(upbeat hip hop music) - Welcome back to another episode of Curious Mike. I am here with my boy, my friend, the GOAT designer, up and coming best designer ever, Donnie Nemeus. I appreciate you getting on the show, my boy. - Thank you for having me, my boy. - Let's do it.

So yeah, before we get into the fashion space and everything you got going on, I think it's important, you know, everybody kind of gets to know you. So what was your childhood like growing up? You know, I feel like people with the creative mind that you have, always have an interesting childhood to think outside the box.

So kind of walk me through that. - Yeah, growing up, I grew up in a small beach town called Santa Barbara. It's about two hours north of Los Angeles. Super small community, but I really just grew up skateboarding, spent some time surfing, and I was kind of just a-- - A free spirit?

- Just a free spirit, getting into some trouble as a kid, just, you know, getting through school as I could. And, you know, I loved to play basketball and just kind of hang around and cruise around the city on my skateboard. - Was it, so did you go to public school or were you, how was that dynamic?

- I went to public school. I went to Santa Barbara High School, Santa Barbara Junior High, and just kind of breezed my way through. I was never really the most academic student, I would say. - So at what point then, growing up, did you decide like, oh, fashion is important to me.

I wanna get into this. I know you probably didn't have the vision for like a whole brand yet, but when did you realize fashion was kind of important to you? - Yeah, I really didn't know much about fashion, especially in Santa Barbara. There's not much designer stores. There's no Saks Fifth Avenue or anything like that.

We had like a Macy's. So I didn't know much about fashion, but as I started to spend time at the skate park or at school, I did notice myself looking at what other people were wearing and maybe not as much the brands, 'cause I didn't know much about that, but how they were wearing their clothes, how baggy they were, were they rolling the cuffs at the bottom, were they double layering their t-shirts, and how does the collars look.

So it was more, I started to pay attention to kind of like the silhouettes of what people were wearing and noticed what I liked and didn't like. And I think that was my first kind of like instinctive, like loving fashion or how things were worn. - Right, and like, obviously, you know, you have this big brand now that's booming.

You know, things are going well. - It's getting there. - It didn't always start out like that. You don't just become the entrepreneur you are. You had to start somewhere. So like walk me through like, okay, you know, high school, college, and then did you have to do some interning or what did that kind of, how did that journey look for you?

- I was definitely just a self-taught designer. I had no clue what I was doing. I knew I wanted to do it. So I initially started by just kind of, my first garments was I was selling pockets on t-shirts. I was going to craft stores, picking some interesting fabrics I liked and selling pockets on shirts.

I was screen printing and I was just trying to sell these to friends and family. And just at the time I thought it was cool, but looking back, it's almost embarrassing what some of the stuff looked like, but you got to start somewhere. But every piece I did, I started to learn what made it better and better.

And it just took years of evolving to understand like how to get to a luxury brand level versus a very amateur kid starting a brand. - Yeah, anyone who starts their own business, like I have a lot of respect for, 'cause it's just so many hoops you have to jump through.

What was something that was like harder than you thought about inventing your own thing, like from scratch? Is it the hiring of people? 'Cause I mean, I've been to your warehouse plenty of times. It's a lot going on. What was some of those kind of early on struggles and things of like literally starting from the ground up?

- I think the hardest thing is really finding your voice as a designer. I think starting out, all I was doing at the beginning was looking at all the other designers, like who's winning, who's working and what are they doing? And I'd be like trying to rework what was already out on the market.

And I think once my brand started to grow was when I stopped looking at what other people were doing and taking inspiration from them, but diving into myself for inspiration and like making unique original pieces that were true to me. So I think things started to work as you learn to be more authentic and find your own brand DNA versus being influenced by others.

I think everyone starts that way. Everyone starts by loving something and taking it from there, but then you'll learn to create your own as you go. - And man, there's so many brands now, so many people trying to dip their feet in the fashion world that it's probably hard to even come up with creative ideas.

I mean, but me and you have talked about, and it's similar in basketball, like when you feel refreshed or you feel like mentally, physically, emotionally, like stress-free, you come up with your best ideas. And like I said, I've been to your warehouse and there's so many unique pieces. Like how do you even come up with these concepts?

Is it just sitting there and kind of like sitting still and meditating and just thinking of things, or is it just like they come to you on the fly? How is that process? - Yeah, it'll come in waves. Like there'll be days or weeks even where I'm just slumped.

I can't think of anything. Like I'll just be so consumed by the business as a whole and the operations and having to answer to so many people. But then there's days that I'll go up to Santa Barbara for the weekend, let my mind and like my brain kind of turn off, and like my brain will just start firing.

And I'll just take a bunch of notes on my phone or sketch something out real quick. And like I could get a whole collection done in a matter of a few days, but sometimes it could take a few weeks just to be like, figure out what the fuck am I doing with these genes, you know?

So I think mental clarity is key. And this industry is like so stressful. So it's really important to figure out times that you can, you know, be alone and just let your mind rest, 'cause that's when you'll perform the best. I'm sure same with basketball, like. - It's that inner work and that inner peace that then allows you to go do the physical thing at a high level.

It's super true. You talk about the stress of this industry. I mean, everyone kind of looks at their own kind of like the area they're in in life. You know, athletes think that we have it the worst and it's so stressful and we have so much pressure. You know, other people working a nine to five think they got it rough, you know?

And then you talk about the stresses and I guess the anxieties of like your industry. Kind of what makes the fashion industry so competitive and so hard? I mean, there's only so many dope designer brands that people like to wear. Is that the hardest thing or what do you think makes it so stressful?

- I think it's so competitive in the sense, I mean, even comparing it to basketball, like there's so many hoopers out there and there's so many incredible basketball players, but only like few can shine through that. And that might be through work ethic or not giving up or a certain style or a certain swagger that make people connect to it more.

And I think same with fashion. There is so many brands. I think almost every kid grows up, like I wanna have a brand. Like it's such a common thing. So I think just being able to figure out how to shine through the rest and it's really about being different and pushing boundaries.

And like, you can't be afraid, just like in basketball, you can't be afraid to take that last shot. If you miss, you miss. Like people might hate on you at that moment, but if you make it, you're great. And so I think same with putting out collections. You can't be timid.

You gotta just really put something out that feels good and it might be a little scary to put out 'cause maybe people respond poorly to it, but maybe they absolutely love you for it. So just put it, you know. - That's not, that's a really good point because like I was watching some interview and it really connected with me.

And it was like the best players, basketball players, and I'm sure, you know, it's weird. Like an NBA, every player at some point was the man on their team. So they had this trait at some point, they probably were taking the last shot at some point, but the trait of being able to take on the risk and being confident enough to fail is really what makes the superstars in the NBA.

It makes the great players in the NBA. And I'm sure it's similar like in your space, like being confident enough in your ability that you're okay failing and you're okay with the backlash. I feel like a lot of complacent people in life, that's one of the things they lack is-- - For sure.

- And that makes them fly under the radar. But being able to take on that risk is an important trait. - Yeah, the amount of failures I've had is like, there's been thousands. So I've taken every failure as a way to learn, but yeah, it's damn near impossible to succeed in this business.

So just being able to eat shit day in and day out and just keep pushing and keep trying. And if you give up, that's when you won't make it. But if you keep pushing, like there is a finish line or not necessarily a finish line, but you're gonna get somewhere as long as you keep pushing and you gotta be able to handle the failures and the people that are against you.

And people will come in waves of loving you or hating you or loving the product or hating the product. - Yeah. - So. - That does seem stressful. What is your ways you think of being able to deal with that? I mean, basketball athletes have their own ways. I'm sure you have your way.

How do you, 'cause it's a lot. And to even maintain like joy and happiness in life, you gotta have, is it your family, your friend? What is it? - That's what I'm, this year, like just this past few months is like, I'm really learning to be present and enjoy life for, yeah, family, find the friends that you love and figure out the things that give you peace and do those things.

Because I got caught, got so caught up just being stressed about wanting to perform and make sure I'd be so successful and I'd get this pop up and my clothes would be in this store. But in the end, you get those things and like nothing really changed about your life or your heart or your wellbeing.

So the things that really mattered would be spending that time with your family and friends and loved ones. And that's what really matters. And then making sure your business, your business will perform better if you put more attention into those things, you know, 'cause you'll be more at peace.

And it's just kind of having that carefree feeling. Like if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't. But I love what I'm doing. And like, that's how your mentality should be. - It's true. And it's weird. Like when people talk about even the law of attraction and things like this, the more you want something, sometimes the more it evades you.

But the more you kind of like, you know, put your energy into other things as well and kind of just, you know, like you said, that carefree mentality. And this is something I think I've spoken on another podcast but how when you're so focused on chasing something or like an end goal, sometimes we get those things and it doesn't change anything about how happy we are, how peaceful we are.

And it's weird how some people go through their whole life and they think if I get this or I get this or this, that will make me happy. You know, as a basketball player, I've talked about this before, you know, your whole life you wanna be a D1 player, whatever it is, you get that.

Then you're like, man, I really wanna get drafted. If I get drafted and I get some money and I can help my family out, then I'll be happy. Then you get in the NBA and you're not playing. Then you're like, oh, if I could just get on the court and be in the rotation, I'll be happy.

Then it's, I wanna be a starter. I wanna be... And so the whole point is like, it never stops. - It never stops. - That's the human kind of mind. I don't know, like, I feel like in a, over here in the Western world, that's probably just more of like the hustle mindset, the American dream, like go get it mindset, but it really kills a lot of people's ability to achieve peace and happiness.

So I think-- - It's so hard to be happy, yeah. - I think, you know, in an industry as stressful as yours, and we talked about this in the sauna at Voda, shout out to Voda Spa. - Voda. - We go there and we have good conversations. - Voda.

- Yeah. We just talked about like, how do you have happiness and peace through the midst of like the entire stressful process of life? And you kind of have come to that realization, which I feel like is important. - So now I'm just learning how to tackle that to the best of my ability, like going back on that.

For instance, we just opened up our own pop-up takeover at Maxfield in Los Angeles, one of the best boutiques in the world. Like, since I started, that was my dream. It's like, I want my name on the window of Maxfield. I wanna do an installation. I wanna have a collection with them.

We just had that. The opening night was just the other night, and it was amazing, but it happened, and now it's gone. I mean, it's still up, but it just like, that moment happened, and it's just like, now what? Like, now what? And so like, but then I had a night with my family and friends, and we celebrated, and being at home with them was almost the better moment than the event itself, you know?

Like, so just finding ways to step back and breathe, and just, I think being present is the hardest part, 'cause we're always consumed like on what's next, or how am I gonna make this better? Are people gonna like it? And it's really just about like, when I spend time with you, it's just different, you know?

- Bro, same thing. Like, I would compare your Maxfield opening to like us winning the finals, right? Every NBA player's goal is to win a championship, you know? And then you do that, and then you celebrate the next day, and the next two days, bro, you're just at home.

Like, what's next? Like, what? And then, you know, you get to celebrate with your family, and you know, you have the memories, but even when like I saw like the Chiefs, for example, like Patrick Mahomes, and then win the Super Bowl this past year, and he was, in the press conference, he was like, like, we're gonna get a third one next year, but you just won that one, and it's hard to even like enjoy the moment.

So it's a whole, it's just a, it's a crazy mindset that we have as humans. But going back to, like you said, you just opened up your pop-up shop at Maxfield, and that's a big deal, like, you know? - It's the Mecca. It's like every designer's dream is to do a takeover with Maxfield.

- Yeah, that's huge. How did that kind of like come about, and how do you see that kind of springboarding your brand even to bigger heights than it is? - I mean, that came, that's just a million baby steps, getting to this point. Like, I posted on my social media, along with the photo of me at Maxfield, with a swipe to the email, showing in 2016, 2017, 2018, asking the buyers just for a chance, just to show them the collection.

Like, I was just banging my foot on the door. And so it was just years of perseverance, and not giving up, and the time will come. So I think it was just that matter of just not giving up on that. - Yeah, I can't wait to go check it out.

We're gonna go check it out tomorrow morning. You got the big apple in there, in the store. Talk about that. What is the meaning of that? - Yeah, I partnered with this amazing digital artist, Andres Rezinger, and we were conceptualizing how to make something super special. But for me, the apple is a representation of knowledge and happiness.

Like, that's one of the two main things of the apple. So having this moment in my career was like showing these past years of work. It represents that knowledge has got me here. And then just the happiness of being able to be here, and have that moment. So I thought it'd be so impactful to just take that huge apple and just plant it in the store, plant it in the window.

'Cause that's how I would drive by this block and manifest it for years. So then now I can just see it, and it's just in your face. - Yeah, no, that's dope. Yeah, I was wondering what that meant. A couple other concepts that you've come up with is the Summerland.

You know, you got that on the hats, on the shirts. Talk about that. What is the meaning of Summerland? - Summerland, it's a small town within Santa Barbara. I spent years growing up there. And it's just like a small beach town, which I feel like it defines California. It's like a little beach, ocean, and then right behind you is the mountains.

And it's just so laid back and cool. And I pull all my inspiration from it. It's almost like this dreamland. And I think a lot of people don't even know Summerland is a real town. - Yeah, I gotta go check it out. - So it's a real place, and it's so small, but it's like, it almost represents anything to anyone.

It's like, what is your dreamland? What's your dream state? Where do you want to be that makes you most at peace? And for me, it's going home. - That's dope. And then the other one is, you know, you got it on your hat, the miracle, the Miracle Academy. You know, you have a miracle in a lot of your stuff.

What does that mean to you? - The miracle to me is, I mean, I find it to be one of the most impactful words in the dictionary, it's just like, but the fact that I'm here today and doing what I'm doing, I had a phase as a kid in my upbringing.

I was a really troubled youth teenager. I got into a ton of trouble. I was sent to Utah for wilderness programs. I went to juvenile hall. Like, I was like really a rough kid, and I was really lost and confused and getting into a lot of things I shouldn't be doing.

So just the idea of being able to turn around from that and basically transform into the person I am today, I see as a miracle. And that's just like my little story of it, but it works for the business and the brand as well, 'cause I think so many people relate to it in so many ways.

I think everyone has their own kind of miracle that they can relate to in their lifetime. So it just is, yeah. - Do you feel like, how much do you connect that miracle to, do you connect it to coincidence? Do you connect it to God? I mean, obviously me and you, we kick it with Jude all the time.

I know faith has become more important to you and you're still trying to figure it out, going to church and things like that, but kind of what is your thoughts in that space? - I connect it to a little of everything. I think I connect it to faith. I connect it to coincidence.

I connect it to work ethic. I connect it to kindness. I think really the way you treat people is almost one of the biggest parts. If you're loving to people and you're always outgoing, making sure someone else is okay, I feel like that's the best way that this world can be a better place.

And so I think there'll be more miracles the more we can be better humans to everyone else, 'cause I think it's getting pretty rough out there. And I think a lot of people are getting more and more closed off and more out there for themselves. And I think if we can change to where more people are worried about others, still protect yourself, but there's so many people just going through it.

So just checking in on them, it can change a lot for everybody. - Well, you're amazing at that. I mean, we've talked about this in the car. I remember me, you and Judah were sitting there and we were like, what do you think is, we were going around asking what each one thought each other's strengths were.

And the word that kept coming up about you is just how caring you are for your friends and your people, and that's an obvious trait about you. All this stuff is going on in your business and stuff, but you still find time to make sure everybody else is straight.

- That's right. - And I feel, bro, that's gonna come back around. That's why you have so many relationships that you do. Talk about that, the relationships with some of these celebrities. You're close with Kodak, you're close with Chris Brown, some of the NBA players, Justin. How do you feel like some of those relationships really came about?

Because I feel like a lot of people in this space are very closed off, but you come around and they are very open with you. Why do you think that is? And how did those relationships kinda come about? - Man, I think I'm definitely just blessed in the sense of, I don't know, I think I definitely have a special trait of connecting with someone and just kind of feeling what's inside of them.

And I think they can almost see it or feel it. I don't know what it is. It might be a superpower I was given. But for instance, my relationship with Kodak, he's a very closed off guy. He's got a very tight circle. But since we met, we became like bonded brothers and he loved me and we would have great conversation.

Even his management is just like, I don't know what it is, but Bill loves you, you know? So I don't know, I think they just understand that I'm trying to care for them for them. And it's like, you're an amazing rapper. I love you for your music and your craft, but I also think you're great and I can tell you have a good heart.

So I think we connect on that level. And that same with even Chris Brown and all these other guys and all these ballplayers. I think I relate to a lot of these basketball guys. I grew up playing basketball. I'm not 6'10" like you, but I get buckets. And I think I just relate.

I feel like I just connect and relate with these people on a natural and organic level. And I think they just feel it. And so it just works in my favor and hopefully theirs too, you know? It's just becomes real friendships. - Yeah, nah, it's a gift you have for sure.

And I think in the industry you're in, relationships is very important, you know? I mean, you're in the early stages of kind of what this is gonna become. And you're in the grinding stages. You may not be making like tons, millions of dollars. But the relationships you have, the stuff that you make, it's only a matter of time.

So as stressful as it is, bro, it's inevitable that this is gonna be the next thing. You know, Joker talks about your stuff all the time. You got Justin over here wearing it, Chris Brown. You got the connections. It's just keep it going, bro. Your stuff is dope. This is a question I wanna ask you 'cause you're in the fashion industry.

Why do you think that the fashion is going sometimes towards this, for men's wear, towards kind of sometimes the feminine type of stuff? And do you see yourself ever going in that direction with someone like the skirts or the stuff the dude's wearing fashion week? Do you see that?

Why do you think that is? And do you see yourself ever going that way? - I see that, but I would never go there. I'm always gonna stay authentic. But I see, I think the skirts and all this stuff, I think that's just designers finding ways to push their boundaries.

How do we make something? How do we make some noise? How do we be different? And every designer has their way of doing it. For me, I'm not gonna put a man in a skirt, but. - Even like the fingernail polish, what do you think about all that stuff?

- It's just, it's their taste. I think every human has their own flavor of like expressing themselves. And I have nothing against any of it. And some people can pull it off. Like I could, I've seen, I think like Westbrook in a skirt and he kind of looks dope, but it's not for me.

- Jordan Clarkson rocks sometimes. - My brand's not gonna go there, I don't think. But who knows, maybe in two, three years, I have some weird face and I got men in dresses. You never know, but. - No, I feel you. I just always wanted to ask that 'cause it's so funny to me how.

- I find it funny. I think the fashion game, I think there's so much real stuff in it, but I think there's so much comical, artificial stuff in the fashion game too. I think there's designers that are true and authentic. And I think there's designers that are just, I don't know, just a bit comical and just a bit artificial.

- Why do you think, like fashion goes through phases. It used to be the baggy, the baggy stuff. And then it went to guys wearing skinny jeans. - I know the theory. For instance, you got, I think, true, real, cool culture. I'm talking, I guess, on a California level first.

You got skaters wearing baggy jeans and these puffy skate shoes. Designers now are doing these puffy skate shoes, baggy jeans, and now that everyone's wearing baggy, now these skate cats are real street kids that now they go back to skinny. So I think it's almost like a chase of the cool kids trying to identify on their own level.

They're going to dress their way. That becomes commercialized. And then it almost just goes backwards. And it's going to be a vicious cycle forever. And I think it's just a matter of, there's like that core, cool community that paves the lane. And then there's the designer houses and bigger conglomerates or whatever, looking at what cool kids are doing.

And then they're going to recreate it. Maybe not as well, but it's kind of just-- - Do you see yourself going back to the, 'cause it is crazy how it used to be baggy. And then that got weird kind of. And everyone was wearing the skinny stuff, even the joggers, you cuff it in your shoes.

Now everybody wants the big sweats to go over their shoes. Do you, when do you see it going back skinny? And do you see yourself following? I mean, I guess as a designer, you kind of got to go with the culture. But when do you see that kind of happening?

'Cause it's just, I feel like it's so weird. 'Cause I used to think skinny was so dope and now I can't stand it. - Can't stand it. - And then we're baggy. - People be looking goofy. They look like Dr. Grew from the '80s. - Right. When do you see it going back that way?

- I mean, skinny's coming back. I think there's always going to be, there's certain designers that'll stick to their core. You got Hedy Slimane, like he's going to have skinny jeans forever. And there's other designers that will have skinny, but as a brand and a business in the end, they're going to have to cater to an audience and sell what they can.

So I see skinny coming back in a sense. I don't know if I'm going to play with it, but I've always worn baggy clothes. Even in high school, there was like this phase of crew jeans, these crew skinny jeans. I just made fun of my friends forever for it.

And I just never got there, but everyone has their taste. - Yeah, the baggy's definitely doper. All right, man, my last question for you. What is your overall vision for Nemeas and kind of your purpose for the brand overall, for you overall? What is your purpose? And then what is the vision for the entire brand?

- My vision for the brand is to make it as big as possible, but still holding its authentic feel and love. And like in the end, it is a business. I want it to make money. I want the world to know about it. I want people to wear it and feel comfortable and confident wearing it.

So as big as Nemeas can go, where it'll still feel authentic, like I want it there. And me as a human and as a person with a purpose, it's definitely going beyond clothing. I wanna explore everything from fashion to charity, to organization, to furniture, different forms of art. Like this is just the start for me.

And this is like my home base to build myself as a person and then see what else I could do. I got plenty of time. I just turned 31. But I see something greater with this whole Miracle and Miracle Academy. I see it as a, almost like a charity program or a situation.

We also have Miracle Garden and it's like, so there's so many things I wanna play with and explore in the future beyond clothing. - Yeah, and I mean, I just gotta point out something you just said that just hit me was the fact that you use this fashion brand and what you're doing to shape you as a human for some of the other things that you wanna do in life.

And like for me or anyone, I think that's important. Like not letting what you do become your sole identity to where it's all-consuming. Like me, I should be using basketball to help me grow mentally, to help me fulfill my purpose in other areas. Inspiring people, giving back to the people through charity and things.

So I think that's important 'cause a lot of people, what they do is who they are. And you just said, you know, you use, and it means you use this fashion to explore who you are, grow who you are so you can ultimately reach your purpose. So man, I admire you, bro.

- I love you, bro. - I appreciate you getting on the podcast, dog. - I love you, bro. - My man. - I already gave up my dreams of being in the NBA, so at least I can make some clothes for the NBA players and everybody else. - Appreciate you, dog.

Curious Mike out. (upbeat music) - I drink one of these smoothies every day. Banana, blueberry. It's tough, tough life out here.