, it's like people buying crypto

00:36:14.240 | so that they don't have to deal with the

00:36:16.040 | US government. They have, you know, they

00:36:17.440 | have Bitcoin over here, and they're not

00:36:19.920 | subject to the rules of the US dollar,

00:36:22.240 | right? It's like a way of

00:36:23.320 | some independence. Yeah, I totally get

00:36:26.560 | it.

00:36:26.640 | They're willing to play by the US's rules

00:36:28.240 | when they're trading with the US. But

00:36:30.440 | they do not want to play by the US's

00:36:31.920 | rules when they're not trading with the

00:36:33.360 | US or the g seven. And this is about

00:36:35.800 | creating that independence.

00:36:36.840 | I think it's great that they have to

00:36:38.480 | moth that there is a competitor to the US

00:36:40.320 | dollar because it makes us be more

00:36:41.760 | thoughtful about our spending

00:36:42.920 | ultimately, and our balance sheet. What

00:36:45.000 | are your thoughts on all this?

00:36:45.720 | I have a couple. So if you go back to

00:36:47.400 | when the bricks was created, this is

00:36:50.120 | like 20 plus years ago, it was first

00:36:53.800 | just brick and with a small

00:36:55.400 | 2001. And, and then it became bricks

00:36:58.440 | with a big ass when they admitted South

00:36:59.920 | Africa, I think the the fact pattern in

00:37:02.080 | that organization is pretty poor. You

00:37:05.480 | know, when they first got organized,

00:37:06.960 | they tried to create a competitor to the

00:37:08.800 | IMF. I think it's called the IDB, the

00:37:11.920 | International Development Bank. That

00:37:14.920 | bank is not dispersed a single dollar.

00:37:17.680 | In 23 years, they tried to create a

00:37:20.680 | joint program to lay undersea fiber

00:37:22.840 | amongst these countries hasn't even

00:37:25.240 | started. So I think it's good that this

00:37:28.080 | organization is growing. I think the

00:37:31.240 | problem is that the actual amount of

00:37:33.760 | legislative coordination that these

00:37:36.320 | countries has been able to exhibit has

00:37:38.160 | been literally zero. And the problem now

00:37:41.640 | is that their regional rivalries are

00:37:44.560 | only growing. So China and India, which

00:37:46.880 | are the two anchor partners of bricks

00:37:48.280 | are literally in a land war. There's a

00:37:51.280 | border that they fight over with, with

00:37:53.880 | guns. You have a growing anti Chinese

00:37:57.640 | resentment inside of both India and

00:38:00.800 | Brazil, Nick, you can just throw up this

00:38:02.080 | little chart. In India, they've blocked a

00:38:04.120 | lot of apps, they're about to block a

00:38:05.800 | bunch of imports. But India sees China

00:38:08.640 | as as as an existential threat. The

00:38:11.760 | Brazilian population, this is just a

00:38:13.800 | poll that the economist put in. There's

00:38:16.720 | just a lot of anti Chinese sentiment. So

00:38:19.640 | it's very hard to see folks that are

00:38:23.640 | such polar enemies actually working

00:38:25.840 | together, even if they're part of an

00:38:27.120 | organization. So I think that the the

00:38:29.960 | odds of legislative coordination in the

00:38:32.040 | future are probably less than what they

00:38:34.600 | were even 10 years ago. So I expect even

00:38:37.320 | less and it's hard to expect even less

00:38:38.880 | when nothing has been done. And then the

00:38:41.320 | second is I just look at the data. And

00:38:42.920 | if you look at swift in July, you know,

00:38:45.760 | the swift volumes on us dollars was the

00:38:49.040 | largest ever. And so it's kind of one of

00:38:51.560 | these weird things where I think that

00:38:54.400 | it's good that that organization exists.

00:38:56.040 | Don't get me wrong, because I do think

00:38:57.640 | that if they could Oh, the other thing

00:39:00.280 | that I'll say about the BRICS, which is

00:39:01.640 | kind of odd is that unlike the g7, and

00:39:04.360 | unlike NATO, where you have democratic

00:39:07.040 | ideals that underpin the organizational

00:39:08.800 | framework. Here, it doesn't because you

00:39:11.920 | have China, Russia, Iran, which are total

00:39:15.480 | polar opposites to Brazil and India in

00:39:18.080 | terms of democratic governance. And I

00:39:20.720 | don't know enough about Ethiopia or

00:39:23.600 | Egypt to say anything. So if they

00:39:27.280 | don't get challenged states at a

00:39:28.880 | minimum, one that I'm just saying,

00:39:30.200 | they're not democratic the way like NATO

00:39:32.040 | and the g7 are all democratically

00:39:34.840 | elected countries. It's a very good

00:39:36.360 | point. They don't share the same

00:39:37.480 | operating system, the authoritarians and

00:39:39.360 | democratic nations put together. So then

00:39:41.120 | the last thing is, could you see a

00:39:43.480 | currency framework to compete against

00:39:46.600 | the US dollar. And I think the practical

00:39:48.280 | complexity is if you take all of these

00:39:50.000 | other issues, land wars, import controls

00:39:53.040 | and growing Chinese resentment, and now

00:39:55.480 | try to boil that into an exchange rate

00:39:57.560 | mechanism where the renminbi and the

00:40:01.760 | rupee and the Ray I can be

00:40:05.040 | interchangeable. I think it's very

00:40:07.920 | difficult to see because if you look at

00:40:09.360 | the last time that that happened, the

00:40:11.120 | Frank the lira, the pound sterling, the

00:40:14.200 | Deutsche Mark, that was possible

00:40:16.160 | because all of those other factors were

00:40:18.000 | not on the table, they were not fighting

00:40:19.680 | with each other. There wasn't this anti

00:40:21.560 | resentment in one country to another

00:40:23.400 | country, they roughly held the same

00:40:25.320 | democratic ideals. So I think my comment

00:40:27.920 | is, I think it's good that BRICS is

00:40:29.400 | growing. I think that if they can get

00:40:31.400 | some legislative or policy coordination

00:40:33.680 | wins, it'll be great. The track record is

00:40:36.680 | literally zero. And the setup doesn't to

00:40:40.800 | me mean much yet, but hopefully that

00:40:43.760 | something happens, who knows,

00:40:44.880 | Friedberg or that's, I think, the

00:40:47.640 | arguments about the pragmatism of non

00:40:52.400 | dollar denominated trade, and the

00:40:54.600 | progress that's been realized or can be

00:40:56.520 | projected to be realized from current

00:40:58.280 | policy can be debated. What I think is

00:41:02.800 | most important is the signal that's

00:41:06.840 | being given, which is that there is a

00:41:09.680 | desire by a larger percentage of global

00:41:13.160 | GDP than is represented by the G seven

00:41:15.720 | to de dollar eyes. And so while these

00:41:20.040 | intentions may be difficult to

00:41:21.960 | translate into policy in the near term,

00:41:24.040 | that signal says a lot about the

00:41:29.440 | influence, and perhaps the policy of the

00:41:33.440 | US in addressing and dealing with a lot

00:41:35.160 | of these countries and global economic

00:41:37.600 | actors, but I don't think they want to

00:41:39.200 | de dollar eyes. That's not part of their

00:41:41.120 | they want to increase trade is the

00:41:42.640 | stated mission and they want to

00:41:44.240 | collaborate on trade that that is that

00:41:46.880 | free state admission. Do you think the

00:41:49.120 | state admission is de dollarization? Or

00:41:50.880 | do you think the implicit outcome is

00:41:53.800 | de dollarization?

00:41:54.640 | No, the local currency support

00:41:56.600 | initiatives are implicit de dollar

00:41:59.000 | de dollarization. I don't hear anyone

00:42:00.800 | saying we got to destroy the dollar

00:42:02.000 | because they're all very important trade

00:42:03.640 | partners. Most of those countries are

00:42:05.800 | very important trade partners with the

00:42:07.280 | US and very dependent on on trade with

00:42:10.240 | the US. It seems less that it's about,

00:42:12.360 | hey, we've got to hurt the US and it's

00:42:14.680 | more about we have to be independent

00:42:16.240 | from the US. We have to be independent,

00:42:18.600 | implicit in that is independent from the

00:42:20.560 | US. So and I think that that tone that

00:42:23.040 | signal says a lot about US economic

00:42:26.440 | policy and US foreign policy, that

00:42:28.920 | there's something off with the

00:42:32.000 | unipolarity is a sax has pointed out

00:42:34.240 | that it's not de facto anymore, that

00:42:36.480 | there is intention here for there to be

00:42:39.280 | something different.

00:42:40.040 | Yeah, that's very healthy. That's very,

00:42:41.920 | very healthy. And I think that that

00:42:43.160 | opens up avenues and paths that we're

00:42:44.960 | not thinking about today. I know all of

00:42:46.760 | a sudden we'll wake up and we'll be

00:42:47.800 | like, whoops. And we need to be

00:42:49.520 | thoughtful about that.

00:42:50.320 | I think that's the most powerful part of

00:42:51.760 | sax is commentary is that it's a very

00:42:56.320 | firm establishment, even if of the

00:42:59.520 | lack of the non unipolarity of the

00:43:01.520 | world. But the thing that the bricks

00:43:04.040 | have to do is I would just encourage

00:43:06.120 | them book a quick win, there has to be

00:43:09.000 | some policy coordination that they

00:43:11.400 | could do to prove that there's

00:43:13.760 | something there that's more than just a

00:43:16.400 | get together once a year. And that's

00:43:19.000 | been missing for 22 years so far. And

00:43:21.800 | that would have a really important. I

00:43:25.560 | think effect. Yeah, I agree with you,

00:43:26.920 | David. I think that's the litmus test

00:43:28.680 | that hasn't happened yet.

00:43:29.600 | Let me partially agree with that. And

00:43:30.880 | then partially respond to what you're

00:43:32.920 | saying before tomorrow. So it's true

00:43:34.880 | that bricks does not have an impressive

00:43:37.240 | record of accomplishment to date. That's

00:43:40.600 | simply true. However, recent events, I

00:43:44.120 | think have provided the motivation for

00:43:46.160 | this group of countries to now try and

00:43:48.480 | get something done. In the past, it was

00:43:51.080 | just so phenomenally convenient to be

00:43:53.600 | based on the US dollar complex, because

00:43:56.720 | everything's priced in dollars, easy to

00:43:58.280 | transact in dollars. And when you run a

00:44:00.200 | trade surplus, the US has an open capital

00:44:02.800 | account, and you can just park the money

00:44:04.120 | in US treasuries. So there was never a

00:44:06.080 | reason for any of these countries to

00:44:07.440 | want to leave the US dollar complex

00:44:10.280 | until more recently, when again, US

00:44:12.960 | foreign policy has militarized and

00:44:15.800 | weaponized the dollar and to try and

00:44:17.880 | make it a course of instrument to get

00:44:20.280 | these countries to do what the US wants.

00:44:22.360 | And all those countries now are

00:44:24.240 | bristling at that and they want to

00:44:26.280 | maintain their sovereignty. And so now

00:44:28.760 | they have tremendous motivation to get

00:44:30.840 | this done. Now the thing they've

00:44:32.480 | already agreed to and done as part of

00:44:34.720 | bricks is that when you join bricks, you

00:44:36.880 | agree not to sanction any other member of

00:44:39.800 | bricks. That is a meaningful

00:44:42.240 | commitment. And obviously, it has a lot

00:44:44.320 | to do with this Ukraine war, and the

00:44:47.240 | fact that the US has been demanding it

00:44:48.560 | to the whole world sanctioned Russia,

00:44:49.960 | and most of the world has not been

00:44:51.520 | sanctioning Russia. And that's why the

00:44:53.120 | sanctions have not been effective is the

00:44:54.920 | US has not been able to get that done.

00:44:56.480 | The US will not be able to get it done

00:44:58.720 | in the future with respect to at least

00:45:01.560 | the countries who are members of bricks

00:45:03.400 | with regard to their trade with each

00:45:05.520 | other. And as we saw in the percentage

00:45:07.400 | of world GDP, bricks very rapidly once

00:45:10.080 | they add a few more members are going

00:45:11.160 | to be at about 50% of world GDP. So the

00:45:14.480 | US is only gonna be able to influence

00:45:16.200 | call it roughly that half a global GDP

00:45:19.320 | where the US or the G seven is a major

00:45:21.200 | trading partner. Now, what bricks will be

00:45:23.760 | lacking is the way on a technical level

00:45:27.360 | to bring about the sovereignty they want.

00:45:29.640 | So they need to have a way to settle on

00:45:33.920 | clear transactions. And they need to have

00:45:35.880 | a place to park the surplus that's

00:45:37.880 | created for net exporters. And they

00:45:39.880 | haven't quite figured that out yet. So

00:45:41.360 | for example, there's a recent news item,

00:45:43.200 | where Russia, which is selling a huge

00:45:45.920 | amount of oil to India right now, it was

00:45:48.920 | saying that they don't want to

00:45:49.800 | accumulate more rupees. So they've got

00:45:52.600 | to figure out what do we do with all

00:45:53.600 | these extra rupees. So there's a lot of

00:45:55.480 | pieces to figure out here. And that is

00:45:57.720 | why they're saying this is a goal they

00:45:59.320 | have over the next five to 10 years.

00:46:00.960 | It's not one to two year time frame is

00:46:02.920 | five to 10 years, but

00:46:04.080 | let them make they should make their own

00:46:05.600 | euro if they feel so strongly that

00:46:07.440 | they're a great voting block, make a

00:46:09.240 | euro, and then they could all put into

00:46:10.920 | it. And you can see what happens when a

00:46:12.080 | bunch of dictators and a long tail of

00:46:14.280 | failed states now share a common, a

00:46:17.000 | common currency, it's not going to work.

00:46:18.920 | These countries are all each other.

00:46:20.560 | Yeah, states who share

00:46:22.440 | very troubled states, by the way. Yeah,

00:46:26.400 | GDP has been going up like a rocket.

00:46:28.840 | J. Cal, that's the point. Inflation.

00:46:30.760 | Furthermore, their goal, we have to be

00:46:32.120 | democracy, human rights. Yeah, their

00:46:34.440 | goal is not to create a common currency,

00:46:36.840 | like the euro. And I'm just saying in

00:46:39.680 | India and Brazil are not going to

00:46:41.680 | replace you on and rupees with some

00:46:45.200 | sort of new euro like currency. Moreover,

00:46:47.760 | they're not trying to create a reserve

00:46:49.360 | currency that's going to be a currency

00:46:50.600 | for the man on the street. This is about

00:46:52.760 | settlement of global trade flows, and

00:46:55.440 | getting out from under the US dollar

00:46:56.880 | complex.

00:46:57.400 | My point just to be clear, freeberg is

00:46:59.000 | if you were to think of it as a thought

00:47:00.680 | experiment, these to Chamath point, these

00:47:03.280 | are culturally and strategically very

00:47:06.800 | different countries. And I think what

00:47:08.280 | they have in common is that they haven't

00:47:09.960 | been included in the G seven. And really

00:47:12.040 | America's reaction to this should be to

00:47:14.000 | get India out of this and get them into

00:47:15.920 | the G seven and make that strategic

00:47:17.960 | decision that India is the most important

00:47:20.240 | country for us to have strong

00:47:21.120 | relationships with. It's kind of hard to

00:47:23.000 | put Saudi Arabia and put you a in this,

00:47:25.240 | because they don't share the democratic

00:47:27.320 | principles of the rest of the G seven.

00:47:29.040 | But we should be trying to any democracy

00:47:31.360 | that's in the bricks, we should be trying

00:47:33.880 | to include in the G seven that that's the

00:47:35.280 | strategic chessboard that would make the

00:47:36.720 | most sense. And then you would just leave

00:47:38.000 | bricks as all authoritarian dictators.

00:47:40.600 | And they do not work well together. They

00:47:43.160 | always wind up

00:47:44.440 | growing. Brazil is still nominally a

00:47:47.080 | democracy.

00:47:47.880 | No, that's what I'm saying. Like getting

00:47:49.600 | Brazil, I just said getting anybody who's

00:47:51.440 | a democracy and moving them towards

00:47:53.200 | democracy and getting them into the G

00:47:54.800 | seven should be our stated goal. That's

00:47:56.800 | what the West should do.

00:47:57.760 | Lula, who's Brazil's president is one of

00:48:00.360 | the most ardent advocates for

00:48:02.760 | de dollarization. Here's his quote, every

00:48:05.320 | night I asked myself why all countries

00:48:07.600 | have to base their trade on the dollar.

00:48:09.400 | Yeah, they don't they can.

00:48:11.080 | So maybe you can change him. J. Cal,

00:48:13.240 | maybe the CIA will get rid of them.

00:48:14.480 | That's stupid. That's a stupid

00:48:16.320 | statement. Nobody's saying that I just

00:48:18.200 | said the exact

00:48:18.720 | there are people saying that, but

00:48:21.160 | oh, not me. Just to be clear, I get my

00:48:23.240 | mouth out of the exact opposite of what I

00:48:24.760 | just said. I said include my point is, my

00:48:27.400 | point is, this is not a simplistic

00:48:29.200 | dichotomy between dictators and

00:48:31.480 | democracies. Another way to

00:48:33.440 | assess. By the way, South Africa is

00:48:36.040 | just on a population basis. If you took

00:48:39.800 | India out and you got them into the G

00:48:41.120 | seven, it would be majority overwhelm

00:48:42.880 | majority percentage of citizens in the

00:48:45.720 | bricks living under authoritarian rule.

00:48:47.640 | But India,

00:48:49.040 | let me respond to that. And then also

00:48:51.120 | tomorrow,

00:48:51.400 | and it is the largest country in the

00:48:52.720 | world. Now, I mean, this is the that's

00:48:54.000 | the strategic, important piece here, in

00:48:56.040 | my mind,

00:48:56.360 | I think India and the US will pull

00:48:58.440 | tighter together in terms of security

00:49:01.160 | because of a mutual desire to balance

00:49:05.040 | the power of China. So I think tomorrow

00:49:06.680 | is right about that. However, India also

00:49:10.400 | has a very strong anti colonial impetus

00:49:14.160 | to their politics, and especially their

00:49:16.120 | foreign policy. They do not like being

00:49:18.320 | told what to do by the West and the

00:49:21.120 | United States. And in particular, they

00:49:23.240 | do not believe in many of their

00:49:24.280 | politicians said this, we don't see why

00:49:26.240 | we should have to sacrifice for you,

00:49:28.720 | we're going to do what's in the best

00:49:30.040 | interest of our own people. And that is

00:49:32.200 | why India has rejected enormous pressure

00:49:34.960 | from the US not to trade with Russia,

00:49:37.200 | India and Russia as bad as relationship

00:49:39.240 | is between India and China is the

00:49:41.840 | relationship between India and Russia is

00:49:43.640 | very strong. It historically always has

00:49:45.960 | been. And Russia right now is supplying

00:49:48.560 | half of India's oil. And India has

00:49:51.400 | adamantly refused to play along with the

00:49:54.680 | US sanctions, rightfully so. And

00:49:56.800 | rightfully so. Right. They should make

00:49:58.920 | their own best decisions. Right. So I

00:50:00.880 | think a lot of people are thinking that

00:50:03.320 | India is not here to be a bootlicker to

00:50:05.040 | the United States. But that exactly,

00:50:07.160 | exactly. So look, I think India will

00:50:09.320 | pursue its interests. I think when it

00:50:11.120 | comes to security, they will align with

00:50:12.960 | the US to balance the power of China.

00:50:14.880 | But I think when it comes to economic

00:50:16.200 | policy, India will pursue its own

00:50:18.400 | interest, which I think has to do with

00:50:20.160 | maintaining their economic sovereignty.

00:50:22.120 | 100 cheap oil, they need cheap oil.

00:50:24.360 | Yeah, they're developing country, right?

00:50:26.520 | They need they need oil. And that's the

00:50:29.240 | lowest priced oil.

00:50:30.000 | Another way to think about the framing

00:50:32.160 | is that the priorities for many of these

00:50:34.760 | countries for the last two decades have

00:50:37.440 | shifted going from a state of economic

00:50:40.760 | insecurity, civil insecurity,

00:50:42.920 | government insecurity. And as you

00:50:46.600 | obviously establish systems and

00:50:49.160 | certainty in certain elements, the

00:50:52.800 | dollar complex of sex frames it was

00:50:56.120 | very useful in helping them with that

00:50:58.080 | transition. But as they start to move

00:51:00.880 | from emerging market to developing

00:51:03.080 | market to developed market, the

00:51:05.720 | priorities start to shift. And then the

00:51:08.080 | priorities become much more about

00:51:09.880 | sovereignty, independence,

00:51:12.360 | institutional destiny, etc, that kind

00:51:14.400 | of start to make this more realistic

00:51:17.040 | that maybe they don't have their, their

00:51:18.760 | ducks in a row at this point. But

00:51:20.040 | there's certainly a conversation or a

00:51:21.280 | set of conversations that emerges when

00:51:23.080 | you're not worried about civil war, or

00:51:24.600 | you're not worried about economic

00:51:27.160 | strife. And you can now start to think

00:51:29.280 | on a global stage. And that's evidenced

00:51:31.240 | by the PPP data that that's actually

00:51:33.280 | where, you know, you've seen them

00:51:34.720 | become a much larger percentage of

00:51:36.440 | global GDP share over the past 10 or 20

00:51:38.800 | years, that's a good metric, or that

00:51:41.000 | general opportunity to say, hey, I'm

00:51:42.560 | going to shift my priorities now. And

00:51:44.520 | that's why maybe now's the time to

00:51:45.760 | start to pay attention to what's

00:51:46.800 | happening. And think about us policy to

00:51:50.280 | participate in, in some reconstruction

00:51:53.080 | that's necessary here.

00:51:54.000 | I tell you what the most important

00:51:55.480 | here is all this con all these

00:51:57.320 | conversations seem to come back to

00:51:58.640 | energy Chamath, cheap oil, Russian oil,

00:52:01.720 | Saudis, UAE all participating in BRICS.

00:52:04.400 | And then if you look at nuclear, we

00:52:05.800 | just had a bunch of I think it was

00:52:07.760 | senators signing a bill, I think you

00:52:09.880 | might have tweeted it Chamath of

00:52:11.320 | support of nuclear 21 nuclear power

00:52:14.160 | plants are being attracted at this

00:52:15.720 | moment in China, eight in India,

00:52:17.640 | United States only has one, which is

00:52:19.200 | kind of an extension in good

00:52:20.520 | Gerard, actually nuclear,

00:52:21.680 | good driving, just injured, India just

00:52:24.000 | turned on its first home built one. So

00:52:26.040 | just literally today, so big, big news

00:52:28.120 | in India. If we really want to have a

00:52:31.080 | great relationship with India, an

00:52:32.480 | incredible path and with some of these

00:52:33.840 | other countries would be for us to

00:52:35.520 | really invest in these what I don't

00:52:37.840 | understand reactors and help people

00:52:39.480 | build them and help them get energy

00:52:40.840 | independence from Russia's oil, we

00:52:42.560 | should be building 50 reactors in

00:52:44.480 | India, I don't know enough. I don't

00:52:45.840 | know enough to know whether that's

00:52:47.560 | true or not. And part of it is that

00:52:50.120 | would like whether we should be

00:52:52.560 | building those reactors in quotes,

00:52:56.160 | because I don't know what those means

00:52:57.640 | Gen two, Gen three, Gen four reactors,

00:52:59.920 | any small modular reactors, my big

00:53:02.360 | comment in my thread is just more that

00:53:04.760 | I think that the regulatory support in

00:53:07.040 | the United States for nuclear is so

00:53:08.920 | constipated that it's impossible to get

00:53:11.680 | it done. So you could have the

00:53:12.640 | greatest technology in the world. I

00:53:14.440 | just don't see how the laws change

00:53:15.960 | fast enough and the zoning changes

00:53:17.680 | fast enough and the nimby ism goes

00:53:20.600 | away to make these things viable. And

00:53:23.520 | so that's actually the real question. I

00:53:25.320 | don't know if you know,

00:53:26.320 | Freiberg States, what I'm advocating

00:53:28.280 | for here, Saks is, hey, what if the

00:53:30.160 | United States policy was we're going

00:53:31.640 | to help India and some other

00:53:33.480 | countries, they don't need our help.

00:53:35.080 | They don't need our help. They just

00:53:39.200 | turned on their own homegrown nuclear

00:53:40.840 | reactor. We haven't done one in 20

00:53:42.360 | years, but our new, I guess we call

00:53:44.360 | them Gen two, Freiburg. These these

00:53:46.840 | new reactors, would that not be a

00:53:48.760 | possible path if we're spitballing

00:53:50.320 | here to help them get more energy

00:53:53.240 | independence from Russia? Wouldn't

00:53:54.320 | that be a great long play?

00:53:55.800 | They don't need our help. I don't

00:53:56.920 | think you're understanding like it's

00:53:58.200 | like you're saying we're, we're like

00:54:00.280 | Michael Jordan, and we're about to

00:54:01.520 | teach some kid how to throw free

00:54:02.720 | throws. This is not what's happening.

00:54:03.960 | Any help would be helpful. I mean, if

00:54:06.240 | people are trying to build a large

00:54:07.720 | that's not correct. You don't you

00:54:09.080 | don't you don't need a numb nuts to

00:54:10.360 | come and help you build a product to

00:54:11.640 | you. You don't hire some two bit

00:54:13.080 | product manager to help you when

00:54:14.360 | something is scaling and working.

00:54:16.360 | India GDP is going to be 7% a year.

00:54:18.560 | They're off to the races. They're on

00:54:19.920 | a rock ship. They're doing everything

00:54:21.200 | right. What what what can we do? We

00:54:23.440 | can help them rewrite their laws to

00:54:25.480 | make them Byzantine so nothing gets

00:54:27.000 | done. So that zoning is possible. Okay,

00:54:30.080 | as a strategy, if we had the ability

00:54:32.600 | to build nuclear reactors in other

00:54:34.000 | parts of the world, which is exactly

00:54:35.640 | China's policy, that's the belt. I

00:54:38.320 | think I think you in a nutshell right

00:54:39.800 | now is summarizing why there's this

00:54:41.800 | dismissiveness, which is like we can

00:54:43.320 | help them. But what makes you think

00:54:44.840 | you're better?

00:54:45.400 | China is taking the same approach. I'm

00:54:47.960 | saying copy China strategy, which has

00:54:49.800 | been to go to other countries listen,

00:54:51.160 | India might need less help. Other

00:54:52.880 | countries might need more. But we have

00:54:54.920 | this capacity. So what if we want

00:54:57.600 | capacity do we have? We don't have any

00:54:59.040 | demonstrated capacity nuclear. We have

00:55:02.040 | plenty of companies building these new

00:55:03.480 | nuclear reactors freebirth. None of

00:55:04.640 | them work. None of them work. What are

00:55:06.200 | you talking about? What do you mean?

00:55:07.320 | None of them? None of them work. Okay.

00:55:10.520 | None of them work.

00:55:12.200 | When you talk to politicians in a lot

00:55:13.840 | of these countries, what you describe

00:55:17.000 | as Americans coming in and helping they

00:55:19.680 | describe as exploitation.

00:55:21.280 | They call exactly China strategy or

00:55:24.200 | neo imperialism.

00:55:25.320 | Yes, they call it neo imperialism or

00:55:26.960 | neo colonialism

00:55:28.000 | at it as collaborating on energy

00:55:30.240 | independence, broadly speaking. So

00:55:31.840 | you're being

00:55:32.200 | too dismissive. I'm asking you to think

00:55:35.000 | of what you want. Do you want the

00:55:36.960 | Zimbabweans to fly in and mutually

00:55:38.880 | collaborate with you to build

00:55:40.040 | something in America? Would you be

00:55:41.240 | trying to make jokes about me? I'm

00:55:43.720 | proposing a joke. I'm just making it

00:55:46.440 | your joke. I have a very viable

00:55:47.680 | strategy here is, which is to look at

00:55:49.440 | what China is doing. And what China is

00:55:51.000 | doing the Belt and Road strategy, which

00:55:52.520 | we've talked about here on this

00:55:53.400 | program, is trying to help other

00:55:54.960 | countries get more energy. How could we

00:55:57.040 | do that? We do

00:55:58.320 | listen to what Larry Summers said,

00:56:00.120 | remember, he said that when China goes

00:56:03.120 | abroad, they give money for

00:56:06.440 | infrastructure, bridges and hospitals.

00:56:08.400 | Yes. When the US goes abroad, we give a

00:56:10.080 | lecture,

00:56:10.680 | which is exactly

00:56:11.840 | stop this explosion of sanctions. We're

00:56:16.520 | now sanctioning dozens of countries.

00:56:17.920 | Stop weaponizing the dollar, stop

00:56:20.080 | militarizing the dollar, stop seizing

00:56:23.240 | other countries, reserves without any

00:56:26.360 | due process.

00:56:26.880 | Talking about Russia, right?

00:56:27.880 | They're entitled to due process of law,

00:56:30.000 | just like any other country,

00:56:31.240 | the country that invade their neighbor.

00:56:32.880 | So you get just get to steal their

00:56:34.800 | reserves.

00:56:35.440 | Oh, I think it's a

00:56:37.040 | rules based order.

00:56:39.400 | Oh, I think you can just sanctions are

00:56:43.040 | much better than Yeah, starting a war.

00:56:46.160 | Yeah, I think I can have sanctions.

00:56:47.480 | We're talking about we're talking about

00:56:49.200 | the seizing of another country's foreign

00:56:51.080 | reserves, which is what the US did.

00:56:53.360 | Yeah, I would say that's an extreme thing

00:56:56.280 | to do. Except in the case where people

00:56:58.720 | are invading other free countries, and

00:57:00.360 | then it's okay. So what you're doing

00:57:01.520 | right now is

00:57:02.280 | yet this is the way that the

00:57:03.800 | administration reacted. What you're

00:57:04.840 | doing right now is making up the rules.

00:57:06.640 | That's what the rules based order means

00:57:09.600 | to these countries, is that Americans

00:57:11.760 | will make up the rules. Two years ago,

00:57:14.640 | foreign reserves were something that was

00:57:16.800 | not part of American foreign policy.

00:57:19.320 | They were your reserves. Then this

00:57:21.440 | Ukraine war happens by says, Nah, you

00:57:23.680 | know, those are ill gotten gain and

00:57:24.880 | seize them. Those are the new rules. In

00:57:27.800 | other words, the rules base international

00:57:29.640 | order is whatever Americans say it is.

00:57:31.920 | And then you run around saying no, no,

00:57:34.200 | no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

00:57:37.360 | I made this decision together to

00:57:39.160 | sanction Russia. It wasn't just the US

00:57:40.600 | characterizing that. And you know what,

00:57:42.520 | if Hitler was invading other countries,

00:57:44.320 | or Putin or any dictator, I do think

00:57:46.560 | it's fair game to seize their rest of

00:57:47.920 | the world does not buy into this

00:57:48.920 | narrative. 70% of the world does not buy

00:57:51.000 | into this narrative. They understand

00:57:52.640 | those are the US or

00:57:53.680 | and those are majority dictator

00:57:56.640 | countries. 70% of the world's

00:57:58.040 | population does not believe this

00:57:59.400 | narrative about the Ukraine war. They

00:58:01.640 | understand that the US is at least

00:58:03.840 | equally responsible for this war

00:58:05.880 | laughable to say the US is equally

00:58:07.920 | responsible. But that's what the rest

00:58:09.400 | of the country that is you are a

00:58:12.160 | spokesperson for Putin if you believe

00:58:14.040 | that that the US is responsible. Okay,

00:58:17.440 | you know what you can quote any

00:58:18.800 | polling you want. The US believe this

00:58:21.280 | the US is not 50% responsible for

00:58:23.640 | Putin invading Ukraine that is

00:58:25.040 | laughable and disgusting.

00:58:26.520 | Every country, every country that

00:58:30.560 | wants to believe the US is 50%

00:58:32.560 | responsible for Putin invading

00:58:34.160 | Ukraine. Unbelievable. It's not

00:58:35.640 | about what I believe. It's about what

00:58:36.960 | the last thing you what you believe

00:58:38.120 | you said it. So do you believe 50%

00:58:40.280 | were 50% responsible for Putin

00:58:42.480 | impending Ukraine? That's

00:58:43.480 | I don't know what percentages I would

00:58:45.480 | describe but I believe this war is

00:58:47.080 | easily you have 50% Can I finish my

00:58:50.560 | point? Go ahead.

00:58:51.720 | The way you're acting right now is

00:58:55.800 | exactly why all these countries want

00:58:58.480 | to create bricks. They don't want to

00:59:00.800 | be subjected to this virtue signaling

00:59:04.080 | foreign policy by the United States.

00:59:06.000 | We've discussed the ways many times

00:59:08.360 | the US could have avoided this war. It

00:59:10.120 | did it. Yeah, respectfully disagree.

00:59:12.280 | Putin's responsible for the war. This

00:59:14.480 | is why India does not want to be

00:59:16.680 | subject to the whims of people like

00:59:19.160 | you.

00:59:19.520 | Don't you don't see people like me, I

00:59:22.080 | think the West made the decision that

00:59:24.160 | we needed to take action against the

00:59:26.120 | US invasion. And listen, the West is,

00:59:29.040 | we don't get to make decisions for the

00:59:30.800 | UK and France and Germany. We don't

00:59:33.040 | get to make their decisions.

00:59:33.960 | Respectfully, they make their own

00:59:35.160 | decisions.

00:59:35.680 | That's not really true. Okay, the US

00:59:38.320 | runs. I think they're selling to you.

00:59:40.720 | The US runs NATO because we pay for

00:59:42.760 | it. All these countries go along with

00:59:44.240 | the US because they like the defense

00:59:46.160 | and security that we provide. The US

00:59:48.280 | calls the audience within the US

00:59:50.400 | calls the shots. So basically, a

00:59:53.360 | handful of people in the Biden

00:59:55.240 | administration, Biden, Newland,

00:59:57.640 | Blinken, Sullivan, that's who makes

01:00:00.520 | the policy. I do not and the rest of

01:00:03.080 | the world does not want to be subject

01:00:04.240 | to their whims.

01:00:05.200 | I respectfully I don't think Biden

01:00:06.920 | gets to choose with Germany and France

01:00:08.680 | and the UK do.

01:00:09.960 | Oh, I think Olaf Scholz is eventually

01:00:12.640 | gonna be voted out. And I think they

01:00:14.320 | should be voted out. I think there are

01:00:15.960 | people are waking up. But

01:00:17.640 | absolutely, they are the lapdogs, the

01:00:19.280 | United States.

01:00:20.080 | We would like to go on to any other

01:00:22.280 | topics.

01:00:22.800 | I want to talk about the summit next

01:00:24.320 | week. I'm really excited.

01:00:25.360 | Sure. Right. We're coming in hot to the

01:00:27.400 | summit

01:00:27.760 | kicks off next Sunday. Really excited

01:00:30.080 | for everyone that's going to join us.

01:00:31.160 | Obviously, we'll be putting out videos

01:00:32.520 | of the content as quickly as we can.

01:00:34.240 | J Cal has, I don't know, Saxon,

01:00:37.640 | Chamath, if you guys are aware, but he

01:00:39.320 | is in charge of the parties. And he

01:00:41.560 | has gone well, well beyond budget on

01:00:44.240 | these parties. They're going to be

01:00:45.640 | outlandish. They're going to be out of

01:00:47.680 | control.

01:00:48.360 | Show the three posters. Let me show you

01:00:50.320 | the posters explain everything. Night

01:00:52.960 | one is our double o seven party or our

01:00:55.600 | bestie Royale, if you will. And here is

01:00:57.600 | bestie Royale presenting on Sunday night

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01:01:10.280 | any spy, you can be in here is bestie

01:01:13.000 | Royale coming at you on Sunday night. A

01:01:16.440 | little poker here is the closing night

01:01:18.480 | party we're going out of order bestie

01:01:19.960 | runner cyberpunk rave with the besties

01:01:22.080 | announcing grimes will be DJing so we

01:01:25.360 | will have grimes doing a set at the

01:01:28.680 | bestie runner price. Awesome. It's gonna

01:01:31.280 | be fun. And so where your best

01:01:34.720 | cyberpunk it could be fifth element, you

01:01:36.600 | could go with any side.

01:01:37.520 | We just say can I just say I give up

01:01:39.240 | right now because Claire's gonna win.

01:01:40.560 | Of course. Yeah, she's whatever. Okay,

01:01:43.160 | she's like, it's not even worth trying.

01:01:44.880 | Well, I'm just gonna come in a t shirt

01:01:46.920 | every day, Blade Runner every day. But

01:01:48.880 | we'll have some neon stuff for you to

01:01:50.400 | put on. Is it gonna be cold outside? No,

01:01:52.920 | this is inside and this is occurring at

01:01:55.160 | a film studio. So we have three

01:01:56.640 | warehouses at a film studio where we

01:01:58.200 | created part of the set of Blade Runner

01:02:00.480 | some incredible Asian street food will

01:02:02.360 | be done. That's awesome. It's gonna be

01:02:04.720 | great. And then Monday night is going to

01:02:06.880 | be absolutely blow the doors at it. Fast

01:02:09.600 | times at Barbie high. And here we are.

01:02:12.400 | Where your best Spicoli outfit, your

01:02:15.240 | best surfer outfit of any kind or sorry,

01:02:18.200 | will this be outside? This is going to

01:02:20.160 | be outside we have a tent for the VIP

01:02:22.680 | party. So the way it works is you

01:02:24.960 | should you should well we'll see what

01:02:26.520 | the weather is. It's gonna be warm. So

01:02:29.760 | you can wear your bathing suit if you

01:02:31.320 | want just wear a trench coat over it.

01:02:32.800 | Chamath if you're going to do a thirst

01:02:34.680 | trap live and in person and Mick will be

01:02:37.920 | DJing again. So the dance floor will be

01:02:39.760 | lit just because we went well over the

01:02:41.400 | budget. We brought in some sponsors to

01:02:43.280 | help us cover the costs. I want to thank

01:02:45.160 | those sponsors I connections which is

01:02:47.360 | actually running the app that we're

01:02:49.560 | using to coordinate the summit. Our law

01:02:52.240 | firm that does the legal work for us

01:02:54.120 | Cooley has agreed to sponsor and there's

01:02:57.360 | a group of entrepreneurs from South

01:02:59.680 | Africa started a company called house of

01:03:01.440 | macadamia as they make macadamia nut

01:03:03.120 | snacks delicious. There's they're

01:03:04.920 | sponsoring and they you know why they

01:03:06.560 | reached out because Chamath and I eat

01:03:08.880 | salt and vinegar pistachio so they made

01:03:10.760 | a salt and vinegar macadamia bag in our

01:03:13.080 | honor I love it. Oh,

01:03:14.120 | I'm just in vinegar like this episode.

01:03:15.760 | And then we've got a group called

01:03:17.480 | pavis which makes mineral based

01:03:19.880 | sunscreen. And obviously they heard us

01:03:21.920 | talking about sunscreen so they reached

01:03:23.320 | out and brew bird which makes a coffee

01:03:26.760 | brewing device came in and wanted to be

01:03:28.680 | a sponsor. So a lot of the sponsors came

01:03:30.640 | to us having heard about us talking

01:03:32.120 | about something on the show. And it was

01:03:34.600 | very helpful in helping us cover the

01:03:35.880 | cost of the event. So I want to say

01:03:37.040 | thank you to all of you guys. Thank

01:03:38.480 | thank you to all of your sponsors.

01:03:39.880 | Thank you.

01:03:40.280 | And then we're doing a high and low

01:03:43.240 | thing at where have incredible food

01:03:46.000 | trucks where we've elevated the food to

01:03:47.720 | like a higher level. And so we want to

01:03:50.800 | pair these food trucks with some nice

01:03:52.000 | wines. And so they sent you a list of

01:03:54.560 | all the different foods and then Bo is

01:03:56.280 | doing the steak at the first night.

01:03:57.760 | Roku sushi really great sushi place in

01:04:00.800 | LA is doing the sushi the first night.

01:04:02.200 | So we got some really great vendors and

01:04:03.840 | all the Asian street food in the

01:04:05.200 | Blade Runner party is gonna be great.

01:04:06.400 | So Asian the last night steak and sushi

01:04:08.440 | the first night and then these elevated

01:04:10.400 | food trucks. So what is my year to do

01:04:13.120 | this?

01:04:13.440 | You're 20.

01:04:15.200 | You're four. Yeah, I'm 24. You're 25.

01:04:18.360 | I'm just gonna tell you in advance that

01:04:21.560 | I'm taking full complete control. You

01:04:26.480 | all you will have to do is show up. I

01:04:27.840 | don't want any intervention. I don't

01:04:31.040 | need to be moved. Please after this year

01:04:32.440 | and last year, I'd please leave me out

01:04:33.960 | of it. Great. I'm taking the sacks

01:04:36.320 | approach. I'm showing up. Where are you

01:04:37.680 | going to do it? Jason? I have three

01:04:39.160 | areas. The biggest grift. Brooklyn.

01:04:41.360 | Exactly. Tokyo. Well, I'll take you

01:04:44.120 | through it. Brooklyn, my hometown is one

01:04:46.600 | so that's in my mind. My favorite city is

01:04:49.480 | Tokyo. You know, I love going to Japan.

01:04:51.200 | So that's in my short list. And then on

01:04:53.080 | the griff side, UAE might be great. I

01:04:55.760 | have some partners there. And so that

01:04:57.240 | could be amazing to do it in Dubai as a

01:04:59.440 | huge

01:04:59.960 | I would be nuts. Dubai would be kind of

01:05:02.120 | crazy. My friend Andrew Sassoon is in

01:05:04.080 | charge of opening. I think it's the

01:05:06.440 | winds casino there. He's in charge of

01:05:08.000 | all the entertainment and nightlife.

01:05:09.400 | That would be incredible. Sassoon can

01:05:11.280 | light it up in Dubai. I also took Europe

01:05:14.800 | off the table because I had the sense

01:05:16.800 | that you might pick

01:05:18.160 | no, I may I may not I may go to Oman I

01:05:21.720 | make but I'm going to go to do a

01:05:22.920 | destination thing which is going to be

01:05:24.680 | yeah, everybody will stay in the same

01:05:26.040 | place. It'll be a much smaller number of

01:05:28.440 | people and it'll be end to end curated

01:05:31.280 | and 750 500 people. There'll be clothes

01:05:36.120 | there'll be everything. Okay, for the

01:05:39.720 | Sultan of science with the sunglasses on

01:05:42.000 | the dictator and the architect. We'll see

01:05:46.720 | you all next time on all in pockets.

01:05:54.840 | Rain Man David

01:05:55.880 | we open source it to the fans and they've

01:06:01.840 | just gone crazy.

01:06:02.640 | Love you.

01:06:03.640 | West.

01:06:03.840 | I squeen of

01:06:04.640 | besties are

01:06:12.880 | dog taking a notice in your driveway.

01:06:16.840 | We should all just get a room and just

01:06:23.960 | have one big huge or because they're all

01:06:25.640 | just like this like sexual tension that

01:06:28.080 | they just need to release

01:06:28.960 | what you're about to be

01:06:32.160 | waiting to get

01:06:36.520 | up

01:06:45.560 | Going all in

01:06:47.560 | You

E144: Biden targets Elon, BRICS challenges the West, Tiger hit piece & more

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