(upbeat hip hop music) - Welcome back to another episode of Curious Mike. I am here with the one and only Nikola Jokic. My boy here. - My boy. - Appreciate you getting on my back. - Of course. - All right, so I kind of want to start with some basketball stuff.

Then we'll move to some, you know, off the court. So obviously you're a two-time MVP. You know, we won the championship last year. And one thing I've always been impressed with is how you continue to get better and better and better as years go by. How do you stay motivated now that you have achieved so much at so young?

- That's actually a nice question. I think the motivation is actually, becomes your lifestyle of being obsessed with the success. I think winning is a lifestyle for us right now. I'm thinking about the team right now. Like, I think like we can win every game. And I think it's like winning is kind of lifestyle and you're getting obsessed with winning and that lifestyle.

It's really, we have fun when it's winning. - Yeah, we talked about that yesterday. Yeah, like, and when we lose, it's like. - It's like, no way. - Yeah, we don't feel right. We won so much now that we just don't feel right losing. - I think that's the, like, I think that's probably my motivation, just like obsess of winning and that kind of lifestyle.

- I agree. - One thing, I don't know if you remember this. My, I think it was my rookie year or maybe it was my second year. And I asked you, I texted you the question. I was like, how do you deal with pressure? Because you, and everyone kind of notices this is about you.

In the clutch moments, you know, at the end of the games, you always are just like this. No matter what is happening, you always perform under pressure and you never seem rattled. So I remember I asked you about that 'cause that was something I just really admired about you.

And your answer was, I don't know if it's the same now, but your answer then was like, I feel the fear, I feel the pressure, but I just accept it and I deal with it and I just go do what I need to do. And you said you prepare so when the moments come, you don't feel like you haven't prepared.

Is that kind of the same? - It's interesting because I think if you're not scared, if you're not pressured, if you don't feel nervous, I think you're not, you didn't choose the right sport. I think that's a normal thing and you must have that. I think you just, I think the most important thing is to, like I said, prepare yourself for that moment.

Okay, it's gonna, you think in your head, okay, this play, a crowd, we are playing home away. We were losing or we were winning. So you need to, like, I put scenarios in my head, like what can, okay, this play, what can happen here? So I'm kind of already lived that in my head.

So what happened on the floor, of course, sometimes it's different, but kind of that makes you prepare for whatever happens. And I think, but just from the beginning, pressure and fear, like even now, I think of every game, I have a pressure, I have a fear. The guy on the opposing team is gonna beat me.

I think, I think you must have that or maybe I'm just different thinking. - I agree, I just think you carry yourself in such a way that no one would be able to tell on the outside that you carry pressure 'cause you just seem so nonchalant and non-caring and it lets you play so free.

How much time do you think you actually prepare? Is it like when you step foot in the arena, now your mind is on basketball? Or is this something that you carry with you even at home? Or do you separate the two? - I think you, like my game starts this night, tonight, you know, and ends up after I stretch or after I like, you know, we are lifting together after.

So like my game doesn't end when it's zero in the clock. My game ends like when I'm stretching or when I'm driving home. That's when my game ends. - Oh yeah, routine. - But it's not like I'm obsessed with my routine, but I'm kind of trying to not make a big deal of my routine but still kind of doing it, you know.

I don't want to say if I don't lift or something's going to happen, you know. No, like I'm going to do it and it's, I'm trying to kind of cruise through my routine. - Right, and it's not like people sometimes have superstition. - Yeah, it's not like if I cross the line or if I like, I need to make five in a row.

Like I don't have that. Like sometimes, I mean, I'm shooting in a warmup. If I miss, I just go to the next spot. And like, it's not something that I'm like, I need to do this, you know. So I think that helps me to maybe alleviate the pressure. Like, because pressure is the game.

Routine or warmup doesn't need to be pressure, you know. - Yeah, this is part of your life. - Yeah, but my game starts probably tonight. Like even now, you kind of start thinking, okay, like you, you have maxed truths or whoever is your next opponent tomorrow, like, uh-huh, this is what he's going to do.

I'm runoff, non-runoff, shooting, not shooting, dribble, like whatever. He's a good in a pocket. For me, he's a good post-up player. I need to box him out. Like you need to, that's how I'm, you don't need to, but that's how I'm thinking. Like slowly kind of preparing myself to the game.

And I love to be prepared, that helps. Maybe actually that helps me with the pressure too. Like being prepared for the game. Like, you know, I'm really good at reading the plays and like knowing what they're going to run. And that kind of helped me with the pressure. - 'Cause you just- - Okay, I know what's going to happen.

You know, it's- - Yeah, this dude will call out, call out plays that we didn't even go through and walk through or anything. - I gave the clippers, you remember? - Yeah. - The mic's right here. - Bro, I was like, wait, what? I remember that. - But man, as far as routine, that was one of my questions because early on in my career, your routine wasn't the same as it is now.

You know, I remember you were way more, I don't know if it wasn't that you didn't care about basketball as much, but it just seemed like you didn't, you just were good, but it didn't seem like you cared as much. You didn't put as much effort into your body.

You didn't- - Oh yeah, the beginning of my career was, you know, I was just, I came here just to make it, let's say it like that. You know, I came here as a third, fourth option, fifth option in some, so I was just kind of trying to play and to, and I was young, you didn't know nothing about it.

You know, like you think it's just a basketball. It's basketball is probably like a 20% of everything else. It's like basketball is, I'm going to say for me right now, basketball is easy. You know, basketball is something that, you know, you're going to get tired, you know, you miss make some nights good, some nights bad, but I think when you learn your routine, like even first, I'm going to say first three years, like you starting to learn more and more and more.

And then when your routine is kind of, I'm going to say like my third or fourth year, I was kind of, okay, I need to do this. I need to change diet. I need to lose weight. I need to, or maybe I can shoot. Maybe I can, like youth.

- Just develop it as time goes. - Develop it through the time, yeah. - Yeah, for people that don't know you, you're such a normal and like humble guy. You like to have fun. You like to do normal things. You know, you're not someone who really wants to be famous.

That was never your goal in being great. So what would you say is the hardest part about being like a global superstar? Like the pros and the cons of really just being famous. - Yes, I mean, I really don't like this life because on the other day we were just basketball players, you know, so we are just good at what we are doing.

But media is something that is around us. And of course we're getting paid because of the media, because of popularity, you know, so. But being famous, I think some people like it. Some people don't. I really, when I finished my career, I really wish nobody knows me. And I really wish my kid or kids in the future who knows really remember me as a dad, not as a basketball player, you know.

I think that's gonna, I'm gonna say that's gonna be my goal in life. And to not have phone, I think that's another big goal of mine. Just to be, to live in the moment. Like you said, like being a normal person, living the moment, like go drink with your buddy or go have lunch or go play with the kids or go drive horses.

And nobody's gonna make a big deal of that. Like I feel now, like even if you go outside and do anything, throw something next to the trash can, oh, Mike didn't throw this in the trash. Like it's, people are making a big deal of such a small things. And just feel sad whenever you go to the bar, restaurant, some game, people are just taking the phones and out and trying to record you.

I think that's really, I'm gonna say rude. Because it's your life, I'm not, it's not that I'm showing myself. I'm just who I am living my life. - Yeah, you're someone who keeps your private life very private. Like I remember when you did get married, like I don't even think anybody really knew about it.

So when it comes to that, how did you meet your wife, man? How did you know that she was the one? - So we met, I know her since I was 14, 15. - Yeah, she's from-- - Yeah, she lives five minutes away from my house, from my home.

And we were friends for like a couple of years. And then she actually came here the summer that she was supposed to, when she came here, that summer before that, we kind of started, I'm gonna say dating. And she was playing volleyball in Oklahoma. And we were kind of having long distance relationship.

So how I knew it, to be honest, I didn't know it. But it just happened to be, I think, to be honest, everything in my life, I never expected it just go, told my life go slowly, like uphill, slowly. I never had like some to knock on wood, like I never had some big draft.

So it's like slowly, slowly uphill. - Yeah, when you talk about that, like when you first got in the NBA and you realized like, okay, I can play with these guys, and then you got on the court, I think Nurkic might have been ahead of you at that time.

You say like, everything just happened to you. Did you realize when you first started playing how good you could be? Or was it something that you just kept working, you kept your routine and you just got better? Or was it something when you first got on the court, you're like, I think I could be the best player in the league?

- I think that's impossible. But I think, like maybe one of the questions from earlier, motivation, is that kind of don't relax. You know, if you relax, if you start thinking about that, I think, you're just gonna like, okay, I'm good. You're gonna stop doing what you're doing, you know?

Yes, but when I came here, I was a fifth option. They were like JJ Hickson, Kenneth, Joffrey, and Nurk. And they were all in front of me. And then one year, me and Nurk started to play together. That didn't work well. And I mean, I asked to go to the bench just because the team, we didn't win a lot of games.

And maybe just, you know, to give myself a chance or, you know, to play a position that I'm supposed to play or whatever. So, and since then, a couple of months after that, I was starting, I was in the starting unit. And like I said, it's uphill slowly, slowly uphill the whole life, I'm gonna say.

- I think that's crazy. This is another conversation we had. Well, actually backtrack. I wanna ask you this because this is a conversation that kids in America always have, you know, even NBA players in America. I don't know if it's the same in Serbia. We always talk about who's the best players.

And the big conversation on social media is, you know, who's the best players in the league, who's top five. But no one ever hears from, you know, I think right now probably you are the undisputed best player in the world. So excluding yourself, who would you say is, you think it right now in the league is top five?

- Right now in the league? - Right now in the league. It's tough, there's a lot of talent in the league right now. - I think there is a lot of talent. I think I'm gonna say Joel, Luca. I mean, you gotta put KD and LeBron there. So even they're a little bit older, but I think they could still perform.

- You still got like Steph, you still got. - Steph, you know, I think it's so, the talent, like the talent, and then you have Tatum. And, you know, it's. - You can't really say top five. - I think it's really impossible to say. I think maybe he likes some other player more than some other player, like his game or whatever.

But I think it's really hard to put that top five or even top 10, to be honest. I think it's. - Yeah, any given night, guys can kind of float in and out of there, yeah, I agree. One thing that makes our team so special is your ability to be able to figure out defenses.

So if they double, you know, from here, we always talk about it in walkthroughs, this is what we're doing. Or if they double from somewhere else, this is what we're doing. So one of the reasons we won a championship was your ability and our ability as a team to kind of figure out different team strategies.

And we pretty much have come up with a plan for every strategy. - We had answers for everything. - Yeah, who do you think then like gave, what gives you personally the biggest challenge? Like defensively. - I think when, that was the bubble, right? When they had like, they had three, four big guys.

- Oh yeah, the Lakers, AD, Dwyane. - Like AD, Dwyane. - Oh yeah, that was tough. - You know, because it's-- - They could put a big guy on you, but they have another big guy. - Yeah, that kind of, it's like what Minnesota did us. You know, when they put Townsend and Rudy was like kind of behind him.

I think those kind of situations that, but I think like my game, whatever, style, whatever it is, it's so like, I don't need just post-up. Like I can play pick and roll. I can set pick and roll, I can come off the screens. You know, I can just play in the open area.

Like I think it's not just one thing that I'm doing on the floor. - I agree. Man, so outside of basketball, 'cause everyone knows you for a great basketball player, but you know, we're not gonna be doing this our whole lives. We probably got, you know. - 10 years top.

- Five, 10 years. - Five probably for you. - No, no, five, 10, I don't know. - Where do you see yourself, I'm gonna say 15, 20 years from now. We've had the conversation before how one of your goals is to not have a phone. You wanna live like a normal person.

Can you do that in Serbia? Or where do you see yourself in how you live in 15 years? - I think after the career's over, I think the old kind of publicity is gonna gone. And I think I'm gonna figure it out. But how I want to see myself is to be around the family.

Spending days, probably my kid. Kid, right now one kid, but who knows. Maybe they're gonna play some sport. Maybe they're gonna do something interesting. Follow them a little bit. And spend the rest of the day with the horses, you know. I have a couple horses outside of Serbia in Italy, in Sweden, in France.

Go, maybe race. Actually, that's kind of my secret goal to be a driver. Like to have fun, you know. Travel the world, or Europe, and race horses. That sounds fun. - Yeah, that sounds good, like I'm the same way. We actually have a team who's not really big into the, you know, the fame thing.

Like there's a lot of guys that aren't really big into social media. - I think so too. - And I think that kind of is what makes us all enjoy each other. None of us is trying to like. - So I think that's cool. Besides that, I think my last question for you would be, what is your purpose, you think?

Like besides inspiring kids to do basketball, I don't know if that's what your purpose is, but you know, you got a family now. What is your purpose, and why do you kind of feel like you're here? Like why do you think God gave you these talents? - When, if you remember, when we won the championship, they put like a video of the people, like celebrating at their homes.

- Yeah. - I get the goosebumps, it's crazy. Like we affect so many people, just by playing basketball. So I think it's make people happy, you know, make other people happy. I think that's supposed to be our goal. Like that, when I realized, when we won the championship, I was like, for me, it's like, okay.

I felt more relief than joy, if that makes any sense. And when I saw the video, I was like, oh, we affect so many people, like old, young kids, parents, like it's, it was like, this is a big thing, you know? - Yeah. - And by the end of the day, we were just playing basketball.

So I think that's why we're on this planet Earth, to make other people happy. - Well, I think that's what makes you special, bro, is like your ability to be like selfless. Like it shows up in all areas of your life. The fact that, you know, on the court, how selfless you are, but also that you feel like your purpose is to make other people happy.

The fact that even though you hate media, you know, I hit you, and I was like, bro, would you hop on this podcast? And you're like, yeah, bro, anytime, wherever you want. Like, I think that's something, another thing I admire about you. So I just appreciate you getting on.

- Of course, I'm not gonna lie, the most, the best questions since I came to the NBA. For real, for real. - Appreciate you, though. My boy, I appreciate you. - Thank you, my friend. - Thank you, appreciate you. - Carry his mic out. - Yeah. - Man, Nikola Jokic.

That dude is a one of a kind dude. I could truly say that. You know, he's someone who, he doesn't like media. He doesn't like media at all. You know, so for me to hit him up and for him to just be so, just hop on here, you know, just without even questioning what it was, what I'm doing.

He just was like, yeah, brother, anytime, any place. It shows just the type of person he is. You know, at the end when he talked about his purpose and like how he truly just wants to inspire people and make people happy, it really shows who he is. He's a really low-key dude who never has been for the fame, never has been for his own glory.

He gets kind of almost like a little shy almost or a little kind of like deflective when people are constantly awarding him or, you know, even when coach brings up his stats in the locker room, he's almost like deflective of it, trying to praise other people and things like that.

So over the years in my career, like playing with Nikola has made me, you know, obviously a better player. You know, he gives me so many open looks, but a better person as well, more disciplined. I think more, definitely with the routine and stuff, he's definitely observing him and how he operates day-to-day has definitely helped me, but also the way he thinks, you know, how he is after a good game, how he is after a bad game.

Just seeing his balance in life, you know. He's become a good friend of mine over the years, and I never would have thought that my first couple of years just because we're so different. I didn't understand his jokes. He didn't really understand my culture and how me and my friends joke around, so.

But now it's crazy to see him kind of open up and just his personality has evolved and he's joking around just like us, and he's wanting to go out and go to dinners and do the things that we do. So it's been really enjoyable playing with Joker. What's another thing he talked about?

I think just the not wanting to be on social media. He talked about one of his goals as, you know, when he's done playing, not wanting to even have a phone. This is something that we've talked about as well. We've had a lot of little conversations over the years where we're just chopping it up.

I'll ask him questions, what he thinks about stuff, 'cause I just see how different he is. And he said, you know, one of his goals is to not even have a phone when he's done. I think that that is very admirable just because of the day and age we live in.

You know, people, I don't know if it's an American thing, but people are so thirsty these days for clout, for attention, for one-upping other people, for, you know, self-glory and being the man. And that's one person. If there's anybody that I know that has the ability and the right to self-promote and show off that they're the man, it's Nikola.

You know, he is back-to-back MVP, finals MVP, world champion, you know, and he keeps getting better every year. He probably could be the MVP, like, every year of his career 'til he's done just because of the way he fills up the stat sheet, what he does for our team.

You know, as long as we keep our core together, we're gonna win a lot of games. So it's very realistic that he could be in the MVP conversation for the next five, six, seven years. So if there's anybody who could self-promote, it's him. But he chooses not to. He chooses not to have an Instagram.

He chooses to keep his private life very private. He chooses not to do the media. And I just think that that is, like, that's a special characteristic and it's something that not only me but a lot of people can learn from because he has it all, you know. He is who he is, but he chooses to humble himself, to live his life, to, you know, make other people happy, inspire other people.

And who knows? I don't know if it's an American thing, but we are just so absorbed in ourself, you know, in our own brand, pushing our own brand, worried about ourself, that that's something that I think we can learn from Nikola and just this episode of what he was talking about.

Man, and then he talked about, you know, his wife and how he got married, how he knew it was the one or whatever. And that's weird because everyone I know in the NBA who's married, it's like someone from their childhood or someone who they grew up with, their childhood sweetheart.

And so I didn't know that he knew her his whole life, but it makes sense. So he got a good one, you know, he got the kid. I've been over to his house and he lives just a very chill, quiet, normal life with his kid and his girl and, you know, his brothers are around.

So I got to make it out to Serbia. AG went out there this past summer, so I'm gonna go mess with Joker this, probably this upcoming summer and go see what the horses are about. And yeah, go from there. 'Cause, you know, there's a lot to learn from that dude.

And it's not even the fact that he's so profoundly, like, outwardly wise. It's just the fact of how he lives his life is different. And that's what I think that is unique. And that's something that people could do more of, you know, conforming to the normal way of life.

You don't need to do that. You can follow your own heart. And I think that takes some inward, you know, getting to know yourself. For me lately, it's been journaling, figuring out what I really want in life, who I really want to be, what I really want to do, what my motives are, you know, what my purpose is.

It takes some inward kind of like work, I would say, because there's always gonna be pressures from the outside that tell you who to be, how to act, all these things. But I think he knows himself. And that's why he comes off so authentic, because he's not trying to put on a front for anyone.

He's not trying to live like anybody else. He just knows himself and he's unashamedly himself. And I think that that is another quality that is rare these days. He talked about our team, you know, and what the toughest matchups were for us and things like that. And we didn't really give away the blueprint because we found how to work our way around this.

You know, the Wolves got us earlier this year by putting Cat on Yoke, and then they had Rudy roaming. There's been some other teams who have done similar things, which, I mean, it is. It is a good -- It's a good formula, and I think the Timberwolves are really, really good this year.

So they smacked us at their crib, you know, but that's nothing new for us. I would say some other teams have tried that, where they put a guy on Yoke, and then they have another bigger guy kind of roaming. But, man, so much of our success as a team has been because that dude can just -- He's a wizard on the court.

He figures stuff out, and then he'll talk to us, you know, and we figured, you know, just playing with him, we figured out ways to figure stuff out on our own, too. But, yeah, that is one of the reasons we won the championship, because every team that we played in our championship run tried different strategies.

You know, if that didn't work, they're switching to something else. So, yeah, his IQ is his greatest attribute. His best skill, I would say, is his touch. You know, he doesn't miss those floaters, those layups around the rim. But his best attribute is his IQ and his ability to work around different defensive schemes that are thrown at us.

Man, we got a squad. We really do. You know, our core of me, Jamal, AG, KCP, Big Fella, and, you know, the rest of our core of guys off the bench, CB, P-Watt, who am I missing? Really, we just got to -- we got a squad. You know, Julian is a rookie who is really, really good.

He's not getting a lot of minutes right now, but he'll blossom. We got a squad, so I'm excited. It's crazy because I got drafted to Denver, so I've never really experienced being on another team. But from the stories that I hear of guys that have been traded to us, we have a different culture.

You know, and I wouldn't really know that firsthand because I haven't seen these other teams, but everyone says, like, man, like, the way y'all operate, the way you play, the way you even act in the locker room, how y'all, like, enjoy each other's time off the court is different.

We really got a team who enjoys being around each other. And, like I said, man, Joker has not always been someone that I can, like, really kick it with. Like, he really wasn't. I think we probably just found each other a little weird, you know, which is normal, I think, people coming from -- So he would just stick to his guys from overseas, you know, Vladco and some of the strength trainers.

But over the years, he's really become my boy. And we'll do stuff as a team. You know, when we were in San Diego for training camp, we went down to Tijuana. Almost got stuck over there one year because he didn't even bring his ID, so we almost got stuck in Mexico.

And it was a whole ordeal, but we just had fun. We went to this little spot as a team, kicked it, probably came back way too late. I think we crossed the border back into America like 4:35 a.m. But we have a lot of stories now as a team.

It's cool that I've gotten to be here my whole career and I haven't been traded around. That's pretty rare, so. Man, I couldn't ask for a better dude to share the court with. And, yeah, man, I forgot to ask him about his brothers. I want to ask him -- I should've asked him about his brothers because his brothers are some crazy dudes, you know.

They'll be at the games, and, like, if we get into the slightest scuffle, they're standing up in their chairs. They're ready to go. You know, they're definitely ready to go whoop somebody. Like, his brothers got his back, and I see them all around. There's some unique dudes. They're a lot different than Yoke.

Like, they carry themselves a lot different. But you know you can't play with Yoke because his brothers got his back, and that's kind of how me and my brothers are. Like, we all got each other's back. So it's cool to see that. He's really just a family guy at heart, man.

He's a low-key, chill, funny family guy at heart who happens to be really good at basketball. He never thinks about the end goal of anything. I don't think he ever thought about getting MVP. He never cared about getting MVP. He never thought about winning a championship. He just followed the steps in front of him, and he was present in the moment, and these things happened to be -- He talked about in the interview about, like, slowly, you know, he just went up, up, up, up, up.

And I think it's because he never was thinking about the goals in mind. We have a saying in the weight room, "Habits, not goals." I think in America, we have this notion of, "You have to set these far-out goals, and these things will make you happy." But, you know, from my experience and something I've learned over time is, it's the process and it's the habits you build and the person you become that eventually allow you to reach your goals.

If you just have this goal in mind and you're striving and stressing to get it, like, sometimes it will elude you because it causes you to be stressed out, anxious, and you really miss out on a big piece of life, which is the process, becoming who you need to be in the process.

And that's something that our team as a whole kind of preaches is habits, not goals. We're not worried about winning a championship right now. We're worried about building the habits that will allow us to eventually win enough games to eventually win a championship. And that's something that I think, "Yeah, over here we miss.

You know, we think that a certain goal or this thing or that thing will make us happy, and then we get it, and it makes us happy for a week or two, if that, and then you have a new goal, and you're not happy until you reach that goal." Yeah, I don't think that's the right way to live, but for some reason, you know, the American dream, that's the whole point of it is to, like, become somebody and do these big things, but you miss out on 99.9% of life because these goals that you may reach are, like, they're just a thing that happens to you.

You know, from firsthand experience, I thought all growing up, you know, my goal was to reach the NBA, and boom, I got it. Now I'm in the NBA. Now I'm not playing, and I really want to play, and I'm like, "Man, if I could just get on the court, I'd be happy." I start getting a little bit of time.

That fulfilled me for a second, but not really. Then I'm like, "Man, I got to be a starter. I got to, you know, work hard enough to be a starter." Became a starter on the team, and then, you know, that's cool, but now you have bigger goals. You want to be an all-star.

You want to this. You want to that. So over the time of playing with Joker and seeing how those things don't even cross his mind is something that I've been able to adapt, you know, and just self-reflection as well. You see, you know, people out in the world that have these goals, and then they're not happy at the end of them, so it's been a process for me, but that's something that I think I've grown in as well.

So, man, habits, not goals. That's just the whole motto, something he lives by. That's something I've learned to live by, and it keeps you at peace through the hard times, and it makes you look at failures as learning lessons and not -- they're not failures. They're really learning lessons if you allow them to be, and you can build yourself through the failures, sometimes even more than the success.

So, yeah, man, this episode is a special one, obviously. I'm glad that Joker got on. Y'all got to see a little bit of his personality, how goofy he is off the court. So, yeah, man, Curious Mike out. Appreciate y'all listening to it.