(upbeat music) - Over the months, we've had a steady stream of emails, probably over 50 by now, all on the question of discerning when it's time to leave a certain church. So many scenarios factor into a decision like this, and it makes it really hard, I know, to answer the question with much specificity in a podcast like this, but maybe you can put some categories out there, Pastor John, for listeners.

What are some general guidelines or broad categories you would introduce for someone who is asking whether it's time to leave a local church? - One of the reasons that it's difficult is because we don't find explicit instances of this in the New Testament, and the reason we don't is because the letters of the New Testament are written to one church in a city, not several churches in the city among which Christians are circulating.

It treats the church in Corinth or Thessalonica or Philippians as one church in the city, and the letters that are written to several churches, those churches are in different cities, and so it's not about people moving from one to the other unless they're moving in the city. So that's the reason the Bible is so silent.

The development of the church hasn't gotten to the point yet where there are this unbelievable multiplicity of local churches to choose from in any locale. So the way I think we go about answering the question is by asking what the church is so that you can test, is the church being the church here, or is it defective to a degree that I should go to another one?

And the four things that I would mark as defining what the church is, number one, it's leaders, elders, pastors, whatever that church calls them, New Testament calls them elders or overseers or pastors. They minister the word of God fully and faithfully. Number two, they minister the Lord's Supper and baptism.

And number three, they exercise church discipline, excluding from membership, those who walk in a way that contradicts the gospel or brings reproach upon the Lord. And four, they love each other and they love the community and they're seeking to win the lost and reach the nation's mission of the church, in other words.

So any one of those four could be missing and serious and therefore lead a person to consider looking for another church. The problem is, and I'm sure that's why we've gotten all these emails, is that it's just never that black and white. Here's a church with only three of its four traits, I'm leaving.

It's just never ever that easy, especially when it comes to the doctrine of the church and the ministry of preaching. So preaching can be defective in lots of ways. It can be unclear, it can be disorganized, it can be incomplete, it can be imbalanced, it can be unfaithful to the text, it can be shallow, it can be mingled with too much self and on and on and on.

It's just never nice, clear, black and white, oh bad, I have a warrant to leave. It's not that crystal clear. So as I've tried to think of something helpful to say to people that have asked me this lots of times over the years, here's what I've come up with.

When the weaknesses or the errors or the sins of the preacher or the preaching and the teaching reach a kind of combined extent, in other words, all those different ways of possible defects they combine to the extent that mature Christians that you consult, not worldly ones, but mature brothers and sisters that you consult with think your faith and obedience would be damaged if you stayed and your usefulness there doesn't outweigh the pitfalls, you're free to go.

And I wanna say free to go to a church. You're not free to go nowhere. Not being in a church is not a New Testament option. To belong to Christ is to belong to a body of believers, defective or perfect, there aren't any perfect ones. And so if there's no church, I mean, if you're living in a little town and you go into a church and you feel like they've left the gospel, what do you do?

Well, you don't say church doesn't matter. You seek out a few other believers and you do your best to gather as a church, win other people to Christ, seek the blessing from a distance of the churches that you know, but you never leave hastily. You never leave without serious prayer or consulting with other believers, mature spiritual believers.

You never leave without talking to the leaders about why you're considering leaving and taking your time and praying about it with them. And you always strive for peace, even when you must go. - Very good, thank you, Pastor John. And thank you for listening to this podcast. Email your questions to us at askpastorjohn@desiringgod.org.

You can visit us online at desiringgod.org to find thousands of books and articles, sermons, and other resources from John Piper, all free of charge. I'm your host, Tony Reinke, thanks for listening. (upbeat music) (upbeat music)