back to indexSession 4: Deeper Discipleship: Counseling the Depressed
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Okay, so we're going to talk about how to help women that come in our life, that come 00:00:12.160 |
to you and they say they're struggling with depression. 00:00:16.880 |
That's a really common, another common temptation that people have. 00:00:23.280 |
And you know, some of my goals this afternoon will be to just talk about how, kind of identify 00:00:32.400 |
some of the definition of depression from a biblical point of view. 00:00:37.400 |
Even look at some people in the Bible that struggled with depression and how they actually 00:00:41.680 |
can counsel themselves out of that and just some differing thoughts, schools of thoughts. 00:00:46.840 |
Now again, let me remind you, I'm not a psychologist. 00:00:50.360 |
I'm a biblical counselor and so I'm not going to come from a psychologist point of view. 00:00:54.920 |
Some of you might have a psychologized view of this topic. 00:00:58.560 |
You were taught that in school, but I don't hold to that school of thought. 00:01:02.840 |
And so don't be offended if I give you the biblical view and it's contrary to what you've 00:01:08.760 |
learned in school because there's just different schools of thought, right? 00:01:12.080 |
Biblical counseling is still lumped into the psychologies because it's not just one psychology. 00:01:19.200 |
There's differing thoughts and so I'm in the world of the biblical counseling psychologies. 00:01:24.800 |
But anyway, let's just start with a big old quote. 00:01:28.920 |
This is Jay Adams again, the co-founder of biblical counseling, and he says that depression 00:01:36.200 |
can all, almost anything can be at the root of depression. 00:01:39.920 |
A person could have a recent illness in which they get behind in their work. 00:01:48.960 |
There could be just the consequences of simple negligence. 00:01:52.480 |
There could be guilt over a particular sin, self-pity arising from jealousy or maybe a 00:02:02.400 |
There could be bad feelings resulting from resentment and worry. 00:02:07.040 |
Really the important factor or fact to remember is that depression does not result directly 00:02:13.680 |
from any of those outside factors, but rather it comes from a cyclical process in which 00:02:19.880 |
the initial problem, whatever that is, is mishandled in such a way that it is enlarged 00:02:27.320 |
in a downward lexical spiral that eventually will plunge somebody into despair. 00:02:31.960 |
So it's the way a person's responding to their circumstances and eventually it could potentially 00:02:39.940 |
And that downward cycle of sin moves from a problem to a faulty, sinful response, thereby 00:02:45.800 |
causing an additional complicating problem which is met by an additional sinful response. 00:02:51.960 |
So usually when people come and they present their problem as being depressed, there's 00:03:02.360 |
Depression can sometimes be just an effect of something they're responding to. 00:03:07.400 |
Now because we live in a fallen world, it's just inevitable that life's going to bring 00:03:12.280 |
hardship and suffering on one level or another. 00:03:15.960 |
I'm sure all of you might be struggling with things in your life. 00:03:19.160 |
I mean I had a student, it was just amazing, here we're going along in our semester, we've 00:03:24.440 |
got two weeks to go, right now's the time where students are doing presentations, you 00:03:31.260 |
And this poor girl over Easter break, her father died. 00:03:46.660 |
She's having to deal with a sudden death of her father that she loved, of course, and 00:03:51.680 |
trying not to allow it to drive her to despair. 00:03:55.120 |
Now there's going to be obvious grief, but how do I keep from despairing without hope, 00:04:06.500 |
But depression has the potential to develop when setbacks in life, like what happened 00:04:12.580 |
to my student, just aren't handled in a biblical and godly way. 00:04:16.580 |
And as Jay Adams points out in that definition, is there's always a potential for it to become 00:04:20.840 |
a downward spiral that will plunge us into despair if we allow it. 00:04:25.380 |
So one of our goals this afternoon is to learn how we can hold to a high view of God in comparison 00:04:35.860 |
Because people are typically just responding to trials that they're trying to endure, and 00:04:42.060 |
just remembering that God always brings great hope to believers when his grace is viewed 00:04:46.700 |
as sufficient and his strength is viewed as real. 00:04:52.340 |
Like David expresses in Psalm 42 and 43, that's a great two psalms that you can read that 00:05:02.500 |
And it kind of helps you to view sorrow and suffering from God's perspective instead of 00:05:10.580 |
So I think, again, what's helpful is just to kind of present a case study. 00:05:14.620 |
I think it's helpful for you to kind of think through these issues by looking at a person. 00:05:21.220 |
This particular case study comes out of the ACBC question that we use when we have our 00:05:30.420 |
We want, so Esther will recognize this, so we want you to think through, I kind of changed 00:05:37.420 |
some of the words, but it's basically the same one. 00:05:41.980 |
I'm going to read the case study, and you just kind of think through this person's life 00:05:48.780 |
And you're being asked, basically, by your pastor to come alongside this woman to help 00:05:55.580 |
So this is somebody that you're realizing, wow, this is going to be interesting. 00:06:11.340 |
And she's come to you because she's been labeled as having depression. 00:06:18.620 |
She says that she's been feeling terribly sad for the last six months, and she's had 00:06:27.600 |
She wants to get to the bottom of this, and so she met with your pastor initially to get 00:06:33.380 |
some counsel, or maybe she met with Esther initially to get some counsel, and they referred 00:06:38.740 |
her to you because they're hoping that you might be able to give her wise counsel on 00:06:46.660 |
And in addition to seeking your counsel, she also shares with you that she's already talked 00:06:51.780 |
with a bunch of friends, and she's asking for their opinion as well, which isn't always 00:07:01.180 |
So she's asking her friends for help, and she says that a lot of her friends struggle 00:07:08.540 |
And so they said that what they did is they received antidepressants for their despair 00:07:14.940 |
from their medical doctor to help with their issue, but they say they claim that the medicine 00:07:21.460 |
seemed to help for a while, but they were beginning to experience some unpleasant side 00:07:26.540 |
effects that Sarah's actually really concerned about. 00:07:30.400 |
And so one of the questions she has for you is whether or not she should see her doctor 00:07:41.860 |
This Sarah represents so many people that I've seen over the years, and she's describing 00:07:48.660 |
something that women struggle with all over the country. 00:07:51.180 |
So to address how to help her, if this were you and you were the person that needed to 00:07:56.660 |
help this gal, I kind of want to just give you kind of a framework or a methodology that 00:08:05.780 |
It's just careful study of people, wanting to ask questions to help them for the glory 00:08:13.180 |
And any of you could incorporate this into your own counsel. 00:08:19.020 |
So it's always going to begin with asking good questions. 00:08:22.740 |
You've got to ask people good questions or ask questions in general. 00:08:25.860 |
You can't just assume that a person is a certain way just because you're making a judgment. 00:08:32.460 |
James 119 says that we're to be quick to listen, quick to listen, slow to speak, right? 00:08:39.940 |
And so if you want to be a compassionate and wise friend who gives good counsel, you need 00:08:45.600 |
to make it your aim to seek to truly understand this woman that you're meeting with and just 00:08:50.940 |
kind of begin to acquire knowledge before you pass any judgment on her. 00:08:55.620 |
We see this played out in Proverbs 18.2, which says that a fool takes no pleasure in understanding 00:09:03.940 |
So we don't, we want to get away from just expressing their own opinion. 00:09:13.140 |
I kind of broke down the data gathering section into six categories. 00:09:18.300 |
But before I go through this, I just want to make a disclaimer. 00:09:20.980 |
I am not saying that you have to come up with 50 questions before you meet with anybody. 00:09:27.260 |
This is just meant as a tool to kind of help you think through this a little more carefully. 00:09:33.020 |
Everybody has their own style, but it is something that you've got to think through when someone 00:09:37.180 |
comes to you and says, "Hey, I am really depressed and I'm despairing without hope." 00:09:42.900 |
So the first thing that I'm going to look at is the physical data. 00:09:46.860 |
You know, as a person who knows that I'm a body-soul person, like I've talked about before, 00:09:52.820 |
I know that there might be something physical going on with this woman. 00:09:56.740 |
And so I'm going to start asking her questions, like I'm going to start off and say, "How 00:10:04.740 |
How much sleep do you think the average college student gets? 00:10:11.860 |
Probably three, four hours maybe, especially when it's getting pretty heavy, if at all. 00:10:16.420 |
But really, it's not a scientific fact, but overall they say that an adult should get 00:10:24.020 |
seven to eight hours of sleep if you're between the ages of 18 to 64. 00:10:29.260 |
And even a little bit less if you're older than that. 00:10:32.500 |
So what kind of questions do I need to ask Sarah? 00:10:49.940 |
I would want to know, are you getting any sleep at all? 00:10:53.940 |
Maybe she just had a baby, you know, and she's not getting any rest at all, right? 00:11:00.580 |
You know, or maybe all of these children, we don't know what their ages are. 00:11:03.780 |
I don't know about you, but when I was having children, they were all like a year and a 00:11:08.620 |
And so I had boom, boom, boom, and I wasn't getting a whole lot of sleep or a whole lot 00:11:14.540 |
So, you know, it could be a situation like that. 00:11:17.660 |
I might even ask Sarah how her diet's been, you know? 00:11:23.380 |
Is she grabbing those, you know, fishy crackers as she's dealing with her kids and that's 00:11:32.700 |
Could it be that she's eating the wrong things? 00:11:36.260 |
For me personally, I know that when I have felt down in the dumps, when I've had those 00:11:40.620 |
kind of emotions that I can't explain, I'll go to the doctor and I would tell Sarah the 00:11:48.940 |
That would probably be really important for you to do." 00:11:54.620 |
That's what was contributing to my depressed feelings. 00:11:58.300 |
And so you've got to get those things checked out. 00:12:01.460 |
And when you have lack of iron, if you've ever had that before, you have chronic fatigue, 00:12:07.780 |
And I was trying to figure out what's going on here? 00:12:10.040 |
But it has an impact on your spiritual health. 00:12:13.520 |
So it's not just the physical, but that was a big contributor. 00:12:20.980 |
Maybe some other physical data you can think through is whether or not Sarah's getting 00:12:26.620 |
Maybe she's the kind of person that's too sedentary, right? 00:12:33.900 |
I was telling one of the students, or students, one of the ladies earlier that when my kids 00:12:39.180 |
were little, I had to get them out, take them to the park. 00:12:43.140 |
I mean, I had to do a lot of physical activities just to stay sane most of the time, being 00:12:50.300 |
But those are some things that we need to think through. 00:13:00.300 |
Another issue is maybe Sarah just has a medical problem. 00:13:03.940 |
If you send her to the doctor for the physical, there are so many things out there that can 00:13:20.260 |
It could just be something as simple as medical that a doctor can help fix. 00:13:26.660 |
And then suddenly you're like, "Wow, that's just not impacting me as much as I thought 00:13:33.220 |
Those are some questions you can ask Sarah on a physical level. 00:13:36.780 |
But the next one is resources, resource data. 00:13:40.180 |
That's when you're trying to just understand where's Sarah even coming from? 00:13:48.180 |
So I need to sit down and I need to kind of talk through the gospel with her. 00:13:51.260 |
I mean, is she coming from a place of belief? 00:13:56.540 |
Do I need to maybe go over the gospel with her if she's a Christian? 00:14:00.100 |
Is she even integrated and interacting with the body of Christ? 00:14:03.560 |
Because people that struggle with depression have a tendency to withdraw from the body 00:14:10.260 |
So it's important to know what's just going on with reference to her involvement in church 00:14:16.460 |
I worry about the people that are withdrawing because they usually start to feel lonely 00:14:20.820 |
and it creates a lot of problems in that sense. 00:14:27.100 |
They get lonely and start to kind of get involved in a pity party. 00:14:34.340 |
We need to know, you know, what kind of questions can I ask Sarah to help me to understand how 00:14:39.940 |
she's responding to the circumstances in her life? 00:14:45.180 |
In other words, you know, if I were to follow Sarah around with a tape recorder, I guess 00:14:49.860 |
we wouldn't say tape recorder anymore, my iPhone, my MP3 player, if I were to follow 00:14:57.820 |
her around and I played it back to her, what emotions would I hear? 00:15:06.020 |
And so the goal is to help her to kind of describe herself through those kinds of questions. 00:15:18.500 |
She said in her, in the case study that she's terribly sad. 00:15:25.140 |
Let me ask some questions about those things. 00:15:32.420 |
This would be something that is kind of talking about what is Sarah doing and not doing? 00:15:37.920 |
You know, is she not able to fulfill her responsibilities as a worker or as a wife or as a mom or whatever 00:15:48.440 |
Because usually depression is an effect of not doing. 00:15:52.540 |
So has she just gotten so overwhelmed now that she's just stopped doing everything? 00:15:57.280 |
And that, the effect of that can be despairing feelings. 00:16:00.440 |
And so I kind of want to know, what have you stopped doing? 00:16:06.480 |
You know, you might even ask her questions pertaining to how she's even growing as a 00:16:18.200 |
Personal convictions data is important too because it has to do with just her attitude, 00:16:27.080 |
You know, what kind of questions can I ask that will help me to understand Sarah better 00:16:31.960 |
I need to kind of understand what is she trusting? 00:16:35.360 |
What is she, where is she really putting her trust? 00:16:50.080 |
What does she see as the most pressing problem if I were to ask her in her life? 00:16:59.640 |
I would want to know what kinds of questions, I would need to know past influencers. 00:17:06.340 |
I would say that our past influences us, but I don't hold to the nurture nature theory. 00:17:11.880 |
It has an influence, but it shouldn't dictate. 00:17:14.940 |
But it does have an influence, and so we would be foolish to say that it doesn't. 00:17:19.280 |
And so I'd want to know what her past life context was, what her present life context 00:17:28.480 |
You know, stuff that she's currently experienced. 00:17:30.760 |
Maybe someone has sinned against her, and that's the whole issue. 00:17:34.840 |
I mean, we haven't, it doesn't say anything about the husband. 00:17:50.920 |
And so you have to ask those kinds of questions to discern, you know, what's going on in 00:17:57.640 |
You might also, we call it halo data, but you could just kind of tell from a person 00:18:03.600 |
on the outside whether they're depressed or not, or at least despairing, because usually 00:18:20.560 |
I remember one counselee I had when I was working with her, she just looked down at 00:18:26.840 |
Her hair was pretty much in her face, and it was just amazing to see how the Lord just 00:18:31.520 |
transformed her life, and she just became this bright flower, you know, just to see 00:18:41.200 |
But often they just seldom laugh, and they just are very, they just physically, they're 00:18:50.120 |
So again, you know, there are just so many people like Sarah in our churches who are 00:18:59.120 |
You know, the world has a lot of answers for that, but as Christian women, how can we help 00:19:04.840 |
our other Christian women with depressed feelings? 00:19:12.120 |
Did you know that it's estimated that 25% of the U.S. population have the label depressed? 00:19:22.200 |
And you know, typically their understanding of depression stems from thinking that because 00:19:27.520 |
they're tired most of the time or they cry easily or stuff in their life is hard, that 00:19:35.120 |
these are things that are causing my depression. 00:19:37.400 |
So they're kind of coming from not really clinical depression, but just, yeah, feeling 00:19:43.840 |
down because of things that are going on in their life. 00:19:49.080 |
You know, maybe we're going to find out that, you know, before kids, maybe she had this 00:19:52.360 |
successful job before she had kids and maybe she got all this respect, you know, at work 00:19:58.920 |
and people really gave her, affirmed her a lot. 00:20:02.160 |
And now she's at home with these little kids who, you know how kids are, they are not going 00:20:14.880 |
But we need to understand how far back the problem goes because we might find something 00:20:22.240 |
You know, maybe she's been discouraged in her marriage for the last four years and she 00:20:26.640 |
just at this point doesn't feel like dealing with it anymore. 00:20:31.060 |
And so I guess just wanting to make the point that if you have someone come to you, take 00:20:41.480 |
If you love her and you care for her, that's going to be a big part of helping someone 00:20:51.080 |
Looking at a definition, a biblical definition by Robert Smith, he was a medical professional 00:20:59.480 |
And he says that depression is that debilitating, weakening mood, feeling, or air of hopelessness 00:21:07.120 |
which becomes a person's reason for not handling the most important issues of life. 00:21:13.040 |
And so we need to ask, why do people get depressed? 00:21:18.000 |
Well, I think over the last few decades, just really in the medical community, there's been 00:21:23.000 |
a huge effort on their part to educate people about depression. 00:21:30.440 |
And really kind of depending on where you go to treat depression is going to be your 00:21:39.080 |
So I'll just kind of take you through how they would think about this. 00:21:43.080 |
If Sarah would have gone to a psychologist for her depression, and they usually hold 00:21:48.560 |
to a psychoanalytical school of thought, they would probably tell Sarah that the reason 00:21:54.660 |
why you're depressed is because you're probably angry about something and you're turning it 00:22:01.520 |
They have some interesting ways of thinking about it. 00:22:04.800 |
That you're looking at your circumstances and you're resentful and it's turning inward. 00:22:10.400 |
They might say also that your depression is caused because you've lost something. 00:22:15.400 |
Maybe you've lost a person in your life, like a parent or a child, or maybe it's a loss 00:22:22.800 |
The world would say that maybe she failed at something in her life and there's a sudden 00:22:29.200 |
So a psychologist is just kind of looking at circumstances that are causal. 00:22:36.160 |
If she went to see a behaviorist, or what we would call a cognitive therapist, they 00:22:41.440 |
would say that her depression stems from a learned helplessness or hopelessness. 00:22:46.800 |
So for her it would be more, when I was growing up as a child I didn't get enough reinforcement, 00:22:53.300 |
my parents didn't boost my esteem enough, and my family was dysfunctional, and that's 00:22:59.880 |
how I view my world and so that's why I'm depressed. 00:23:02.760 |
And so they would say that her depression is from the loss of maybe status or the loss 00:23:12.960 |
So if Sarah's a stay-at-home mom, maybe she's buying into this idea that she's less of a 00:23:20.820 |
Even society tells wives that, wives and moms, you're less of a person if you stay home. 00:23:27.420 |
And so people get depressed over things like that. 00:23:31.700 |
If Sarah went to a doctor, a medical doctor, who held to a biological school of thought, 00:23:37.140 |
they would say that her depression's probably caused by her genetics. 00:23:40.920 |
Maybe her mom was depressed, maybe her dad was depressed, maybe another family member, 00:23:51.900 |
Some doctors say that it's not scientific fact, they make it sound like it is, but chemical 00:24:00.620 |
They know that antidepressants will level a person out and make them feel better, but 00:24:06.780 |
there's no scientific proof of what they say they think it does. 00:24:13.980 |
The same goes for when they tell us that the serotonin levels are low. 00:24:19.280 |
That's just something that they're still looking into. 00:24:24.600 |
So it could be that Sarah has a physical illness. 00:24:29.840 |
It's true that if you have diabetes or epilepsy or anemia, things like that, that can contribute 00:24:39.640 |
But just kind of thinking through why people are depressed, if we look at it from a biblical 00:24:44.320 |
point of view and kind of thinking through all of these different schools of thought, 00:24:50.960 |
one of the best books that I've ever looked at was written by a medical doctor and biblical 00:24:57.160 |
counselor, his name is Charles Hodges, and he wrote a book called Good Mood, Bad Mood, 00:25:04.840 |
It really is kind of speaking more to bipolar I and bipolar II. 00:25:08.440 |
And I might have put it in the resources, but I would really encourage you to read it. 00:25:12.840 |
But he says that there's been a lot of great work done on the topic of depression. 00:25:21.760 |
And it's been at the center of healthcare since the 1980s when I was a young college 00:25:30.640 |
And our country alone, we've spent billions and billions of dollars trying to figure out 00:25:38.680 |
And as far as the secular community is concerned, it's kind of interesting. 00:25:42.920 |
They say that the results are still very discouraging. 00:25:50.040 |
And because research has found that the medication that people are taking, and maybe this is 00:25:54.800 |
you, maybe you found this to be true, the medication they're taking that's prescribed 00:26:05.700 |
But it's actually causing other significant problems. 00:26:08.640 |
And I would even go as far as to say that I think sometimes that bipolar 1 and 2 is 00:26:14.760 |
Because that seems to be what you see in research. 00:26:30.960 |
And it's all fine and good, and this person wants to go on it for her depressed feelings. 00:26:35.640 |
But have you heard of the side effects that they talk about on TV? 00:26:38.920 |
I mean, the side effects sound worse than the actual issue. 00:26:47.840 |
Because what I'll do with a person, again, you have the freedom in Christ to be on medication. 00:26:53.440 |
But what I at least want to do is help a person to realize what the side effects are. 00:26:58.320 |
I mean, make an informed decision before you decide to do this. 00:27:02.760 |
We can walk through this biblically together before you take that big jump. 00:27:08.000 |
Because medicine will make you feel better, but it doesn't deal with the heart. 00:27:12.560 |
Blistering skin, peeling, loosening of the skin, blurred vision, change in consciousness, 00:27:19.120 |
chills, cold sweats, confusion, difficulty swallowing, dizziness, faintness, lightheartedness 00:27:25.040 |
when getting up suddenly, eye pain, fainting, irregular heartbeat, muscle pain, sores, ulcers, 00:27:32.480 |
white spots in the mouth, unpleasant breath odor, upper right stomach pain, vomiting of 00:27:44.700 |
And that's what you get because you're dealing with medication. 00:27:50.200 |
But again, I mean, if Sarah were to go to her doctor and her-- because I'm not a medical 00:27:55.680 |
I don't prescribe or tell people to get off their medication. 00:27:58.740 |
But if she were to go and that's what they ended up doing, she would have the freedom 00:28:04.820 |
But I would at least want her to think through spending time with me before she makes that 00:28:14.040 |
A couple of years ago, my daughter, Carly, she had a co-worker who actually committed 00:28:20.680 |
And it was really very perplexing because I knew who this guy was. 00:28:39.020 |
And so I began to ask questions about what was going on there. 00:28:42.520 |
And it was kind of discovered in the conversation that he had just gone on antidepressants. 00:28:48.740 |
And that concerned me because he was, I guess, apparently struggling with some kind of depressed 00:28:55.800 |
And when I looked up the medication that they put him on, this is what I read about it. 00:29:02.160 |
It may have a role in inducing worsening of depression and the emergence of suicide in 00:29:09.680 |
certain patients during the early phases of treatment. 00:29:14.560 |
I'm convinced that he became very suicidal as a side effect. 00:29:24.040 |
I don't think that his, from what I understand, he was feeling depressed or maybe had just 00:29:29.640 |
depressed feelings but he wasn't suicidal when he went on the medication. 00:29:39.880 |
The sad fact is that those who have been diagnosed with depression, you need to know that really 00:29:44.960 |
only 10% really are, 10% of the people out there. 00:29:52.880 |
They're making lots and lots of money on meds out there and that's part of the issue. 00:29:57.440 |
They over-diagnose and they're so quick to give people drugs to deal with depressed feelings. 00:30:07.040 |
I think one of the issues is just not making a distinction between true depression versus 00:30:15.040 |
I think we're just not really thinking through that carefully. 00:30:18.120 |
I mean, for example, if you know a person that's truly clinically depressed, there are 00:30:23.840 |
just some real common characteristics you see. 00:30:32.100 |
They're not out there working or going to school or doing whatever. 00:30:39.920 |
He had a very difficult circumstance happen and he responded by spiraling into depression 00:30:51.980 |
He lost a tremendous amount of weight, about 40 pounds, and he was very restless and all 00:31:01.840 |
That's kind of more clinical depression, right? 00:31:05.720 |
They're like what you would say down and out. 00:31:10.500 |
And some of that was triggered by physical issues and medication and spiritual issues. 00:31:15.240 |
But most people are just in a state of just discouragement or sadness over something going 00:31:24.660 |
And so, you know, they may feel down, but they're functioning. 00:31:33.920 |
They're doing what they need to do, but they just have depressed feelings. 00:31:38.920 |
And so my opinion about people like Sarah that come to counsel that have a label of 00:31:44.360 |
depression, not all, but most I would say in my experience are just really in a state 00:31:53.080 |
So if you look back at your case study, you know, you're going to notice that Sarah said 00:32:02.520 |
They think medicine is going to be the option because even they believe she's clinically 00:32:07.800 |
I mean, that's like their assumption right away. 00:32:10.560 |
Oh, here, you know, let's get you to the doctor and get you on some antidepressants. 00:32:18.360 |
I mean, she could have a medical issue, it's true, but she's not going to know that until 00:32:27.000 |
Do you feel like an overwhelmed mommy sometimes? 00:32:31.120 |
Sometimes you're just overwhelmed with things that we're going through. 00:32:35.360 |
And you know, when our kids are little, it's hard. 00:32:37.840 |
I mean, sometimes even when you have a baby, you get what they call the baby blues. 00:32:43.960 |
And so we need to find out some things about our friend Sarah to make sure that it's just 00:32:50.960 |
And also, I have to say that the world is telling you a lie right now. 00:32:55.160 |
Whenever you watch those commercials, these marketers, they're really savvy because what 00:32:59.440 |
they're trying to tell you is that you need to look for ways to escape feeling sad. 00:33:09.400 |
And believe it or not, that's kind of their marketing plan. 00:33:13.400 |
And they work really hard at it to convince you that you need to have a way of escape. 00:33:19.760 |
And it seems to reflect the attitude that there's just no good that can come out of 00:33:25.640 |
Do you think there's some good that can come out of sadness? 00:33:28.280 |
Do you think it drives you to the Lord sometimes? 00:33:31.200 |
There's a lot of good that can come out of sadness if you have the right perspective. 00:33:35.600 |
And so I think with women like Sarah, if you were just to come alongside her and just have 00:33:40.520 |
compassion and care, and if you were to ask her some good questions, you could just help 00:33:54.840 |
God's Word tells you in Romans 15, 14, that if you are full of goodness, which you are 00:34:00.240 |
if you're in Christ, and you're filled with knowledge, which you are because you have 00:34:04.520 |
God's Word, then you're able to counsel one another by coming alongside and gently guiding 00:34:09.320 |
the Sarahs toward a response that's keeping in her profession in Christ. 00:34:16.120 |
So we may need to introduce her to the Savior, or if she's already in Christ, we just need 00:34:25.400 |
So I'm going to give you a biblical perspective to kind of end our time so you know where 00:34:34.040 |
Here's a very broad perspective for your consideration under the point of biblical 00:34:39.560 |
perspective on the development of depression. 00:34:42.680 |
First of all, depression, as we've defined it, is only possible in a fallen world. 00:34:49.760 |
That's post-fall depression, which is interesting. 00:34:53.720 |
Romans 5, 12 reminds us that just as sin entered the world through one man and death through 00:34:58.400 |
sin, and in this way death came to all people because all have sin. 00:35:03.020 |
So broadly speaking, you need to know that depression is the only logical, rational, 00:35:08.480 |
consistent conclusion of someone that's living without God. 00:35:13.600 |
That's why people in the world get depressed that aren't believers, because they're separated 00:35:18.960 |
from Christ and they don't have that hope that you have. 00:35:23.160 |
I think one regret that my daughter Carly had with her co-worker is she felt guilt over 00:35:29.400 |
this and she's not in control of this guy being saved, but she would have wanted to 00:35:32.960 |
have time to witness more to him, so that's kind of normal to struggle with that. 00:35:38.240 |
But she recognized that he needed hope in Christ. 00:35:41.440 |
That was the big thing at the forefront of her mind. 00:35:44.920 |
Which leads us to the next point, that deliverance from depression or despair or sadness, which 00:35:51.000 |
is one of the effects of the fall, is actually made possible through the redeeming work of 00:35:54.840 |
Christ, and that includes our justification, our sanctification, and just that work that 00:36:05.400 |
Depression and despair isn't just isolated to unbelievers, right? 00:36:09.200 |
How many of you know a believer that's feeling despairing right now? 00:36:20.640 |
And the reason why people struggle with it now is because, my goodness, we still struggle 00:36:29.720 |
We're not perfected this side of heaven, and we haven't perfectly put off the old man. 00:36:34.600 |
We were talking about put off, put on before, but we haven't done that perfectly. 00:36:39.800 |
And we're still working through putting off the old man and putting on the new and being 00:36:47.860 |
We still have the temptation of just difficult circumstances and people in our life and just 00:36:53.720 |
It's hard when you've got difficult people in your life. 00:36:58.920 |
Maybe these other things outside of you are just difficult. 00:37:02.320 |
And we're really only seeing through a glass darkly and only know in part because we're 00:37:07.320 |
at this side of heaven, you know, and so we only have a down payment of our inheritance. 00:37:14.920 |
That's your earnest knowing that we have a future inheritance, but right now we just 00:37:27.760 |
But our hope, however, is knowing that we will eventually experience complete and continuous 00:37:32.960 |
uninterrupted deliverance from depression and all other effects of the fall when we're 00:37:41.880 |
It's not, again, depression, you don't have to be stuck there. 00:37:44.480 |
There's actually hope that you can work through depression. 00:37:48.840 |
And I've got three really great biblical examples for you of people that responded well and 00:37:57.640 |
And you can kind of take that for your consideration. 00:38:02.320 |
You know, the word depression isn't really used in the Bible, that actual word. 00:38:06.260 |
It's usually a synonym like despair or downtrodden or fallen countenance, things like that. 00:38:15.200 |
And the first person that I'd like to have you consider is Cain. 00:38:23.360 |
So we know who Cain is, first son, one of the sons of Adam and Eve. 00:38:28.480 |
And remember, you'll recall he brought an offering to the Lord and that was rejected 00:38:34.620 |
But instead of repenting of this envious attitude that he had towards his brother Abel, he became 00:38:41.640 |
And he responded by being angry and then eventually that kind of spiraled down into a fallen countenance, 00:38:50.320 |
And so Cain kind of becomes an example for us of somebody that has unconfessed sin. 00:38:55.880 |
Sometimes people are just depressed because they have unconfessed sin in their lives. 00:39:02.520 |
And the Lord even tried to help Cain to do what was right. 00:39:05.280 |
Remember, he told him that sin is crouching at the door and you need to repent. 00:39:14.160 |
He actually complicated his sin by adding revenge and adding all these other things. 00:39:20.380 |
And so Cain becomes an example for all of us of somebody who was aware of personal sin 00:39:30.080 |
He made it worse by not dealing with it biblically. 00:39:33.540 |
And he became a wanderer, a restless wanderer, the rest of his life because he wouldn't humble 00:39:39.520 |
David, of course, is the other example of someone we can look to. 00:39:44.400 |
I actually love Psalm 32 because David talks about what life was like when he had unconfessed 00:39:53.880 |
I mean, he is a man after God's own heart, but he is human. 00:40:03.920 |
And not only that, but he made a way for that woman's husband to be killed in battle, and 00:40:09.760 |
so he would be responsible for that man's murder. 00:40:13.440 |
And so he was in sin, and because of that unconfessed sin, he says in Psalm 32 that 00:40:20.360 |
when he kept silent about his sin, he felt as if his bones were wasting away. 00:40:26.000 |
So there was a physical crushing component to his sin, and God's hand was really heavy 00:40:34.240 |
So if you ever want to get an idea of what can happen to you physically, Psalm 32 is 00:40:41.320 |
I mean, he even talks about his strength being dried up. 00:40:44.720 |
But really, thanks be to God, David didn't respond the way Cain responded. 00:40:49.720 |
David actually repented, and he says in Psalm 32, verse 5, "I acknowledged my sin to you," 00:40:56.160 |
and he's talking to God, "and I didn't cover my iniquity. 00:40:59.560 |
I said, 'I'll confess my transgressions to the Lord, and you forgave the iniquity of 00:41:04.480 |
So blessed is the man against whom the Lord counts no iniquity.'" 00:41:08.320 |
So like Cain, David is a person who's an example of a person who became depressed because of 00:41:17.480 |
But unlike Cain, David confessed his sin, and so he was delivered from his despairing 00:41:24.920 |
That could be what's going on with Sarah or your friend, a friend that you know, or even 00:41:33.620 |
And so, you know, remember we talked about bitterness. 00:41:37.200 |
That will lead a person to depression easily if they continue to walk down the road of 00:41:44.720 |
Other reasons why people experience sadness or despair is because they're dealing with 00:41:51.320 |
And Hannah is actually just a wonderful example. 00:41:54.360 |
And so we'll learn from Hannah, and then I'll let you guys be done. 00:42:07.520 |
While you're turning there, I'll just give you some quick background. 00:42:11.720 |
Hannah lived during the time of the judges, and that was really one of the darkest times 00:42:20.680 |
They, you know, this is the time when everybody did what was right in their own eyes, right? 00:42:28.640 |
But despite that, Hannah and her husband would still travel faithfully to the temple in Shiloh 00:42:38.640 |
They were just considered a very devout family. 00:42:43.120 |
But in addition to the difficult circumstances, her environment, if you will, within her community, 00:43:00.720 |
The name of the one was Hannah, and the name of the other was Peninnah. 00:43:05.460 |
And Peninnah had children, but Hannah had no children. 00:43:09.520 |
So the first thing we learn about Hannah's circumstance is that her husband was a polygamist. 00:43:19.360 |
And the second thing it says is that Peninnah apparently had children, but Hannah was barren. 00:43:26.160 |
So that's a very, very difficult circumstance. 00:43:30.600 |
Probably what's happening here is the husband Elkanah, he probably is an example in the 00:43:35.160 |
Old Testament of a man who, when he realized his first wife was barren, he took on a second 00:43:41.000 |
wife because they're always concerned about, you know, carrying on the next generation. 00:43:49.360 |
But as we read on, let's discover what the relationship was like between these two wives, 00:44:01.100 |
So it says, "Her rival," well that's interesting, so now Peninnah's being thought of as a rival. 00:44:06.360 |
"Her rival, however, would provoke Hannah bitterly to irritate her because the Lord 00:44:16.440 |
We find out that Peninnah was not a very nice lady. 00:44:20.640 |
And so that kind of gives you insight into Hannah's just personal circumstance and her 00:44:27.680 |
She lives in a society, first of all, where a woman's identity is found in bearing children 00:44:36.880 |
And now that she's sort of barren, her sterility has made her vulnerable to someone else's 00:44:46.960 |
And so Hannah had to live with this woman day in and day out, listening to her, reminding 00:44:52.600 |
her of her failure to live out her purpose in her life. 00:44:56.360 |
But scripture kind of gives us a glimpse in how she was initially responding. 00:45:04.640 |
"Hannah was greatly distressed, but she prayed to the Lord and she wept bitterly. 00:45:11.680 |
And then she made a vow and said, 'O Lord of hosts, if you will indeed look on the affliction 00:45:16.040 |
of your maidservant and remember me and not forget your maidservant, but will give your 00:45:20.560 |
maidservant a son, then I will give him to the Lord all the days of his life and a razor 00:45:27.520 |
And so, you know, obviously she's in distress. 00:45:30.840 |
That's the same, that word for despair has the idea of being in a state of unhappiness. 00:45:41.100 |
And she's just dealing with a lot of difficult things. 00:45:53.440 |
It's really a clear picture that God used Hannah's sadness to drive her to him. 00:46:01.240 |
And sometimes when we're really deep in discouragement and we're sad, we're not really making that 00:46:06.720 |
God can use that to drive you to him in particular. 00:46:10.880 |
And the first thing that we learn is that she went to the temple and she prayed and 00:46:17.240 |
And so she went to the Lord, she worshipped God. 00:46:21.160 |
She didn't angry, it doesn't say she became angry. 00:46:27.120 |
Rather, she becomes an example to us of somebody who endured her difficult circumstances and 00:46:35.220 |
And she ran to the Lord to find solace there, to find refuge there, to find comfort in him. 00:46:44.900 |
Sometime you need to read through Psalm 119, but there is a verse that talks about God, 00:46:50.860 |
that David begging God to revive him according to God's word. 00:46:55.000 |
Now in verse 11 of 1 Samuel, we also notice that she makes a vow and she cries out to 00:47:03.980 |
And that's important for you to pay attention to because although Hannah's in distress 00:47:10.220 |
and there's a lot of difficult things that are happening to her, I want you to recognize 00:47:13.420 |
that she has a very high view of God and that is going to serve her well. 00:47:18.220 |
She really sees the Lord as the Lord God Almighty. 00:47:21.900 |
She sees him as her deliverer and her distress. 00:47:28.020 |
I mean, with any woman I work with, I'm not going to dismiss or be cavalier about her 00:47:35.740 |
But I'm also going to try to help her to see that she needs to have a higher view of 00:47:42.300 |
And so she sees herself rightly, she sees God rightly, and so she's begging God as 00:47:47.980 |
a servant, which is just another indication of her viewing God rightly, that if he would 00:47:52.900 |
only look on her affliction and would remember her and give her a son that would be fit to 00:47:59.420 |
serve in the tabernacle, she would turn him back to the Lord. 00:48:03.300 |
And we know the rest of the story with Hannah. 00:48:05.340 |
You know, she did have a son later and she did give him back to the Lord. 00:48:09.380 |
But I think as a woman, we can probably really relate to Hannah. 00:48:13.500 |
And as a matter of fact, we all have women in our lives that are having a difficult time 00:48:18.700 |
So she actually becomes a really, really close to home example of what a person goes through 00:48:25.060 |
when they're having difficulty getting pregnant or when they have lost a child to miscarriage 00:48:34.380 |
You know, when I was studying this particular lesson, my daughter's friend had just lost 00:48:40.260 |
a baby and I was just thinking about how sad that is and how despairing women get when 00:48:47.060 |
And it's pretty easy to spiral into a deeper depression if you allow it to. 00:48:53.180 |
But you know, women that we come alongside with, and even for ourselves, we can really 00:48:58.820 |
look to Hannah's example to kind of help us pull out of depression. 00:49:08.940 |
And again, in her case, she allowed her sadness, just drove her to the Lord and she pleaded 00:49:15.900 |
And so she's really an example of someone who prayed regularly, who prayed dependably 00:49:25.660 |
And in the same way, when we're dealing with difficult circumstances like childlessness 00:49:30.040 |
or difficult people in our life, God has got to be the one that we run to first. 00:49:34.180 |
You know, a lot of times we just run to people first. 00:49:40.340 |
And just pour your hearts out to him because, ladies, he really is your comfort. 00:49:49.460 |
So we need to step out in faith because God is there to help you. 00:49:53.940 |
And he's actually using your circumstance to conform you into the image of his son, 00:49:58.580 |
which is so important and why we can even count it all joy. 00:50:02.940 |
Hannah's also an example to us because in her trial, she cast her burdens upon the Lord. 00:50:09.740 |
And that's an example of what we would say right actions. 00:50:13.280 |
If you look at verse 17 to 18 of 1 Samuel, Eli is part of this. 00:50:22.040 |
And after she had been praying to the Lord, Eli answered her and said, "Go in peace and 00:50:28.960 |
may the God of Israel grant your petition that you have asked of him." 00:50:33.380 |
And she said, "Let your maidservant find favor in your sight." 00:50:35.980 |
So the woman went her way and she ate and her face was no longer sad. 00:50:42.080 |
And so, of course, if you know the story, we know that before Eli had made some really 00:50:47.180 |
insensitive remarks to Hannah because when she was praying really deeply, he kind of 00:50:51.480 |
accused her of being drunk, which was really interesting. 00:50:55.240 |
But after Hannah responded in humility and explained the situation, we kind of learned 00:51:01.720 |
that Hannah went away and she ate and her face was no longer sad. 00:51:06.560 |
I think that's such a beautiful picture of someone who just didn't dwell on her plight 00:51:12.720 |
I mean, her situation is difficult, but instead of dwelling on it and just spiraling down 00:51:18.800 |
into this depression that a lot of people succumb to, she actually took the time to 00:51:25.020 |
She cast her burdens upon the Lord, believing that he cares for her. 00:51:29.240 |
And in a sense, she kind of left him in the altar, left him at the altar. 00:51:32.600 |
And then she, you know, went away knowing that a sovereign God was going to take care 00:51:39.880 |
And that just kind of demonstrates a very faithful and patient trust in God. 00:51:43.440 |
And I'm taking a woman through this whole narrative and I'm explaining these things 00:51:49.800 |
I'm trying to help her to see that your sadness doesn't have to drive you into the ground. 00:52:01.480 |
And in the same way that Hannah cast her burdens upon the Lord, we too are instructed to do 00:52:06.760 |
I've quoted 1 Peter 5, 6-7 to you before, but we can cast our anxieties upon the Lord 00:52:16.800 |
And so we, you know, God bestows favor upon those whom he loves and we need to believe 00:52:23.360 |
And so that's one way we can humble ourselves when we're discouraged and we're disappointed. 00:52:28.260 |
We can go to the Lord and we can cast those anxieties upon him. 00:52:40.280 |
We know he's not going to allow the righteous to be shaken, but you've got to believe these 00:52:46.760 |
You've got to believe that God's going to do that. 00:52:49.760 |
So if you spend your days fretting and worrying about your life, it's going to result in despair. 00:52:56.560 |
But if we trust in the Lord and we believe that he's sovereign and we can cast those 00:53:02.240 |
anxieties upon him, you know, we're promised that he will care for us. 00:53:08.280 |
You've got to believe that he's really going to do that for you. 00:53:13.360 |
One of the, Jeremiah, I think another maybe passage you could take someone to that would 00:53:19.040 |
be really important would be like Jeremiah 3. 00:53:23.960 |
You know, Jeremiah, I mean, the guy, you know, he was such a faithful man of God, wonderful 00:53:30.800 |
prophet of the Lord, and the people that he was dealing with never repented. 00:53:35.680 |
You know, I mean, he just, just amazing to think about his life. 00:53:44.000 |
But I mean, you know this, I think maybe Jen read this the first night, but I mean, just 00:53:48.880 |
listen to how he deals with his own great sadness. 00:53:52.200 |
He says, "The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases. 00:53:59.840 |
Great is your faithfulness, for the Lord will not cast off forever. 00:54:03.920 |
But though he cause grief, he will have compassion according to the abundance of his steadfast 00:54:08.520 |
love, for he does not willingly afflict or grieve the children of men." 00:54:13.800 |
And so, you know, we just need to encourage women like Sarah that we read about who are 00:54:18.760 |
struggling with sadness and even true depression that God already knows what they're going 00:54:24.840 |
So we need to go to him in prayer and cast our anxieties upon him. 00:54:32.080 |
I think she knew and believed that God would help her with her troubles. 00:54:36.560 |
That's why she laid them there and was content to leave, totally confident that he was going 00:54:43.920 |
And you know, we know that Hannah has a high view of God because if you ever read 1 Samuel 00:54:48.040 |
2, you'll be blown away because you're, you know, when you read it, you'll say, "Wow, 00:54:54.040 |
Because it's what Mary, the mother of Jesus quotes, it's the Magnificat. 00:55:01.320 |
And Mary is remembering that when she reads it. 00:55:07.160 |
So I invite you to read 1 Samuel 2 on your own time because it's just such a wonderful 00:55:15.200 |
This topic is kind of, I feel like I'm just scratching the surface. 00:55:18.820 |
You can, you know, practically have a whole conference just on this issue. 00:55:23.480 |
But as I've kind of already alluded to, you know, I just don't think people know how to 00:55:31.280 |
I think they're buying into a lot of worldly messages and they're just not thinking through 00:55:37.040 |
how the Bible would define that, how people in the Bible have gotten through that. 00:55:41.520 |
I think they're just taking their cues from the world. 00:55:44.480 |
And it seems to be these days that it's Medicaid, Medicaid, you know. 00:55:49.000 |
And it's kind of sad because it doesn't give you an opportunity to really see what the 00:55:55.640 |
But anyways, if I were Sarah's counselor, I would just want to make sure that she understood 00:55:59.920 |
that the inner man, not her brain, which is what the biological community says is her 00:56:05.560 |
source for her thoughts and her intentions and her choices and her emotions, such as 00:56:11.880 |
And so if there's no organic cause contributing to her sad feelings, then I would encourage 00:56:16.040 |
her just to continue to meet with me to see if we can just work through stuff in the Word. 00:56:22.920 |
And I think that that would probably solve a lot because I've met with a lot of Sarah's 00:56:26.840 |
in my life and I've seen them really work through issues biblically. 00:56:33.320 |
Just make sure that, you know, you're faithful with God's Word because Hannah is really an 00:56:38.520 |
example of someone that had right praying, she had right actions, and a right response 00:56:47.920 |
We can go to the Lord and we can pray, we can worship him, we can cast our burdens upon 00:56:55.800 |
And I gave you some really helpful resources. 00:56:59.000 |
This would be helpful for anyone struggling with depression if you want to kind of get 00:57:06.560 |
There's a great book by one of my mentors called Out of the Blues, Dealing with Blues 00:57:14.680 |
Jay Adams has, I think that's, I don't think it's a book, I think it's a pamphlet called 00:57:21.120 |
Of course, Ed Welch has done a lot of great works on depression, but if you want to just 00:57:25.040 |
get the pamphlet, he's got one where you can actually work through it on a homework kind 00:57:31.920 |
And then I just always say, you know, spend some time just memorizing scripture. 00:57:36.920 |
Philippians 4.8 being one that's really helpful, where you can just go to God's Word and just 00:57:43.680 |
list out 10 specific ways God has blessed you. 00:57:46.360 |
I mean, that's the beginning because it's really about how we're thinking. 00:57:53.220 |
I don't even know how you're even awake right now. 00:57:56.760 |
But you've got tools now, so where much is given, much is required. 00:58:06.500 |
So go, come alongside, make disciples, be willing, be a willing servant. 00:58:17.760 |
You've got Esther Kim, who's almost ACBC certified, so she's going to be your wisdom on a lot 00:58:24.480 |
But thank you for having me and enduring a lot of lecture. 00:58:30.440 |
And God bless you, and let me pray for you one last time.