(upbeat music) - Welcome to a new week on the Ask Pastor John podcast. We have a big week ahead as we come up on Easter. And today we're joined again by our friend Ray Ortland, author and senior pastor of Emanuel Church in Nashville, Tennessee. Ray, the Ortland family has a long and wonderful history when it comes to fruitful gospel ministry and marriage and parenting.

Those three categories come to mind when I think of the Ortland family legacies. Gospel ministry, marriage, parenting, which is an astonishing legacy to watch from a distance. And we talked about marriage earlier in episode number 559, and we will talk gospel soon. Here I wanna talk about parenting. Some people will know your dad, he was a wonderfully gifted preacher and pastor, and his influence on a young John Piper was profound.

Pastor John shared that story in episode number 172 of this podcast series. In what ways did your father impact you as a child, and in turn, what did you seek to instill in your three sons and daughter when they were young? - Well, let me just paint the picture of a moment with my dad that's very dear to me.

We were in the front yard, I was 10 or 12 years old, I forget, and we were, I guess, doing yard work. And whatever the context was, I can't pull that up in my memory, but he turned to me and he looked me right in the eye, in the middle of our conversation, and he said, "You know, bud, before time began, "God chose you." And I think my eyes got real big, you know, and I thought, really, in my heart, I thought, "Oh, come on, you mean God Almighty in heaven, "way back then, thought of little tiny me, "and I felt so loved?

"I felt loved by God?" It filled my heart with wonder, so that years later, when I heard about the doctrine of election, and some of my friends with whom I was dialoguing about that, they had difficulty with it, they resisted it, I had no problem at all. I thought it was wonderful, and it was obviously biblical, because my dad had really helped me years before, in a moment of theological education that I didn't realize was that.

He helped me, at level of my heart, to feel the love of God in the doctrine of election. But when Jannie and I raised our kids, we just decided, sometimes parents treat parenting as if it's some kind of death sentence. I mean, we loved it, we decided to love it.

And, Tony, we just thought through, what kind of environment are we going to create for these precious children, as their most formative experience, to give them the best start in life? And we just had a conviction that the glory of the Lord is ultimate reality. I thought of Exodus 33, Moses prayed, "Please show me your glory." And the Lord said, "I will make all my goodness pass before you." So, ultimate reality is the glorious goodness of God.

And we just wanted to create a home environment where our children would find that easy to believe. We tried to inload joy and sincerity and tenderness and love and wisdom and gentleness and laughter, with discipline and boundaries too, because that's part of God's goodness. And I don't know how successful we were in that effort, but that's what we tried to do, because we just believed that ultimate reality is not darkness and despair, but just the glorious goodness of God.

- Well, based on what I see in your kids, I think you and Janie pulled this off by grace, of course. Thank you, Ray. And I mentioned the critical role your dad played in John Piper's life, and Pastor John shared that story in episode number 172 in this podcast series.

The episode is titled, "How Do I Motivate My Church for Ministry?" You can find it in the Ask Pastor John archive at desiringgod.org. Go to the site, click on More, and click on Ask Pastor John, and there, search for episode number 172. Tomorrow, I wanna ask you, Ray, more about church culture, and specifically of the toxic dangers that threaten the unity of the church, namely gossip.

I know you have put a lot of thought into this, and it's a very real issue faced by congregations, and we'll address that tomorrow on the Ask Pastor John podcast. Thanks for listening. (upbeat music) (upbeat music)