Jeffrey Williams | "Called to Serve Through Science" | Math3ma Symposium 2024
00:00:00.000 | Now, I feel like I'm going to be preaching to the choir.
00:00:10.900 | I was asked to talk a little bit related to what I did last year, but in the context of
00:00:18.540 | calling and vocation, specifically in the areas of science.
00:00:23.700 | And I'm going to be, I know, preaching to the choir to most of you.
00:00:28.500 | Most of you have this perspective, but hopefully there'll be, this will be an example that
00:00:34.540 | will help strengthen your sense of calling and where you fit into the fields that you
00:00:41.240 | work and maybe give you a little bit more equipping to help encourage others that you're
00:00:46.060 | working with.
00:00:48.840 | What motivates this is this question, and I'm sure you get this kind of question too.
00:00:54.620 | How can you reconcile living out your faith, your Christian faith, and work in the field
00:00:59.540 | of science or technology or engineering?
00:01:03.380 | And we all have experienced that.
00:01:06.200 | And I knew that question going into my NASA career, coming to faith in the late 80s, largely
00:01:12.900 | through the ministry of grace to you, like probably also as a shared experience with
00:01:18.740 | many of you.
00:01:19.980 | I knew going into the NASA opportunity in 1996 that I would face that question, working
00:01:28.420 | in the area of science and being in faith.
00:01:30.680 | How can you reconcile the two because of this perception of conflict, right?
00:01:35.660 | And that perception is still very strong.
00:01:39.340 | Another talk I could give would address why that conflict exists, and I did a little bit
00:01:44.380 | of that last year, I think, but I won't have time today.
00:01:48.300 | But we all have experienced that question.
00:01:51.440 | Now we get things like this, right?
00:01:55.340 | Which this comes in an example from the Webb Space Telescope.
00:01:59.660 | So a recent reach into the deep space, and we get questions about that, and of course
00:02:04.260 | we hear the billions of years of age and all of that, and we got the question of light,
00:02:08.980 | you know, the traveling of light, but at the same time we see these things and people are
00:02:14.180 | invoked in awe and wonder, right?
00:02:16.540 | That's the response.
00:02:18.020 | And the farther we look, historically, the more we see.
00:02:22.980 | So it's a great platform to engage with the gospel.
00:02:26.980 | And I think the better question is this, what should inform our worldview regarding scientific
00:02:32.660 | endeavor in our work in science?
00:02:35.500 | And that's what I really want to address here, and again, I might be preaching to the choir,
00:02:40.280 | but hopefully this will help reinforce what many of you already know.
00:02:46.180 | Another example from the Webb Space Telescope, just incredible beauty.
00:02:50.660 | The farther we look in distance, the more beauty we see.
00:02:55.580 | And actually you can go the other way, right?
00:02:58.260 | With a microscope, the farther we look in that direction, the more beauty, the more
00:03:02.980 | awe and wonder that's invoked, the more ordering, and I'm going to talk a little bit about that
00:03:08.620 | in a bit, that we see.
00:03:12.500 | It's without end, and it gives us a glimpse of the concept of affinity.
00:03:17.740 | So just establishing the biblical worldview of our calling, I want to review some of the
00:03:23.380 | basic teachings of scripture that we need to consider.
00:03:28.620 | In the beginning, God created the earth, and the earth was without form and void, and darkness
00:03:34.720 | covered everything, right?
00:03:36.060 | That's the beginning of the creation account.
00:03:39.340 | Let there be light, and there was light.
00:03:40.940 | And I suggest that light is not just the visible light, that narrow spectrum that we see visibly,
00:03:46.940 | but it's all of energy.
00:03:48.340 | It's what energized God's creation.
00:03:52.180 | That's important for us to remember.
00:03:53.680 | This is a key part of the creation account.
00:03:58.300 | And then this, God proceeded over six days to take what was void or empty, and he filled
00:04:06.660 | it in what was without form in space, time, structure, and place.
00:04:15.020 | And I use those words specifically.
00:04:17.220 | He ordered the filling.
00:04:20.420 | And I'm going to focus, perhaps, on the ordering of the filling of God's creation, and how
00:04:29.340 | it relates to our call and our work in science and technology and engineering.
00:04:36.540 | Another example, and I'm going to come closer to earth here shortly, but I wanted to start
00:04:40.940 | out with the newest images from the web.
00:04:49.380 | Another aspect, though, that I want to focus on is the subjective aspect.
00:04:52.900 | Who are we?
00:04:55.140 | Let us make man in our image after our likeness, again from Genesis 1.
00:04:59.540 | There's so much foundational in Genesis 1.
00:05:01.900 | We need to go back there all the time to strengthen the foundation of our understanding.
00:05:07.060 | So he made him in the likeness of God, male and female.
00:05:09.780 | He created them.
00:05:10.780 | We have to remind everybody of that nowadays.
00:05:13.500 | And he blessed them and named them man when they were created.
00:05:17.860 | And he said, "Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it and have dominion
00:05:23.500 | over every living thing that moves on the earth."
00:05:26.100 | And I highlighted the fruitfulness.
00:05:28.520 | We are to be fruitful in our endeavors, in our labors.
00:05:33.740 | We are to subdue the ordered creation that God gave to us and have dominion over it.
00:05:41.900 | Key to our understanding, key to our worldview as we work in our areas of science.
00:05:48.660 | You've given him dominion over the work of his hands from Psalm 8.
00:05:54.180 | Now let's come a little closer to earth here.
00:05:56.860 | And here we have a wonderful picture of, and just to orient you, we've got the island of
00:06:01.900 | Cuba in the foreground here.
00:06:04.060 | We've got the Southeast U.S. so you see the peninsula of Florida.
00:06:06.900 | You can see the Florida Keys sweeping out there.
00:06:09.520 | And you can see the Bahamas and the beautiful, beautiful coral reefs.
00:06:14.620 | Just to put that, when you look at that, what comes to mind from the scripture, from a biblical
00:06:20.860 | worldview?
00:06:21.860 | Well, pulling from the oldest book in the Bible, Job, he stretches off the north over
00:06:27.500 | the void and hangs the earth on nothing.
00:06:30.200 | And as Monica said, there are no strings attached.
00:06:33.180 | He hangs the earth on nothing.
00:06:34.900 | And when you read that chapter, chapter 26, it's speaking of the majesty of God, but it's
00:06:41.140 | speaking from the perspective of being off the planet.
00:06:44.700 | So it gives you a glimpse of how profound it was to me to have the opportunity to be
00:06:49.060 | off the planet and reflect on the truth of scripture with that perspective of viewing
00:06:55.100 | the planet.
00:06:58.100 | Another one of my favorite pictures that brings scripture to mind.
00:07:02.300 | This is what we call the Terminator, which is the line separating the night side of the
00:07:07.940 | earth from the dark side of the earth.
00:07:10.100 | A very difficult thing to photograph because of the difference in the lighting condition
00:07:15.140 | and the aperture of the camera.
00:07:16.820 | But this is one of my favorite pictures trying to capture what we call the Terminator.
00:07:22.020 | In that same chapter of Job, he has inscribed a circle on the face of the waters at the
00:07:27.580 | boundary between light and darkness, perfectly describing from the vantage point of being
00:07:33.740 | off the planet of what we see off the planet, written in the oldest book of the Bible, which
00:07:40.660 | gives testimony to the inspiration of the Bible.
00:07:44.580 | And I leave all of Job 26 as a homework assignment to you, and I'm going to give you a couple
00:07:48.420 | homework assignments in this talk.
00:07:51.420 | It is a profound chapter, and I just pulled out a couple of them, but it ends this way.
00:07:56.140 | Behold, this is but a glimpse.
00:07:59.660 | This is but a whisper of who he is, the thunder of his power.
00:08:04.300 | Who can understand?
00:08:05.300 | And we know if we're familiar with the book of Job, it is a very humbling chapter as we
00:08:10.620 | consider our place before God in the witness of Job and also his friends.
00:08:17.740 | One of my favorite passages of scripture is Psalm 111.
00:08:22.700 | And if you have a Bible, I would encourage you to turn there.
00:08:27.780 | Psalm 111, I'm not going to read the whole thing, but I will point out a few aspects
00:08:34.940 | of the psalm, and then we'll get to verse 2 there.
00:08:38.300 | First it's a psalm of a believer.
00:08:42.100 | In verse 1, he says, "I will give thanks to Yahweh with my whole heart in the company
00:08:48.140 | of the upright in the congregation."
00:08:50.780 | So it's a believer among believers.
00:08:54.420 | It's a worshipful song.
00:08:57.100 | It's acknowledging the works of Yahweh, the work of his hands.
00:09:04.220 | And in the psalm, he rehearses the works of God in different ways.
00:09:10.420 | He rehearses his works of creation.
00:09:13.380 | He rehearses his works of provision.
00:09:15.980 | He talks about food.
00:09:18.100 | He talks about the goodness of his works.
00:09:20.980 | He talks about the wondrous works that are remembered.
00:09:25.320 | He talks about the graciousness and the mercy of God in his works.
00:09:30.180 | All of that is through the understanding and through the lens provided in his work of redemption,
00:09:37.580 | which he acknowledges in verse 9.
00:09:40.380 | He sent redemption to his people.
00:09:42.660 | He has commanded his covenant forever.
00:09:45.460 | That reminds me that in our worldview, as we approach the issues of science and technology
00:09:51.580 | and engineering, we can only understand it through the lens of Scripture, through his
00:09:56.500 | work of redemption.
00:09:58.140 | So we can only comprehend his works of, for example, his creation, his works of ordering
00:10:03.700 | his creation or the provision that we find in the order, his works of sustaining his
00:10:08.500 | creation, his works of providence in life that Jennifer gave witness to, trusting in
00:10:16.940 | that.
00:10:17.940 | We can only comprehend and understand that through his work of redemption, which gives
00:10:22.820 | us the new heart, grants us wisdom, grants us understanding, grants us knowledge and
00:10:29.420 | all of that by grace.
00:10:31.980 | And that's another aspect that we have to remember as we give witness to those around
00:10:35.700 | us, as we work in our different fields, and it motivates us to not only give witness but
00:10:42.860 | to extend grace to those who are blind to these things, right?
00:10:46.860 | So we can't convince, we can't persuade a non-believer to have this biblical worldview.
00:10:53.780 | All we can do is give witness to it, and it is God that will work in the heart as he chooses.
00:11:01.180 | The psalm ends, "The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.
00:11:05.300 | All those who practice it have a good understanding."
00:11:09.020 | But back in verse 2, verse 2 is a profound verse when we have that biblical worldview.
00:11:17.740 | This psalm was known as the scientist's psalm at one point in the 1800s.
00:11:25.620 | And I'll talk a little bit about that in a few minutes, a little bit more.
00:11:29.500 | But this was the verse that was central in the whole psalm that made it the scientist's
00:11:33.900 | psalm.
00:11:34.900 | "Great are the works of the Lord, studied by all who delight in them."
00:11:40.940 | When we first read this, we might be tempted to think, okay, it is a psalm to command us
00:11:45.140 | to delight in God's works, or it is a psalm that commands us to study his works.
00:11:54.000 | But if you look at the grammar, it's not a command at all.
00:11:57.880 | It's a description, right?
00:12:00.380 | The works of God are studied works, that describes the works.
00:12:05.300 | They are studied works, and the believers are delighting believers.
00:12:11.580 | So with a proper worldview in our approach, we delight in our work as we study the works
00:12:18.460 | of God.
00:12:19.460 | It is a characteristic of us as believers.
00:12:23.060 | So those works declared great are studied works by delighting believers.
00:12:30.660 | And that includes his works of creation, provision, providence, and redemption, all understood,
00:12:39.820 | as I said, through his work of redemption.
00:12:42.780 | And as I said, that psalm became known as the scientist's psalm.
00:12:48.020 | I'm not going to go into why the conflict exists, but I will remind us of the root of
00:12:53.180 | the conflict.
00:12:54.180 | And it's right there also in Genesis, in chapter 3, "Did God actually say?"
00:12:59.540 | And that's the root of all of the conflict that we experience, or we observe, or we get
00:13:05.380 | questioned about, "Did God actually say?"
00:13:08.020 | It's a rebellion against God.
00:13:11.660 | And just one passage, also out of scripture, "In those days, there were no king in Israel.
00:13:16.440 | Every man did what was right in his own eyes," which is the closing verse in the Book of
00:13:21.200 | Judges.
00:13:22.200 | And it reflects our experience today.
00:13:24.880 | You know, we're all around us, we'll do what is right only in their own eyes.
00:13:32.400 | By the way, that picture, any recognize that picture?
00:13:35.840 | Yeah, Dead Sea, Jordan River Valley, Sea of Galilee.
00:13:43.080 | There's a moonset.
00:13:48.000 | I'm going to spend a little bit more time here in the scriptures.
00:13:51.040 | In Job 28, in the middle of the chapter, it says, "But where shall wisdom be found?
00:13:57.080 | Where is the place of understanding?"
00:13:58.720 | And I also give you Job 28 as homework.
00:14:03.000 | This is the pivotal verse in that chapter.
00:14:06.480 | In the first part of the chapter, it talks about two things, which are reflected in the
00:14:11.000 | verses that I rehearsed from Genesis 1.
00:14:14.920 | It talks about God's provision in the ordering of His creation.
00:14:19.200 | And it puts it in the context of mining operations.
00:14:22.640 | And if you go read Job 28, it talks about there's a mine for silver, a mine for gold,
00:14:29.480 | ore is taken out of the mountain, food grows from the ground.
00:14:33.640 | So it's speaking of God's provision found in His creative work.
00:14:39.040 | And it also says that man, mankind, does that.
00:14:45.360 | He goes to find it.
00:14:47.000 | He searches it out.
00:14:48.760 | He drills a hole in the mountain.
00:14:51.920 | And it acknowledges that no bird of prey can do it, doesn't even think about it.
00:14:57.080 | The lion doesn't do it, the king of the beast, but it's unique to man.
00:15:01.480 | So it acknowledges two things.
00:15:03.240 | One is the rich provision of God's creative work.
00:15:06.880 | And then it acknowledges man's ability to go search it out, to find it, to consider,
00:15:12.960 | okay, what can I use this for, to develop it?
00:15:16.560 | So that gives the basis of the worldview of science, technology, engineering, industry,
00:15:26.040 | is that God-given ability of mankind to extract what He has provisioned, especially so in
00:15:33.480 | His creative work.
00:15:35.520 | But then we have this key verse, "But where shall wisdom be found, and where is the place
00:15:40.240 | of understanding?"
00:15:41.240 | And it goes through, we've heard a rumor of it, we know it's out there, wisdom, but we
00:15:46.760 | can't attain it.
00:15:48.080 | So it's one of those things, although we have such great capability to achieve things, to
00:15:54.080 | achieve technological achievements and other things, we have this great inherent capability
00:16:01.640 | given to all to go extract the provision.
00:16:05.160 | There's one thing that's out of our reach, one thing that we cannot attain, one thing
00:16:08.240 | that we cannot achieve on our own, and that is the attainment of true wisdom.
00:16:13.160 | And I know we could go through discussions of wisdom, human wisdom and godly wisdom and
00:16:17.960 | whatnot.
00:16:18.960 | This is true wisdom.
00:16:19.960 | This is wisdom revealed by God Himself, and that by grace.
00:16:24.760 | So it has to be revealed to us.
00:16:27.920 | And the chapter ends this way, "Behold the fear of the Lord."
00:16:32.400 | That is wisdom, "and to turn away from evil is understanding.
00:16:36.320 | It is by grace that we're granted true wisdom that informs our understanding of God's works
00:16:42.800 | of creation, provisioning His creation and His works of providence, as we've talked about.
00:16:49.800 | So it's kind of key, it's fundamental to understanding the worldview in which we live out our vocations.
00:16:58.360 | And then this theme of wisdom, if you follow that and you go to Proverbs 8, "Whoever finds
00:17:03.920 | wisdom finds life."
00:17:07.600 | And what is it?
00:17:08.600 | What do we think about there?
00:17:09.960 | Well, the manifestation of wisdom is found in Christ, right?
00:17:14.560 | So if we take the life theme there, we go to John 1, "All things were made through Jesus
00:17:20.720 | Christ."
00:17:21.720 | He is the creator of all things, "and without Him was not anything made that was made.
00:17:26.440 | In Him was life."
00:17:28.040 | And again, I'm just giving you the thread through Scripture that becomes the foundation
00:17:35.000 | for a fuller understanding of our calling in our vocation.
00:17:39.880 | I could go to 1 Corinthians 1, I don't have it on the slide, but that's where it talks
00:17:44.080 | about godly wisdom and human wisdom and the paradox there, apart from the grace of God,
00:17:50.120 | which grants us that understanding of Christ and the understanding of wisdom, as Paul writes
00:17:55.680 | in Colossians, in Christ in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.
00:18:02.960 | That's the thread of Scripture.
00:18:04.560 | That's the logic of Scripture that can provide our foundation for entering our vocations
00:18:10.440 | and working in our vocation.
00:18:13.680 | Now, when I get put on a slate to speak, everybody thinks they need to hear about space.
00:18:21.640 | So I'll give you a little bit of space.
00:18:26.000 | Anybody here see a space shuttle launch?
00:18:28.680 | Okay, a couple of you.
00:18:32.400 | It was an amazing experience.
00:18:36.160 | The space shuttle on the launch pad weighed 4 million pounds.
00:18:40.360 | Most of that weight was the fuel and the oxygen, and it produced 7.5 million pounds of liftoff.
00:18:48.240 | And it lifted off at the very precise time to later rendezvous with the International
00:18:53.600 | Space Station, which was my experience and what I was dedicated to my entire career.
00:19:00.120 | And you fired the rockets, not only at a certain point, but in a certain direction, a certain
00:19:06.440 | profile on ascent, fire the engine for a specific time, 8 minutes and 53 seconds, after which
00:19:14.480 | you were out of the atmosphere and accelerating to a speed of 17,500 miles an hour, which
00:19:22.080 | put you in orbit on a trajectory to later rendezvous about 46 hours and a few minutes
00:19:28.480 | later with the International Space Station.
00:19:31.120 | All of those things were very precise, very predictable.
00:19:36.600 | We know that, actually we had a launch attempt this morning that got aborted, I don't know
00:19:40.960 | why, but it was going to the space station, they had a problem, I think that for some
00:19:45.960 | reason they scrubbed the launch, but it was a very precise time.
00:19:50.000 | So I confess, I was actually back there during your talk with my little, on my iPhone, keeping
00:19:56.440 | track of the launch.
00:19:58.840 | But when it aborted, I got tuned back into your talk.
00:20:03.880 | But all of that is a demonstration of God's ordering of his creative work and mankind's
00:20:12.160 | ability to extract that order.
00:20:15.840 | And of course, if those of you that experienced this, it was a very powerful thing to witness.
00:20:28.920 | Not only do we know the time and the direction and the duration and all of that to get the
00:20:33.840 | re, but think about all the work, all the detailed work it took to put it together and
00:20:40.360 | to build it and to get to a level of reliability where we had the confidence to actually light
00:20:47.600 | the torch on fire.
00:20:52.640 | And of course, we've done it not without failure historically.
00:20:57.120 | So we are limited in our ability to do it, but yet we do it.
00:21:01.480 | The provision is there, and we have the ability to extract that provision.
00:21:06.280 | And this is the vantage point it brings you.
00:21:08.360 | I want to read you a couple of quotes, and I think I might have used this quote last
00:21:11.680 | year for those of you who were here, but I didn't have the words on the screen.
00:21:16.280 | From the rocket, we shall see the huge sphere of the planet Earth, like phases of the moon.
00:21:20.760 | We shall see how the sphere rotates, and how within a few hours it shows all its sides
00:21:26.080 | successively.
00:21:27.520 | And we shall observe various points on the surface of the Earth for several minutes and
00:21:31.600 | from different sides very closely.
00:21:34.660 | This picture is so majestic, attractive, and infinitely varied that I wish with all my
00:21:39.380 | soul that you and I could see it.
00:21:43.500 | This was written in 1911 by a gentleman who is known as the father of the Soviet space
00:21:50.960 | program, Konstantin Tsiolkovsky.
00:21:53.640 | 1911.
00:21:55.080 | How is that possible?
00:21:56.080 | Well, it's possible.
00:21:57.600 | He was a physicist.
00:21:58.600 | He was a theorist.
00:22:00.880 | So he, studying the ordered creation around him, he came up with this concept that today
00:22:10.320 | we take for granted, which gives a testimony to two things, the provision in God's creative
00:22:16.840 | work and mankind's ability.
00:22:19.760 | Here's a little bit later another quote, using material ferried up by rockets, it would be
00:22:24.880 | possible to construct a space station in orbit.
00:22:27.960 | The station could be provided with living quarters, laboratories, and everything needed
00:22:32.120 | for the comfort of its crew who would be relieved and provisioned by a regular rocket service.
00:22:38.800 | Exactly describing my experience on the International Space Station over four flights, building the
00:22:43.440 | thing piece by piece, along with many others of course, in that international partnership
00:22:48.680 | and every few weeks having a supply ship show up that we'd have to unload and we would have
00:22:54.200 | everything that we would need.
00:22:55.880 | That was written by a more familiar name to you, in 1945, who was an author of much science
00:23:02.920 | fiction.
00:23:03.920 | Again, building on the concepts that theoretically were possible, that we're seeing because of
00:23:09.400 | the observable mathematical ordering of God's creative work, gives testimony to the provision
00:23:17.320 | and testimony to God-given ability of those who bear his image.
00:23:22.520 | And of course, this is the result and I could give another whole talk on this.
00:23:27.000 | It's an amazing achievement.
00:23:29.160 | I think hopefully it remains a humbling achievement and not one like the Tower of Babel, but resulted
00:23:37.300 | in the International Space Station, which still flies and the rocket that was going
00:23:43.240 | to launch this morning was destined to, and will be destined when they get off the pad,
00:23:48.080 | to the International Space Station, which has had continual human presence in orbit
00:23:52.600 | since the fall of 2000, so 23 and a half years.
00:23:56.960 | And just to give you a little bit of scale, this is bigger than a football field, if you
00:24:02.000 | include the solar arrays out there.
00:24:05.200 | It orbits the Earth every 90 minutes.
00:24:09.200 | It's got a pressurized volume inside the equivalent of a 5,000 square foot house and currently
00:24:13.840 | we're operating with a crew of seven.
00:24:17.880 | And it's got so many elements in it.
00:24:19.840 | Now imagine, we have to duplicate what God has provided here on Earth that is essentially
00:24:26.240 | our life support system.
00:24:28.200 | The atmosphere, the water cycle, everything that the creation provides for us to sustain
00:24:35.960 | our life.
00:24:36.960 | We have to duplicate it up there artificially, but yet we have the ability to do that.
00:24:42.040 | History has shown that, to duplicate God's design in his creative work and have continual
00:24:48.440 | human presence for 23 and a half years.
00:24:52.040 | Here's our view out the window during the daytime and our view out the window at night.
00:24:58.960 | Just incredibly beautiful and an amazing place to go and appreciate the details of God's
00:25:05.720 | work in a very unique way.
00:25:08.600 | Occasionally we get the opportunity to go outside.
00:25:13.040 | I call it the ultimate skydive.
00:25:16.680 | And I had the opportunity to do five of them and when you're outside on a spacewalk, you're
00:25:20.920 | outside for six and a half or seven hours.
00:25:24.040 | So and it takes about six hours just to prepare to go out the door.
00:25:28.200 | But again, duplicated inside that spacesuit is everything needed to sustain your life.
00:25:33.600 | The oxygen debris, the carbon dioxide removal, the humidity removal, maintaining a temperature
00:25:38.960 | that is somewhat comfortable, but not endangering anyway.
00:25:44.120 | Again, given testimony to the provision of God's creative work and mankind's ability.
00:25:52.080 | Some spectacular things you see from that vantage point.
00:25:54.720 | There's a sunset, just the edge of the sun disappearing over the horizon and you see
00:26:00.880 | the clouds that provide the shadows in front of the cloud.
00:26:05.280 | Or in terms of scientific discovery and whatnot, these are called noctilucent clouds where
00:26:12.200 | we would see occasionally over the north polar region during our summertime or the southern
00:26:18.320 | polar region during our wintertime.
00:26:21.480 | We're on the night side of the earth looking up over the north polar region here where
00:26:25.760 | the atmosphere is backlit from the sun, which is on the other side of the earth, showing
00:26:30.360 | these very incredible, very curious formation of something.
00:26:36.360 | And the theory is there are ice crystals carried up very high in the atmosphere above the normal
00:26:43.360 | weather systems.
00:26:44.360 | And of course, I would agree with the theory.
00:26:47.280 | That's probably a good theory.
00:26:48.280 | There are ice crystals carried up there, different layers of the atmosphere and mixed up by the
00:26:54.640 | different air currents, the jet streams and whatnot.
00:26:58.400 | But notice the repeating pattern.
00:27:00.800 | Notice the order, the mathematical order which this crowd appreciates.
00:27:06.680 | It's evident there, it's evident everywhere.
00:27:09.880 | Or the beauty and the design and what is pleasing to the eye.
00:27:14.320 | Here's an example of coral reefs.
00:27:16.540 | These are the Bahama reefs that were part of that picture earlier.
00:27:20.400 | Or a close-up of the largest reef in the Bahamas.
00:27:24.640 | Here's some examples of what we can observe and the beauty.
00:27:29.840 | And notice two things.
00:27:31.160 | One is the objective observation of what we see.
00:27:35.360 | But also our subjective response to that observation reflecting the image that we bear.
00:27:43.520 | In a bleak view of the Grand Canyon right after a snowstorm.
00:27:47.960 | A glacier in Pakistan.
00:27:52.480 | It all draws our attention, right?
00:27:54.360 | Draws our curiosity.
00:27:56.040 | Sand dunes in the Sahara Desert.
00:27:58.400 | Sand dunes became one of my favorite subjects, if you will, to collect some pictures.
00:28:05.080 | Notice the mathematical ordering of these dunes, right?
00:28:09.260 | And we know that from, most of us from our work, we see mathematical ordering in everything.
00:28:14.840 | We know how, if you have a math background, you know how to mathematically describe some
00:28:19.200 | phenomena that we see in nature.
00:28:22.320 | One of my favorite pictures to that effect is this one.
00:28:25.920 | These are also sand dunes in a different part of the Sahara Desert.
00:28:30.120 | But look at this.
00:28:31.120 | It's incredible.
00:28:32.120 | You see the orthogonal lines, the repeating patterns in both large-scale and small-scale.
00:28:39.120 | My favorite picture to show and to give an illustration to the mathematical ordering
00:28:44.100 | of God's creation.
00:28:45.840 | And some of the areas that you all work, by the way, cosmos.
00:28:51.240 | What does it mean?
00:28:52.240 | It's order, right?
00:28:53.600 | As opposed to chaos.
00:28:56.200 | God's creative work is not chaos.
00:28:58.720 | He had ordered it and he filled it.
00:29:01.840 | And how did he order it?
00:29:05.200 | When we look, we see not only the order, we see the precision in that order.
00:29:09.560 | I'll come back to that theme in a minute.
00:29:11.440 | We see beauty, elegance, simplicity, complexity, variety, harmony, symmetry.
00:29:18.880 | I would ask unity or add unity to that list, right?
00:29:23.480 | Unity and the complexity and the diversity.
00:29:26.920 | Some examples in our work, mathematics, trigonometry, geometry, calculus.
00:29:34.680 | Calculus, it took, I went through it three times.
00:29:37.240 | I went through it undergraduate, went through it in graduate, and I went through it again
00:29:40.200 | in experimental test pilot school.
00:29:42.200 | The third time, I think I was finally getting it, right?
00:29:47.680 | But calculus just always amazed me how it could describe the phenomena that we observe
00:29:55.080 | in so many different ways, from basic calculus all the way to partial differential equations
00:29:59.080 | and all of that, everything in between, describing so much of what we see.
00:30:06.400 | And we know that we can describe, we can model things so much with math, in physics, in chemistry.
00:30:13.560 | The periodic table is an obvious example that I give to many.
00:30:20.800 | It's amazing that the elements that have been discovered, and maybe there will be others
00:30:25.400 | discovered in the future, can be described with whole numbers in the order that is reflected
00:30:32.400 | in the periodic table.
00:30:34.200 | Or I talk about optics a lot as well, very predictable.
00:30:38.760 | We go to the optometrist, we find that we need a correction in our vision.
00:30:43.160 | He can measure very precisely through the instruments what our correction is needed
00:30:48.600 | and then he prescribes a lens and we put them on and, whoa, the world is clear again, right?
00:30:54.600 | And all the other things we do with optics, from telescopes to microscopes and everything
00:30:58.560 | in between, is a demonstration of the ordering of God's creative work.
00:31:05.160 | Or in biology, DNA and all of the things that have been learned in DNA and the incredible
00:31:11.680 | complexity, but the precision in the complexity of DNA as a basic information for life.
00:31:22.120 | Or the cellular function.
00:31:24.320 | And we know from the history of, if you go back and trace the history of philosophies of,
00:31:29.680 | related to evolution, which goes all the way back at least to Greek mythology,
00:31:34.040 | you know, the cell was assumed to be simple, right, and then it evolved.
00:31:38.320 | But we know that the cell is an incredibly complex, incredibly ordered.
00:31:43.920 | It's a, it's a, it's a machine with incredible complexity to it.
00:31:50.360 | Or an organism in itself, the human body, any kind of organism that if you take out one
00:31:57.920 | part of the organism, the organism can cease to exist, right?
00:32:01.880 | The irreducible complexity, as you heard that term, all of that is a demonstration
00:32:08.000 | of God's ordering.
00:32:10.240 | Or for those, I'm speaking to a scientific-related crowd here, but oftentimes I speak to folks
00:32:16.640 | that don't like science, don't like math.
00:32:20.440 | I say, well, maybe you like music, and music is another demonstration, and I always pick
00:32:24.920 | on the guitar player, because I'll say, I'll say, I'll take that guitar, and I'll take
00:32:29.440 | that string, and we'll measure the tension on it, and we'll pluck it, and you tell me
00:32:34.240 | what note it, it plays, and then I'm going to take your string, and I'm going to cut
00:32:38.400 | it in half, and pull it to the same tension, and I'm going to pluck it again, what note
00:32:42.280 | is it going to play?
00:32:43.280 | It's going to play the same note, right, an octave higher.
00:32:46.240 | So I use that as an illustration, just to show musicians that don't like science, the,
00:32:53.140 | the ordering God's creative work.
00:32:55.720 | Here's an oblique view of the sun reflecting in the ocean, and different layers of, of
00:33:04.520 | clouds and weather.
00:33:07.040 | There's a lawfulness of nature that we're very familiar with, and it's intelligible,
00:33:12.280 | it's discoverable, it's immutable, it doesn't change.
00:33:16.560 | And there's a stunning provision in that lawful created order, and oftentimes I focus on this
00:33:21.320 | because when we think of provision, we think of the, the raw materials that we extract
00:33:26.400 | from the ground.
00:33:27.920 | But the provision goes so much deeper than that, so much broader than that, in the, for
00:33:32.800 | example, the mathematical ordering that I touched on.
00:33:37.880 | God has granted our, an amazing ability to observe, contemplate, search, explore, discover,
00:33:43.320 | evaluate, develop, and utilize that provision.
00:33:47.020 | Those two things.
00:33:48.020 | He exists, and he's given us the, this ability, and this is common to everybody.
00:33:52.680 | This is foundational to a biblical worldview of the work that many of us are in, and it
00:33:59.340 | also is foundational to us understanding and engaging in that work as a calling, as a vocation.
00:34:08.480 | We are called into that with these basic elements of our worldview.
00:34:16.700 | New York City, which is a great illustration of the history of humanity and the growth
00:34:26.160 | of technology and extracting from God's provision, even apart from his work of redemption in
00:34:32.400 | the hearts.
00:34:33.400 | It's a, it's a common ability given to all mankind.
00:34:37.140 | There's a Puritan by the name of Stephen Charnock, perhaps you've heard the name.
00:34:43.080 | I found this quote when he was talking about the provision of God's creative work in great
00:34:48.520 | detail in that big volume, The Existence and Attributes of God.
00:34:55.480 | All things in the world, he says, one way or another, center in the usefulness for man.
00:35:00.240 | Some to feed him, some to clothe him, some to delight him, some to instruct him, some
00:35:06.520 | to exercise his wit, is what it said originally, or you could say his intelligence, and others
00:35:12.740 | his strength.
00:35:14.080 | So true in the work that we do as we go explore God's creative work, discover things, extract
00:35:21.400 | it, develop it, apply it, utilize it.
00:35:26.040 | It's the perspective that Charnock had, that he drew from the scripture.
00:35:31.040 | Science as we know means knowledge.
00:35:34.040 | It comes from the Latin.
00:35:36.960 | A classically understood scientific endeavor, and I'll get to the classical part where I'm
00:35:42.360 | drawn from in history, the searching out of knowledge to understand God's works, to discover
00:35:48.080 | and utilize the provision found in creation, and to develop that discovered science into
00:35:52.840 | technology for our good and for God's glory, right?
00:35:57.320 | And that motivates us in our calling, in our engagement in this work.
00:36:05.080 | Scientific endeavor is a category of subduing God's ordered creation, going back to Genesis
00:36:10.360 | 1 in those verses that I reviewed at the beginning, and exercising dominion over it, and it contributes
00:36:18.080 | to be fruitful.
00:36:20.840 | Sometimes we say be fruitful and multiply, and we apply the fruitfulness to multiply
00:36:25.280 | and to reproduction, but it's broader than that.
00:36:27.800 | It includes that, but it also includes these other endeavors.
00:36:33.060 | Fruitfulness in life and scientific endeavor certainly is a component of that.
00:36:40.200 | Psalm 111, verse 2, delighting in the studied works of God, and we are called to that work.
00:36:49.240 | So all of this is what is to inform our calling, our vocation in the areas of math and science
00:36:55.760 | and related.
00:36:57.240 | Here's some examples from what I call the age of science.
00:37:01.080 | Sometimes this is called the scientific revolution.
00:37:06.880 | I prefer to call it the age of science.
00:37:09.160 | I might get to it why that is in a minute.
00:37:11.560 | If I don't get to it, remind me if we have time for Q&A, I'll come back to that.
00:37:16.320 | But we all know these names, we all review these names, learn these names in undergraduate
00:37:21.280 | levels of math and science courses, engineering courses, Kepler in astronomy, Boyle in chemistry,
00:37:28.280 | Boyle's law, you learn that if you're a scuba diver or do anything related to scuba diving.
00:37:33.600 | Newton, of course, very familiar.
00:37:36.560 | Euler, if you study math, Euler's equations, Faraday in electromagnetics, Pasteur, we all
00:37:45.640 | benefit from Pasteur's work with the milk in our refrigerator, right?
00:37:50.020 | That's why we call it, it's pasteurized, in his work in biology.
00:37:54.160 | Maxwell, one of my favorites in thermodynamics and electromagnetics, and Calvin, of course,
00:38:00.560 | in thermodynamics.
00:38:02.560 | All of these and many more were theologians first.
00:38:08.600 | And they were driven in their science, answering the call that God had given them by their
00:38:13.560 | theology.
00:38:15.960 | And that should characterize us, right?
00:38:18.840 | If we don't understand biblically why we work and what we work in, then we need to endeavor
00:38:23.960 | to do that.
00:38:24.960 | We need to endeavor and grow in our understanding of the biblical foundations in which calls
00:38:32.960 | us to our work, our vocation, like these guys.
00:38:37.400 | You don't read about their faith in any of the textbooks, right?
00:38:41.820 | But it's true.
00:38:42.820 | If you go, and nowadays with the internet, there's more research, more opportunity out
00:38:47.520 | there to access information.
00:38:50.360 | But you'll find that these guys, maybe we don't agree with all their theology, all the
00:38:55.160 | specifics of their theology, but they were theologians first, driven by their understanding
00:39:02.400 | of what God had revealed and their understanding of their calling in their work of science.
00:39:09.840 | They lived by basic presuppositions in science, and those presuppositions included what we've
00:39:17.280 | been talking about.
00:39:18.320 | There is a rational and knowable ordering in creation.
00:39:22.360 | It didn't arrange itself by chance, right?
00:39:25.040 | We know that.
00:39:28.100 | Everything is ordered.
00:39:29.100 | And I gave some examples in the different disciplines that we work in that demonstrate
00:39:32.860 | that order.
00:39:33.860 | And furthermore, there's a precision in that ordering.
00:39:36.320 | That's why we can launch a space shuttle at the exact second and fire the engine for a
00:39:42.760 | duration exactly, precisely, to get to an orbit.
00:39:47.040 | That's very precise.
00:39:48.680 | That will then, in the trajectory, rendezvous and enable us to dock with an international
00:39:53.160 | space station going at that same precise, predictable speed at a place that's predictable
00:39:59.000 | well in advance because of the precision in the ordering.
00:40:03.600 | I believe, I've come to the conclusion that the precision in God's ordering work is infinite.
00:40:10.520 | His work is infinitely precise.
00:40:12.480 | Even though we sometimes look and we see what is chaotic, in the trees, if you will, of
00:40:19.760 | the forest, there's a precision in the ordering.
00:40:23.120 | We're only limited by our ability to measure it.
00:40:26.360 | And that's very easily seen in history and the best illustration for that is the measurement
00:40:33.420 | of time, right?
00:40:35.680 | Human progress has been directly proportional to the precision that we've been able to measure
00:40:42.160 | time.
00:40:43.160 | Nowadays, we take it for granted.
00:40:45.720 | All of us have a smart device probably in our pocket or a pocketbook.
00:40:51.200 | The only reason they work is because they're all synchronized at some few milliseconds
00:40:55.680 | and I don't know what the number is.
00:40:57.880 | But it enables things like that.
00:41:00.840 | So there's a precision in the ordering and the progress made in scientific endeavor has
00:41:07.680 | increased the accuracy of measuring that precision, of finding it and measuring it.
00:41:14.080 | There's a lawful contingency.
00:41:15.480 | That was the third presupposition in science and that, what does that mean?
00:41:19.760 | That means that the laws, what we call laws of nature or whatnot, the mathematical equations
00:41:28.260 | that we all take for granted are not written on a bumper sticker on creation, right?
00:41:32.880 | They have to be discovered.
00:41:35.000 | They have to be searched out.
00:41:36.840 | And the history of science has done that.
00:41:40.240 | But that's a presupposition.
00:41:42.080 | There's a lawful contingency.
00:41:44.360 | What we see in God's creative work operates in an ordered way, that ordering is precise
00:41:51.680 | and it operates by laws that can be discovered and searched out and applied.
00:41:57.280 | That's a presupposition that informs our scientific endeavor in answering the call.
00:42:03.400 | Now, how can we tie this to scripture?
00:42:05.800 | Well, I go to two verses.
00:42:09.000 | In Christ, all things are held together.
00:42:13.080 | That means they cohere.
00:42:16.920 | That's why we call it a universe.
00:42:18.360 | There's a coherence to it.
00:42:19.720 | There's a logic to it, but it's not obvious.
00:42:22.880 | We have to search it out.
00:42:24.220 | We have to find it.
00:42:25.360 | And that's the subduing, the dominion effort to search out what God has provisioned for
00:42:32.640 | us.
00:42:33.640 | And it comes right there in Colossians chapter 1, or Hebrews chapter 1.
00:42:39.080 | He upholds the universe by the word of his power.
00:42:42.280 | And I love this because the word "uphold," translated "uphold," is related to the word
00:42:49.840 | in Colossians, but it's a different word.
00:42:52.080 | And it has an element of it, in addition, that suggests moving forward toward a goal,
00:43:02.560 | to fulfill a purpose.
00:43:05.000 | So he upholds the universe by the word of his power, his work of sustaining his universe
00:43:13.480 | for an ultimate goal.
00:43:15.640 | And we can point, of course, to the new heavens and the new earth, ultimately, as the goal
00:43:22.760 | with our biblical worldview.
00:43:25.080 | But these were very important, very important for us in our presuppositions of science.
00:43:30.000 | So we need to have presuppositions in science, and I believe these are a great place to start
00:43:36.760 | from a biblical worldview.
00:43:39.520 | Now, given this worldview, then, it's a good reminder for us all to consider our vocation,
00:43:48.400 | the areas that we work, our calling, our assignment.
00:43:52.600 | And in the interest of time, I'll give you those passages as homework as well.
00:43:57.760 | 1 Corinthians 7 and Colossians 4.
00:44:02.440 | We have a duty to answer the call that God has given us in life, right?
00:44:07.280 | It is our assignment in life, and that's what Paul talks about in 1 Corinthians.
00:44:13.600 | In Colossians, Paul's given a reminder, "Hey, tell somebody to fulfill the ministry you've
00:44:18.720 | received in the Lord."
00:44:20.660 | So they're good reminders for us.
00:44:22.520 | What are the elements of that?
00:44:24.840 | Well, it includes what I started out with.
00:44:28.920 | We view and comprehend this worldview perspective, our calling, our vocation through the lens
00:44:35.440 | of redemption.
00:44:36.440 | And, Jennifer, you gave a wonderful testimony for that in the answering of your call as
00:44:42.760 | in God's providence, he unfolded the details of your life.
00:44:49.160 | So we need to always go back to that, always go back and reestablish, affirm, establish
00:44:54.800 | our understanding in those basic elements of a biblical worldview understood only because
00:45:01.080 | we've been granted by grace that wisdom, right?
00:45:05.720 | Which comes by the fear of the Lord.
00:45:07.660 | The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom, and that's granted by grace.
00:45:11.280 | That's his work of redemption.
00:45:13.040 | And only then can we begin to understand our calling, our vocation.
00:45:20.200 | It's recognized then as a gift of grace, unique to you, unique in your abilities, God-given
00:45:28.200 | abilities, and also your opportunities.
00:45:31.360 | It is a gift.
00:45:34.400 | The opportunity that you have to work out your vocation is a gift from the creator to
00:45:40.400 | you, uniquely, and we're all unique in this.
00:45:44.120 | We're all uniquely placed in time, place, and circumstance with unique abilities and
00:45:50.040 | more important, unique opportunities.
00:45:55.200 | And those opportunities can be considered both a personal and a corporate outworking
00:46:02.080 | of providence.
00:46:03.560 | It's personal for each of us, and I think that's probably obvious to each of us.
00:46:07.800 | We can look at our lives and see how God has providentially orchestrated the circumstances
00:46:14.920 | of our life to equip us, to give us opportunities, to help us discern the path when we come to
00:46:21.000 | a fork in the road, to maybe open doors or close doors.
00:46:25.560 | We see that personally.
00:46:27.160 | It's important also to see it corporately, right?
00:46:29.760 | Because we're not here for ourselves.
00:46:32.920 | We're here for the good of mankind and for the glory of God and to give witness to him.
00:46:39.400 | So in fact, there's a, not Charnock, but John Flavel, another Puritan, wrote The Mystery
00:46:46.400 | of Providence, which I read in the early '90s, the first time I think I've read it six times
00:46:51.600 | since then.
00:46:53.800 | It really opened my eyes to see life in this perspective, that we are uniquely placed in
00:46:59.200 | time, place, and circumstance, and uniquely called to our labors in life, and we actually
00:47:08.080 | have a duty to see God's providential outworking in life and to acknowledge it and to give
00:47:16.120 | thanks for it and to accept it for our good, as was rehearsed in the earlier session, and
00:47:26.600 | to see it as both personal and corporate outworking of providence.
00:47:33.280 | It's also a stewardship, and that's also been acknowledged.
00:47:37.840 | I am not by nature inclined to step into a limelight for public speaking or to attract
00:47:49.960 | attention.
00:47:50.960 | My inclination is I'd rather hide in the shadows, I'd rather just do my work and not be known
00:47:55.920 | and seen.
00:47:57.580 | But I recognized going into the NASA opportunity of the stewardship of life, and I recognized
00:48:05.360 | that that would bring unique opportunities or unique experiences that would draw attention.
00:48:14.720 | So how was I going to react to the attention given?
00:48:17.960 | Was I going to go hide in the shadows, which would be my natural inclination, or would
00:48:23.160 | I steward them in a responsible way, and given the opportunities that the Lord has given
00:48:30.320 | me, give testimony to him?
00:48:32.880 | So that really summarizes that understanding of that stewardship, and the responsibility
00:48:39.080 | that comes with the calling that we're given by God summarizes the reason that I'm even
00:48:45.160 | here talking to you.
00:48:48.120 | And each of us have that responsibility.
00:48:50.400 | Each of us have a stewardship of life, of opportunities, of abilities, of all the things
00:48:58.320 | that we engage with life.
00:49:00.120 | We are to steward that for the good of mankind around us and for the glory of God.
00:49:06.840 | It's fundamental to understanding calling.
00:49:11.760 | And that all comes with, as was also witnessed to us so marvelously, with I would say a growing
00:49:19.460 | gratitude and anticipation, and with the motivation for God's glory and the good of others.
00:49:30.040 | So in biblical terms, then, we are all called to be scientists.
00:49:35.560 | And I'll tell this to everybody, those that aren't scientists.
00:49:39.000 | If you understand this, and you go back to Psalm 111, verse 2, and it was called the
00:49:44.760 | Scientist's Psalm for that reason, in that sense, like Luther said, all Christians, all
00:49:50.480 | believers are theologians.
00:49:52.240 | They're to be students of God, right, to study God.
00:49:55.600 | In a similar way, we are all called to be scientists, to be delighting believers in
00:50:01.760 | the studied works of God.
00:50:09.600 | So another way to say some of this is, we shouldn't ask ourselves what we are doing
00:50:20.600 | in this, but what is God doing in and through us?
00:50:25.200 | That's another important aspect of our understanding of our perspective.
00:50:31.380 | What is God doing through you, in you, and through you, and that then in part answers
00:50:39.500 | the call of what we are to steward.
00:50:42.180 | The other thing is, it's often common for us, and maybe you've experienced this, to
00:50:50.980 | be driven, right, in your work.
00:50:55.100 | We're not to be driven, we're to be called.
00:51:00.220 | There's a difference.
00:51:01.220 | I moved to Washington State three years ago, and we arrived on election day, when Biden
00:51:08.540 | won the election, and everybody was distraught, and shortly after that, people were leaving
00:51:14.860 | and moving to Florida and moving to Texas, and I said, "Don't run away," and they'd
00:51:21.220 | say to us, "Why'd you move to Washington, this liberal state?
00:51:24.340 | It'd be like moving to California.
00:51:26.140 | Who wants to go there?"
00:51:29.860 | They were being driven away.
00:51:31.900 | I felt we were being called up there, right?
00:51:35.740 | We can fall victim to that.
00:51:37.100 | We can be driven in our profession, but we're to be called.
00:51:42.500 | Those driven toward satisfaction will be found dissatisfied, is a quote I found.
00:51:46.940 | Those called are called toward anticipation, right?
00:51:50.780 | We can anticipate what God has in store when we're answering the call and not being driven
00:51:55.700 | by achievement or goals.
00:52:02.700 | Science is to be a task pursued and carried out in the spirit of praise and worship.
00:52:07.900 | In our work, we see God.
00:52:10.400 | We see his works of provision, his works of providence, and we see his purpose and wisdom,
00:52:17.220 | greater the works of Yahweh, studied by all who delight in them.
00:52:25.300 | Let's pray and then go to Q&A maybe a little bit.
00:52:29.140 | I can't see with that light there.
00:52:30.900 | I can't see the time, so I have no idea if we have any time.
00:52:35.260 | Dear Heavenly Father, we come before you marveling at who you are and how you have revealed yourself
00:52:42.940 | in your works, your works of creation, your works of provisioning and ordering your creation
00:52:49.220 | in such amazing ways.
00:52:51.340 | When we consider the work that you've given us in our calling and the opportunities given
00:52:55.860 | in life, it magnifies the significance when we consider these basic fundamental truths
00:53:03.060 | of Scripture in which you have revealed yourself.
00:53:07.100 | Lord, help us be established with that biblical understanding, that biblical worldview to
00:53:13.180 | be faithful to answer the call that you've given each of us to steward the opportunities,
00:53:20.220 | to steward the talents that you've given us, Lord, for the good of those around us and
00:53:26.620 | the good of future generations and ultimately for the glory of God, in whose name we pray.
00:53:32.820 | Amen.
00:53:33.820 | Amen.
00:53:34.820 | Thank you so much.
00:53:38.820 | Thank you for the encouragement to be excited.
00:53:45.900 | I love the reminder that because we're steward, we're pressures off.
00:53:51.500 | The Lord is doing the work, and I just love that because we can definitely feel pressure
00:53:57.020 | to be ministers of the gospel, but the Lord is orchestrating all of that.
00:54:04.240 | If anyone has any questions, I'm happy to pass the microphone to you.
00:54:07.660 | Please raise your hand.
00:54:09.700 | Hi, Jeff.
00:54:11.100 | Thank you so much for the nice talk.
00:54:13.460 | So I had a question on something you were touching on towards the end about this theme
00:54:18.140 | of calling, but I think you've mentioned before just in your past visits at the Master's University
00:54:23.860 | that sometimes folks will see your gifts and talents and maybe before you went to the Master's
00:54:30.300 | Seminary sort of say, "Jeff, wow, your work at NASA is so amazing, but when are you going
00:54:35.340 | to go into ministry?"
00:54:36.340 | Oh, yeah.
00:54:37.340 | Yeah.
00:54:38.340 | Thank you for that reminder.
00:54:39.340 | Yeah.
00:54:40.340 | So I was wondering, like, should we all just quit and go to seminary or can you speak to
00:54:44.420 | that?
00:54:45.420 | Yeah.
00:54:46.420 | If you really want to be sanctified, quit what you're doing, go to seminary and start
00:54:50.180 | doing real church work, right?
00:54:52.700 | No, most of us have struggled with that question, right, and we've heard those voices around
00:54:57.740 | us or whatnot, but no, that's absolutely a lie.
00:55:01.200 | We're all in ministry, right?
00:55:04.020 | And I would get that question even back, I remember the early '90s, you know, "Are you
00:55:07.980 | thinking about going in ministry?"
00:55:10.060 | I get that all the time, and I kind of maybe evolved, no pun intended, in my understanding
00:55:18.580 | of that, but very quickly I got to an easy answer, "I'm already in ministry."
00:55:25.540 | And each of you are in ministry, right?
00:55:28.900 | There's not this dichotomy that I think was talked about yesterday between the sacred
00:55:34.300 | and the secular.
00:55:35.980 | All of life is sacred, the work that we do, wherever we're doing it, is sacred, right?
00:55:41.140 | So we're all in ministry, we're all giving witness, we're all giving testimony, we're
00:55:45.780 | all answering the call that the creator of the universe, who is also our redeemer, has
00:55:51.500 | given us, and each of us in a unique way, each of us contributing to civilization around
00:55:58.940 | us, the community around us, the extended family around us, the family in our household
00:56:03.700 | in unique ways, answering the call of God.
00:56:06.300 | We're all in ministry through all of life, in all aspects of life.
00:56:10.220 | There's no division.
00:56:11.340 | It's all sacred.
00:56:12.660 | Thank you for that.
00:56:14.560 | She actually gave me that charge a year ago, so...
00:56:19.980 | - Any other questions?
00:56:22.660 | - Yes, over here.
00:56:26.980 | - So being in outer space, I would imagine it was probably unusual to be floating around
00:56:35.260 | and not being sustained by gravity.
00:56:39.280 | After being in space for so long, how was being able to transition back to being used
00:56:44.060 | to gravity after floating around in space for so long?
00:56:46.900 | - It was very difficult.
00:56:47.900 | I call it the relentless force of gravity.
00:56:49.940 | When you come back, then you really appreciate the force of gravity.
00:56:54.620 | You're in a weightlessness for six months at a time.
00:56:57.900 | We exercise every day up there to try to maintain the strength of our muscles, and we're able
00:57:02.680 | to do so pretty successfully with our major muscle groups.
00:57:08.580 | By the way, I just got back from Singapore last Sunday, so that's why I'm catching my
00:57:12.420 | thoughts here once in a while, still recovering from jet lag.
00:57:17.900 | It takes a...
00:57:18.900 | But you can't exercise and isolate every little muscle in the body that we take for granted
00:57:23.360 | and use just moving around in a gravity environment.
00:57:28.300 | So it takes about six weeks working with a trainer, and we have a very well-developed
00:57:34.180 | program that's been developed over years to regain not only our strength, but our flexibility
00:57:41.420 | and coordination, magnifying that when we first get back for the first week or week
00:57:48.740 | and a half is we...
00:57:51.020 | When you first land and you try to stand up for the first time, you have absolutely no
00:57:55.180 | sense of balance because your vestibular system has been ignored by the brain because it's
00:57:59.740 | made no sense for six months.
00:58:02.820 | It's not functional in that environment.
00:58:05.180 | So you're completely reliant on visual cues.
00:58:09.180 | So the first time you stand up, and I did it just as an experiment, I stood up right
00:58:14.180 | away and I had to focus on not only sustaining the strength to remain standing, but also
00:58:21.300 | concentrate on staying upright and not falling over using visual cues.
00:58:27.100 | And I could not stand up if I closed my eyes because of the vestibular awareness, which
00:58:35.260 | lasted a week and a half or so.
00:58:40.380 | I think I can't stand up with my eyes closed anyway, so you're doing great.
00:58:50.380 | The quote you gave about the difference between being called versus being driven, can you
00:58:58.020 | tell us where that quote came from or was that yours?
00:59:01.100 | I got it from someplace.
00:59:02.580 | I wrote it in notes.
00:59:03.860 | I don't remember.
00:59:04.860 | It might've been Oz Guinness.
00:59:07.020 | Oz Guinness wrote a book called The Call, which had a big impact on me back also in
00:59:11.420 | the late '90s, I think is the first time I read it.
00:59:16.660 | We can understand when we're driven by something, what's the source of being driven?
00:59:21.340 | It usually comes from within, right?
00:59:22.980 | It's us.
00:59:23.980 | And it's pursuing some achievement or some goal, but it comes from within.
00:59:34.940 | Calling is a perception that's external to us.
00:59:41.860 | And I liken it to the political moves or whatnot.
00:59:45.500 | I tell people, don't run away from anything.
00:59:49.180 | Don't be driven away from anything.
00:59:50.700 | Be called to.
00:59:53.020 | Even when we move around, right?
00:59:58.700 | We should respond to an external calling of circumstance, of need, of necessity, of open
01:00:05.100 | doors, not just be driven there on our own without, or worst case, being driven away
01:00:12.540 | from someplace, not knowing what you're going to.
01:00:16.420 | That's the difference.
01:00:17.420 | Does that make sense?
01:00:18.420 | Yeah.
01:00:19.420 | Sorry, we have one here and then I'll go up front.
01:00:26.900 | Sure.
01:00:29.140 | Being in close proximity to other astronauts, do you have deep conversations, are you able
01:00:37.140 | to give the gospel message?
01:00:39.500 | Are there other believers?
01:00:41.460 | What's that like?
01:00:42.460 | Yeah, that's kind of an assumption that goes into the question I talked about or related
01:00:48.820 | to what I talked about at the beginning where you get this question, how can you work in
01:00:51.700 | that field and be a believer or whatnot, which reveals the perception that the area of science
01:00:59.300 | is for nonbelievers, right?
01:01:03.900 | It's just not compatible with the Bible.
01:01:06.620 | I give other talks on that conflict that I talked about between scripture and science,
01:01:10.340 | which is rooted in history.
01:01:11.340 | I call it the most successful propaganda campaign in modern history, which is rooted primarily
01:01:18.020 | in the 1800s and then into the 20th century.
01:01:21.700 | The answer is it's no different than here on earth.
01:01:24.900 | Up there, I have flown with other believers and there are many believers.
01:01:29.740 | I would say many.
01:01:30.740 | There are several believers in the astronaut corps, in the U.S. astronaut corps.
01:01:36.580 | I know of one from Canada.
01:01:38.380 | I don't know of any from Europe and none from Russia.
01:01:42.220 | I know from Russia a few that are orthodox and some are very devoted orthodox.
01:01:50.800 | But I did experience opportunities to have conversations.
01:01:55.300 | Some people, you have no opportunity, right?
01:01:57.060 | They're just not interested.
01:01:58.460 | They know of your faith, but they're not going to give you an opportunity to enter into a
01:02:02.500 | conversation.
01:02:03.500 | Others had great conversation about looking out the window and seeing views like you don't
01:02:07.980 | see on your screen and just the awe and wonder of viewing the earth.
01:02:15.940 | So you talk a little bit about God's creation and acknowledging God and whatnot.
01:02:19.860 | And others had opportunity to actually get into talking about Christ and the gospel.
01:02:25.940 | It's always one-on-one.
01:02:28.260 | Peer pressure will usually prevent us from having a conversation if there are witnesses
01:02:33.100 | around of any kind.
01:02:36.100 | But we're still witnessing, right?
01:02:38.340 | We're still witnessing.
01:02:39.340 | I always had a, in fact, no, this one didn't, but I always had a paper Bible on board with
01:02:45.500 | me and I usually had it out and with rubber bands, you know, kind of held open.
01:02:54.420 | Otherwise all the pages kind of float up on a table just outside my crew quarters.
01:02:59.220 | So I mean, you're giving witness to your faith.
01:03:02.880 | Some would engage with me.
01:03:04.020 | Others would avoid engagement just like here.
01:03:08.340 | I never had a hostile reaction by God's grace.
01:03:12.500 | I've never been asked to, I've never been censored or been asked not to speak.
01:03:17.900 | I use discretion like we all should, right?
01:03:20.780 | When I go into a public school, I don't present the gospel in my presentation.
01:03:26.220 | But because I'm, in those days I was representing NASA, you know, in my official capacity.
01:03:35.580 | But as soon as we get to Q&A, it's inevitable that questions come out that are personal
01:03:40.740 | in nature regarding faith and view of God and whatnot.
01:03:45.740 | And then it's personal.
01:03:46.740 | Now it's my personal perspective.
01:03:49.540 | And there's been plenty of opportunity for that.
01:03:51.580 | And we all have those kinds of opportunities as well.
01:03:54.460 | I know it takes discernment, right, to navigate through those circumstances.
01:04:05.020 | Thank you, Colonel Williams, for presenting so well the biblical foundations for doing
01:04:11.260 | science.
01:04:12.260 | I think that's, well, probably in this group you said like you're preaching to the choir.
01:04:15.420 | But we need to know that and tell it to our students and even be ready when someone who
01:04:22.260 | doesn't share our biblical foundation that we say there is this foundation, the presuppositions
01:04:27.460 | you mentioned.
01:04:28.460 | Anyway, thank you for doing that.
01:04:30.460 | I was going to ask you, if you care to comment, what do you think about the future of the
01:04:36.780 | International Space Station?
01:04:38.740 | Well, the plan and the policy for the station is to continue flying it.
01:04:43.700 | And we will continue flying it as long as we have the political support among the partners
01:04:49.340 | and that the leadership is with NASA and the U.S. to continue flying it unless there's
01:04:55.780 | some catastrophic thing that occurs that prevents us from doing so.
01:05:01.220 | There's a lot I could say about that.
01:05:03.100 | You can go -- but ultimately it depends upon the technical durability of it and the political
01:05:10.580 | support to fund it.
01:05:12.660 | So the policy is to fly it now at least till 2030.
01:05:17.780 | And you hear in the news all the time, okay, I got a question yesterday or this morning.
01:05:22.020 | I heard the station's coming down.
01:05:23.660 | Well, the news always reports on this over and over again.
01:05:27.100 | When we started building the space station, it had a lifetime out to 2015.
01:05:32.860 | And then it got extended to 2020, I think, and then extended to 2024, and then 2028,
01:05:40.060 | now 2030.
01:05:41.060 | We're already working to certify it technically to 2034.
01:05:46.980 | So that's been the progression.
01:05:48.980 | As long as it makes sense policy-wise to continue flying it, we have that political support
01:05:52.940 | to do so and the funding that will continue.
01:05:55.620 | I think everybody realizes if we would end the program, we'd be on the ground indefinitely.
01:06:01.700 | And you might be aware that there's a lunar program in development right now.
01:06:06.420 | The pace of that lunar program is going to be very slow just because of the level of
01:06:11.620 | funding.
01:06:12.620 | It's also going to be an international partnership, which adds another layer of complexity.
01:06:17.100 | But it also solidifies the political support of it.
01:06:20.180 | I think the only reason we're flying in space now is because we partnered with the Russians
01:06:25.780 | in 1992-93 because of the geopolitical motivation in that partnership, not for space flight,
01:06:33.820 | but at the time for nonproliferation of nuclear and chemical weapon systems.
01:06:38.420 | We didn't want those things going to Iraq or Iran or North Korea.
01:06:42.660 | We wanted to engage with this new Russia after the fall.
01:06:46.180 | And this was one way proposed and accepted to engage with them, to take what was Space
01:06:51.860 | Station Freedom in the '80s, announced by President Reagan, and what would have been
01:06:57.160 | Mir-2 in Russia, and come up with a proposal to integrate them together.
01:07:04.140 | And that became the International Space Station, which is another whole talk and story.
01:07:09.900 | But an amazing, amazing history in God's providence.
01:07:23.740 | Thank you for your encouraging talk, blending the Word of God with even sharing how we can
01:07:28.940 | think about the theology of it in our personal life.
01:07:31.660 | I guess the question I have is about, you know, you mentioned something incidentally
01:07:35.420 | at the beginning of your talk, how a lot of people are influenced by YouTube and things
01:07:39.700 | like that.
01:07:40.700 | I'm sure in the capacity that the Lord's put you to do ministry, how do you help believers
01:07:45.660 | who may have good theology even about the sufficiency of Scripture, but being led astray
01:07:51.900 | by these things like YouTube?
01:07:53.660 | How do you think that through and minister to people?
01:07:56.060 | Yeah, you're talking about like flat Earth as an example?
01:07:58.500 | Yeah, a lot.
01:07:59.500 | There's so many things.
01:08:01.380 | Yeah.
01:08:02.380 | And I first heard about that when I got sent up to me some comments on social media in
01:08:08.380 | my last flight in 2016.
01:08:11.100 | And when I first read about flat Earth, I thought it was a parody.
01:08:13.940 | I thought it was humor, satire, and it wasn't until I landed in the fall that I started
01:08:21.460 | getting more on the internet and seeing, oh no, this is a real thing.
01:08:24.420 | In fact, I found a chapter of the Flat Earth Society in my city, in League City, two miles
01:08:32.020 | from NASA Johnson Space Center.
01:08:35.740 | And when I went on the road talking, especially in churches, I would get that question all
01:08:40.020 | the time.
01:08:41.060 | And usually it was, hey, it was not, I'm a flat Earther and you're a liar.
01:08:46.140 | Usually it was, hey, I know somebody, there's somebody in our congregation or I have a brother
01:08:51.420 | or I have a cousin or a friend who believes in the flat Earth, can you help me with that?
01:08:59.300 | And in the beginning I tried to engage logically in the argument, to make the argument that
01:09:04.100 | no, the Earth is in fact not flat, that it's as we've been taught in school.
01:09:08.660 | But I quickly realized that in part because I was part of the conspiracy and I was a liar
01:09:13.140 | and I wasn't going to be believed anyway.
01:09:16.700 | And there was no logic in the argument.
01:09:20.460 | It was a fabrication of interpretation of a few figurative texts in scripture and other
01:09:27.000 | things and primarily the authority of YouTube, some influencers out there, which is a new
01:09:32.980 | word in our vocabulary in that context, that there was no logic behind it.
01:09:38.020 | So my answer quickly got shortened to utter foolishness.
01:09:45.080 | And that's all it is.
01:09:47.700 | It's utter foolishness.
01:09:48.700 | And it's a testimony to our fallen nature and the impact of the fall into sin on our
01:09:55.300 | nature and our inability that we all have, by the way, to some degree, our inability
01:10:01.860 | to think clearly, logically, clearly, or, you know, consistently.
01:10:08.500 | Thank you so much.
01:10:11.860 | If you have more questions, please see Colonel Williams over lunch.
01:10:17.740 | And now we're going to break for lunch, but before then, would you please pray for us?
01:10:21.820 | Sure.
01:10:22.820 | Dear Heavenly Father, we come before you again, reminded of your provision, your provision
01:10:26.700 | of even gathering us together here providentially in this place.
01:10:30.740 | We pray that through your provision, through your grace, that we can be an encouragement
01:10:35.060 | to one another, to strengthen and establish us in our faith, that we may give glory to
01:10:40.960 | Christ in our calling and in our work.
01:10:44.460 | We also thank you for the provision of food, the basic necessities of life, Lord, and we
01:10:51.000 | pray your blessing upon the rest of this symposium, as well as your blessing upon the food that
01:10:57.260 | we're about to receive to the nourishment of our bodies to give us strength to continue
01:11:01.980 | in the answering of the call.
01:11:02.980 | In the name of Christ.
01:11:03.980 | Amen.
01:11:04.300 | Amen.
01:11:05.620 | Amen.
01:11:06.120 | Amen.
01:11:06.620 | Amen.
01:11:07.120 | Amen.
01:11:07.620 | Amen.
01:11:08.120 | Amen.
01:11:08.620 | Amen.
01:11:09.120 | [BLANK_AUDIO]